[Speaker 1] (1:47 - 1:47)
yeah it's nice.

[Speaker 2] (1:48 - 1:48)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (1:48 - 1:48)
It's really

[Speaker 2] (1:48 - 1:48)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (1:48 - 1:49)
I was also

[Speaker 4] (1:49 - 1:49)
Let's check

[Speaker 1] (1:49 - 1:49)
going

[Speaker 4] (1:49 - 1:49)
your to wellness,

[Speaker 1] (1:49 - 1:50)
say that. Oh,

[Speaker 4] (1:50 - 1:50)
fine.

[Speaker 1] (1:50 - 1:50)
good.

[Speaker 4] (1:50 - 1:51)
Wellness day.

[Speaker 3] (1:51 - 1:51)
Yeah, right.

[Speaker 4] (1:51 - 1:52)
Thank you very much.

[Speaker 3] (1:52 - 2:00)
Okay. Good evening everyone. We will begin uh it's November nineteenth. Please rise. Oh, we're being recorded. Please rise for the Pledge of Allegiance.

[Speaker 3] (2:03 - 2:04)
I pledge allegiance to the flag

[Speaker 2] (2:04 - 2:05)
Flag of

[Speaker 3] (2:05 - 2:05)
of the United

[Speaker 2] (2:05 - 2:05)
the United

[Speaker 3] (2:05 - 2:05)
States

[Speaker 2] (2:05 - 2:06)
States

[Speaker 3] (2:06 - 2:09)
of America and to the republic for which it stands,

[Speaker 2] (2:09 - 2:09)
One nation,

[Speaker 3] (2:09 - 2:14)
one nation under god, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

[Speaker 3] (2:16 - 2:16)
OK.

[Speaker 5] (2:17 - 2:18)
Alright.

[Speaker 3] (2:19 - 2:21)
We will begin this evening with the town administrator's report.

[Speaker 5] (2:22 - 2:42)
Good evening. Thank you. Uh first um on the grant front we have some exciting news. We were awarded a seven hundred fifty thousand dollar grant uh in support of the work that needs to be done to prepare for the Pri- Pine Street Project um as it relates to the relocation of infrastructure. It was one of the uh projects that we were hoping to get funding for.

[Speaker 5] (2:42 - 2:49)
Um the preparations for town meeting have been continuing. Uh we'll be talking in more detail about it tonight towards the end of the agenda with you all.

[Speaker 5] (2:49 - 2:51)
Um but the warrant was mailed out last Thursday.

[Speaker 5] (2:51 - 2:54)
I'm also gonna be with FinCom tomorrow evening,

[Speaker 5] (2:54 - 2:58)
um hopefully to answer some questions uh as well as for tonight's discussion here.

[Speaker 5] (2:59 - 3:07)
Um I mentioned last week um at our meeting on the capital programme uh that we've been going through all the departmental capital requests.

[Speaker 5] (3:08 - 3:15)
We are going to be moving forward with that plan and we'll be coming before you all in the future or else we'll be working closely with Ryan Hale and the CIC on that.

[Speaker 5] (3:16 - 3:18)
As a follow-up on the capital planning meeting,

[Speaker 5] (3:19 - 3:23)
I appreciate the thoughtfulness about the preparations and the presentations of the staff and the questions.

[Speaker 5] (3:24 - 3:39)
I thought it was a good stepping off point for us to begin the process of having these sort of quarterly discussions and I also wanted to recognize there's on the staff side at least a lot of opportunities that we have for improvement so we're looking forward to how we can make future meetings even more successful.

[Speaker 5] (3:41 - 3:51)
Getting into the departments a little bit, I wanted to highlight the effort of the DPW team all over town, but specifically the Laxwall installation that has occurred and the efforts to prepare fishermen's beach for the winter.

[Speaker 5] (3:52 - 3:58)
In addition, I have a little bit of news on the DPW front after a lot of deliberation, a lot of discussion.

[Speaker 5] (4:00 - 4:04)
We are going to be able to offer ten additional spots for coat storage at Philips for this winter.

[Speaker 5] (4:05 - 4:16)
In addition to that, so the folks that are sort of next on the list for the lottery will be notified and will go down in order for we understand some folks may have already made other accommodations,

[Speaker 5] (4:17 - 4:22)
but we will, you know, in future years be able to offer I believe it's 20 total and that's what we plan to be doing.

[Speaker 5] (4:22 - 4:25)
In addition to that, we're going to look

[Speaker 5] (4:25 - 4:31)
To do a little bit of a market survey to make sure that our fees remain both affordable and competitive for next fall.

[Speaker 5] (4:31 - 4:32)
They won't be changing now,

[Speaker 5] (4:32 - 4:38)
but we want to just take a look at what other municipalities in addition to private storage is doing as well.

[Speaker 5] (4:38 - 4:40)
Just as sort of a survey over time,

[Speaker 5] (4:40 - 4:42)
we haven't looked at that in quite a while.

[Speaker 5] (4:42 - 4:50)
The senior center has been really busy lately as well. They were part of a video that was highlighting the intergenerational program they do with the high school this week.

[Speaker 5] (4:50 - 4:57)
And they've been continuing to offer a program that has the building absolutely buzzing every day, so I wanted to recognize that.

[Speaker 5] (4:57 - 5:02)
They were also kind enough to host the Veterans Breakfast last week, which was also quite successful.

[Speaker 5] (5:03 - 5:05)
And the rec department front,

[Speaker 5] (5:05 - 5:11)
Charlotte has jumped in with both feet on the space at the Clark. We began programming this week, and we're looking forward to a busy winter.

[Speaker 5] (5:11 - 5:12)
In addition,

[Speaker 5] (5:12 - 5:13)
over the last week or so,

[Speaker 5] (5:14 - 5:16)
I believe the FBI has been using it for training.

[Speaker 5] (5:16 - 5:21)
So it has been a busy spot from something that was maybe underutilized before,

[Speaker 5] (5:21 - 5:23)
and we're looking forward to that continuing.

[Speaker 5] (5:26 - 5:37)
Also with Wreck I wanted to give a plug for the indoor Thanksgiving Farmers Market which is this Sunday here at the high school from ten to one. Um and then sort of a placeholder of market calendars for the holiday parade and marketplace which will be at town hall on 13th.

[Speaker 5] (5:40 - 5:42)
Quick update on the HR front.

[Speaker 5] (5:42 - 5:47)
We've had qualified candidates who've begun the interview process, both for Finance Director and Town Clerk.

[Speaker 5] (5:48 - 5:53)
We're having phone screens, then first round. We will decide after the first round if folks will be progressing from there,

[Speaker 5] (5:53 - 5:57)
but we've gotten a couple of good candidates in both positions.

[Speaker 5] (5:57 - 6:00)
We also completed the salary survey for the assessor position,

[Speaker 5] (6:00 - 6:03)
which I had mentioned at our last meeting,

[Speaker 5] (6:03 - 6:06)
I believe. And looking at the peers and super peers,

[Speaker 5] (6:06 - 6:07)
we are

[Speaker 5] (6:07 - 6:11)
are somewhere between 22 and 25 percent behind the market.

[Speaker 5] (6:12 - 6:25)
So you know I'm not sure if you would like me to come back with a slide or two that shows that or if we can if this can be something I can work with HR to to reclassify and make sure with Patrick that it's built into future budgets and then we can handle it for the rest of this year.

[Speaker 5] (6:26 - 6:32)
That's one thing that I didn't know if it would prompt any discussion or if you're comfortable with me moving forward that would be absolutely wonderful.

[Speaker 5] (6:34 - 6:40)
Um, anyone have any questions? That is that is the the T_A_ report. I'm happy to answer any questions folks may have.

[Speaker 5] (6:41 - 6:48)
Um and later tonight of all obviously I have more information on the budget projections as well as uh participating in the discussion with you all for the warrant.

[Speaker 3] (6:50 - 6:55)
I can't recall if this is uh before Nick or during your

[Speaker 5] (6:55 - 6:55)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 3] (6:55 - 6:58)
tenure, but I think we all were supportive of a

[Speaker 3] (6:59 - 7:02)
full-time assessor with a market rate adjustment. I mean we've spoken about it,

[Speaker 6] (7:02 - 7:02)
Uh-huh.

[Speaker 3] (7:02 - 7:03)
so

[Speaker 7] (7:03 - 7:03)
Yes.

[Speaker 6] (7:03 - 7:04)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 3] (7:04 - 7:04)
I don't think

[Speaker 5] (7:04 - 7:04)
I think

[Speaker 3] (7:04 - 7:04)
it's an

[Speaker 5] (7:04 - 7:06)
that is before, so I appreciate that,

[Speaker 3] (7:06 - 7:06)
we

[Speaker 5] (7:06 - 7:06)
and I

[Speaker 3] (7:06 - 7:06)
are yeah.

[Speaker 5] (7:06 - 7:12)
definitely wanted to give you a sense of what that looked like before we made any changes, so I appreciate that, and we'll move forward with it.

[Speaker 6] (7:12 - 7:21)
I just want to make sure the comparisons are equal. It's not we're not comparis comparing a thirty four hour work week to a forty hour work week or thirty eight hour work week. It's

[Speaker 6] (7:21 - 7:22)
Just to make sure

[Speaker 5] (7:22 - 7:27)
To be honest I w I was going off the assumption they were all thirty seven, because that's what most of the times that I have worked with

[Speaker 6] (7:27 - 7:28)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 5] (7:28 - 7:29)
so I can double check that.

[Speaker 6] (7:29 - 7:29)
Okay.

[Speaker 5] (7:29 - 7:47)
Uh and the, the other outlier, if you were to call through the towns that are identified regularly as our peers, I just wanna call it out, is Linfield, their assessor is the chief assessor in three different communities and is richly compensated for that work. So that is not one that we are including in this in this survey

[Speaker 6] (7:47 - 7:47)
Where?

[Speaker 5] (7:47 - 7:48)
for that matter.

[Speaker 6] (7:49 - 7:49)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 5] (7:49 - 7:52)
But I'll make sure to normalize that information as well.

[Speaker 3] (7:53 - 7:54)
Great.

[Speaker 3] (7:56 - 7:57)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (7:57 - 8:01)
Anybody have any questions, comments, concerns to raise?

[Speaker 5] (8:03 - 8:03)
That's fine.

[Speaker 3] (8:04 - 8:04)
Thank you.

[Speaker 3] (8:05 - 8:09)
All right. Moving on. The next agenda item is public comments.

[Speaker 3] (8:09 - 8:17)
We'll welcome anyone to the microphone for a public comment. Please state your name and your address and we will limit public comment to three minutes per participant,

[Speaker 3] (8:17 - 8:17)
please.

[Speaker 8] (8:25 - 8:25)
Hello,

[Speaker 9] (8:25 - 8:27)
This work? Hello? Can you hear me? Okay.

[Speaker 3] (8:27 - 8:27)
Okay.

[Speaker 9] (8:28 - 8:31)
Hi, Mike Kelleher, Pine Hill Road, Swampscott.

[Speaker 9] (8:32 - 8:44)
Good evening. I'm really excited for the opportunity to speak to you tonight. I'm here to express the interest I watched the last meeting and the interest and excitement in submitting an RFP for the Hawthorne property.

[Speaker 9] (8:44 - 8:49)
My hope is to bring forward a concept that turns this space into a true community gem,

[Speaker 9] (8:49 - 8:56)
something that residents and visitors can enjoy while the town works through the long-term planning and funding needed for the site's future.

[Speaker 9] (8:56 - 8:56)
Sure.

[Speaker 9] (8:56 - 8:59)
We have an incredible waterfront location. With some elbow grease,

[Speaker 9] (9:00 - 9:04)
creativity and grit, the Hawthorne can come back to life as a vibrant destination,

[Speaker 9] (9:04 - 9:05)
one that offers food,

[Speaker 9] (9:05 - 9:06)
entertainment,

[Speaker 9] (9:06 - 9:07)
family friendly events,

[Speaker 9] (9:08 - 9:08)
concerts,

[Speaker 9] (9:09 - 9:10)
flexible community space.

[Speaker 9] (9:11 - 9:17)
This is a chance to show our residents what could be if Swampscott embraces a lively activated waterfront.

[Speaker 9] (9:17 - 9:23)
I also want to address the recommendation from the Hawthorne Reuse Committee to raise the building immediately.

[Speaker 9] (9:23 - 9:25)
I believe that step would be premature.

[Speaker 9] (9:26 - 9:37)
Replacing the building with a fenced-off crater at the entrance to our beloved town potentially for three years or more would be short-sighted, it would create unnecessary blight on one of our most visible pieces of property,

[Speaker 9] (9:37 - 9:41)
and it would remove the opportunity for the community to use and enjoy the space in the meantime.

[Speaker 9] (9:42 - 9:45)
A short-term activation is the smart and responsible path.

[Speaker 9] (9:45 - 9:53)
It keeps the property vibrant instead of dormant. It allows the town the breathing room it needs to thoughtfully plan and fund whatever permanent vision comes next.

[Speaker 9] (9:53 - 9:54)
And most importantly,

[Speaker 9] (9:55 - 9:59)
it gives our residents and visitors a positive, engaging experience on our waterfront.

[Speaker 1] (10:01 - 10:27)
I don't want to get into too many specifics of my proposal I look forward to presenting if it comes to fruition until the RFP is formally presented but I can say this I truly believe this interim solution can add value energy and pride to our town it avoid it avoids unnecessary blight it generates excitement instead of stagnation and it lets us make the most of one of Swampscott's most iconic locations while long-term decision are made thank you for your considerations

[Speaker 2] (10:28 - 10:28)
Thank you.

[Speaker 3] (10:31 - 10:32)
You have the metric too.

[Speaker 2] (10:32 - 10:33)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (10:33 - 10:33)
Shall do it.

[Speaker 2] (10:33 - 10:34)
We have one more in

[Speaker 4] (10:37 - 10:46)
Hello Joe Droulet, Elwood Road Swampscott. Among other things I'm the director of the Blue Big Band which is Swampscott's community jazz orchestra.

[Speaker 4] (10:47 - 10:58)
It's a programme of the Senior Centre and our holiday concert. We are doing Duke Ellington's Nutcracker Suite on December fourteenth at two p.m. And who cares if it's right when the Patriots are playing the bill playing the bills, right?

[Speaker 4] (10:58 - 11:00)
Come watch some w come watch some Ellington.

[Speaker 4] (11:01 - 11:03)
Uh the members are community members,

[Speaker 4] (11:03 - 11:12)
uh we got fourteen members now. It's a fantastic programme. It's a short programme, you'll be in and out of there in an hour. Um but just come supported, it's ten dollars free for youth and seniors.

[Speaker 4] (11:12 - 11:15)
And if you want more info go to bluebigband dot com.

[Speaker 4] (11:15 - 11:18)
Thank you. And there's cards in the back if you want to grab one.

[Speaker 5] (11:18 - 11:19)
Great.

[Speaker 6] (11:19 - 11:20)
Thank you. Joe.

[Speaker 5] (11:20 - 11:20)
Nice card.

[Speaker 6] (11:21 - 11:21)
Very fun.

[Speaker 6] (11:23 - 11:26)
Um Diane, if you would allow Mr.

[Speaker 6] (11:26 - 11:27)
Demento to speak please.

[Speaker 7] (11:37 - 11:38)
Very good. Thank you.

[Speaker 6] (11:41 - 11:41)
Go ahead.

[Speaker 7] (11:41 - 11:45)
I'd like to address the issue of the hop-on,

[Speaker 7] (11:45 - 11:47)
by-the-seat situation.

[Speaker 7] (11:47 - 11:50)
This has now gone on three years.

[Speaker 7] (11:50 - 11:54)
We can't wait and have a six-year process to get this done.

[Speaker 7] (11:55 - 11:56)
Somewhere or another,

[Speaker 7] (11:56 - 12:08)
I believe this board has to find a way to greatly accelerate the process. And what this last speaker that went before me said is exactly what I fear.

[Speaker 7] (12:08 - 12:12)
Everyone, who wouldn't want to rent a space for $2,000 a month?

[Speaker 7] (12:13 - 12:20)
We've gotten $2,000 a month for three years and that's it from the operation of that restaurant.

[Speaker 7] (12:20 - 12:25)
We can't afford to fool around with this anymore with the tax situation in this town.

[Speaker 7] (12:25 - 12:35)
We're facing an increase in taxes. We know it. We know we're going to lose some of that tax money this year because the town just can't meet its budget.

[Speaker 7] (12:36 - 12:40)
I can't urge you enough to move quickly,

[Speaker 7] (12:40 - 12:42)
adroitly.

[Speaker 7] (12:42 - 12:45)
You've had a study committee, you've had two,

[Speaker 7] (12:45 - 12:50)
and finally you have a recommendation before you,

[Speaker 7] (12:50 - 12:55)
and I just don't think you can postpone, postpone. It's very bad for the town,

[Speaker 7] (12:55 - 12:57)
and I beg you,

[Speaker 7] (12:57 - 13:02)
do not put this off any longer. Get it done.

[Speaker 7] (13:03 - 13:04)
Thank you.

[Speaker 6] (13:05 - 13:07)
Thank you, Mr. Demento.

[Speaker 6] (13:10 - 13:11)
Anybody else?

[Speaker 6] (13:13 - 13:18)
Okay, seeing no additional public comment, we will move on to new and old business.

[Speaker 6] (13:24 - 13:25)
Still open the public hearing.

[Speaker 8] (13:26 - 13:29)
I believe that we can. I think everyone is here,

[Speaker 6] (13:29 - 13:29)
Everyone's

[Speaker 8] (13:29 - 13:29)
the participating.

[Speaker 6] (13:29 - 13:29)
here?

[Speaker 6] (13:30 - 13:31)
Okay.

[Speaker 6] (13:30 - 13:31)
Okay.

[Speaker 6] (13:31 - 13:50)
So we will, I will entertain a motion to open the public hearing for discussion and possible vote to consider the approval of the transfer of ownership of an existing Section 15 off-premises all alcohol license from Casa Ball LLC at 646 Humphrey Street,

[Speaker 6] (13:50 - 13:52)
Unit D, Swampscott to,

[Speaker 6] (13:52 - 13:55)
I am going to butcher the pronunciation of this.

[Speaker 6] (13:56 - 13:56)
Again,

[Speaker 8] (13:56 - 13:58)
It's called Gananath.

[Speaker 6] (13:58 - 13:58)
Ganenanth

[Speaker 8] (13:58 - 13:58)
Yes.

[Speaker 6] (13:58 - 13:59)
Corporation.

[Speaker 9] (14:01 - 14:02)
Second.

[Speaker 6] (14:03 - 14:07)
Doug is online, so we will have to vote roll call.

[Speaker 6] (14:07 - 14:08)
So Mary Ellen?

[Speaker 9] (14:08 - 14:09)
Aye.

[Speaker 6] (14:09 - 14:10)
Okay, Doug?

[Speaker 7] (14:12 - 14:13)
Hi.

[Speaker 6] (14:13 - 14:14)
I am an aye,

[Speaker 6] (14:14 - 14:16)
and you've all made the motion and seconded.

[Speaker 6] (14:16 - 14:17)
So we,

[Speaker 6] (14:17 - 14:19)
the public hearing is now open.

[Speaker 6] (14:21 - 14:22)
Where shall we start?

[Speaker 6] (14:24 - 14:24)
Go ahead.

[Speaker 6] (14:25 - 14:31)
Hi, my name is Alex Bourgeois. I work at DeMarcus Law Office in Lynn and I am representing the applicant.

[Speaker 6] (14:32 - 14:35)
Also here on behalf of the applicant is Needabin J.

[Speaker 6] (14:35 - 14:36)
Patel,

[Speaker 6] (14:36 - 14:38)
who's a proposed manager of record on the license,

[Speaker 6] (14:39 - 14:40)
35% shareholder,

[Speaker 6] (14:40 - 14:42)
president and treasurer of the corporation,

[Speaker 6] (14:42 - 14:50)
and Samir Kumar Patel, who's the 65% shareholder and secretary and director of the corporation.

[Speaker 6] (14:50 - 14:54)
The applicant is purchasing all of the assets, including the liquor license.

[Speaker 6] (14:54 - 15:03)
License of Castleball LLC doing business as Swampscott Liquors already said located at 646 Humphrey Street unit D in Swampscott.

[Speaker 6] (15:03 - 15:09)
The applicant is going to continue operating the business as it's currently operated. Same name,

[Speaker 6] (15:09 - 15:10)
location,

[Speaker 6] (15:10 - 15:10)
products.

[Speaker 6] (15:11 - 15:17)
The only thing we are requesting to be changed is the permitted hours of business.

[Speaker 6] (15:17 - 15:22)
We're looking to get the full hours permitted by the ABCC which would be

[Speaker 6] (15:22 - 15:34)
Monday through Saturday 8 through 11 and then Sundays 10 to 11 currently what's allowed is 9 to 10 on Monday through Saturday and Sundays 10 to 6

[Speaker 6] (15:36 - 15:39)
Yirabunji Patel, the proposed manager of record,

[Speaker 6] (15:39 - 15:42)
has experience working in this type of store since 2021.

[Speaker 6] (15:43 - 15:46)
She's a valid work permit. She's never had a violation.

[Speaker 6] (15:46 - 15:50)
She's familiar with the ID scanners and ID laws.

[Speaker 6] (15:50 - 15:52)
They will be using ID scanners in the store.

[Speaker 6] (15:52 - 16:01)
She is TIP certified and Samir Kumar Patel successfully runs another liquor store in Newburyport.

[Speaker 6] (16:02 - 16:06)
and is also familiar with ID law scanners as well.

[Speaker 6] (16:06 - 16:09)
So we are seeking approval of the license transfer,

[Speaker 6] (16:09 - 16:12)
approval of Nita Bin Patel as manager of record,

[Speaker 6] (16:12 - 16:14)
and approval of the change of hours.

[Speaker 6] (16:17 - 16:18)
Okay, thank you.

[Speaker 6] (16:23 - 16:27)
So for consideration for us this evening again it's a transfer of license,

[Speaker 6] (16:27 - 16:31)
it would be a change in hours and then a change in manager.

[Speaker 6] (16:32 - 16:32)
Correct.

[Speaker 6] (16:33 - 16:36)
Great. Does anybody have any questions for the applicants?

[Speaker 10] (16:37 - 16:40)
Is this the one we just did recently?

[Speaker 6] (16:40 - 16:45)
Yeah, I believe yep, you guys were just before us, right? Not you guys, but behind you.

[Speaker 10] (16:45 - 16:47)
This is just was this just opened up?

[Speaker 7] (16:49 - 16:49)
Yes.

[Speaker 10] (16:50 - 16:50)
Okay.

[Speaker 6] (16:57 - 16:58)
Anybody?

[Speaker 6] (16:59 - 17:00)
You have any additional questions, Riley?

[Speaker 10] (17:02 - 17:06)
No, I don't have any additional questions. I mean, the

[Speaker 6] (17:06 - 17:09)
From the town licensing perspective,

[Speaker 6] (17:09 - 17:12)
have there been any issues with the current applicant?

[Speaker 4] (17:12 - 17:13)
No.

[Speaker 6] (17:13 - 17:15)
I mean the current, sorry, the current license holder.

[Speaker 8] (17:15 - 17:16)
No, no issues,

[Speaker 8] (17:16 - 17:17)
no outstanding fees or debts.

[Speaker 6] (17:18 - 17:18)
Okay.

[Speaker 10] (17:19 - 17:24)
The only issues there have been are requests to change the signage because there's excessive signage.

[Speaker 11] (17:24 - 17:25)
The neon sign.

[Speaker 10] (17:25 - 17:28)
Neon signs and then signs covering the windows,

[Speaker 10] (17:28 - 17:30)
signs covering the ice cooler,

[Speaker 10] (17:30 - 17:31)
but those were all.

[Speaker 10] (17:32 - 17:33)
changed as soon as it was addressed.

[Speaker 6] (17:35 - 17:35)
Okay.

[Speaker 6] (17:38 - 17:38)
Great.

[Speaker 6] (17:40 - 17:50)
So if there are no additional questions, then I'll entertain a motion to approve the change of transfer of ownership,

[Speaker 6] (17:50 - 17:54)
the change in hours, and the change in manager.

[Speaker 10] (17:55 - 17:58)
I do. I want what are the hours that we have in other liquor stores?

[Speaker 10] (18:00 - 18:06)
Like I'm not really I mean we did have resident we had residents that were commenting that were really against this last time.

[Speaker 10] (18:07 - 18:16)
Um it now it's changing hands within a few months. I'm really not I don't think I'm really feeling great about extending the hours.

[Speaker 6] (18:17 - 18:21)
Was it where was their residence commenting against this or was it

[Speaker 10] (18:21 - 18:21)
Yes.

[Speaker 6] (18:21 - 18:21)
the restaurant?

[Speaker 8] (18:21 - 18:22)
There were residents.

[Speaker 10] (18:22 - 18:24)
No, it was

[Speaker 8] (18:24 - 18:26)
There were residents that were talking about the

[Speaker 10] (18:27 - 18:27)
True.

[Speaker 6] (18:27 - 18:27)
Oh,

[Speaker 8] (18:27 - 18:27)
And

[Speaker 6] (18:27 - 18:28)
okay.

[Speaker 8] (18:28 - 18:28)
relating

[Speaker 6] (18:28 - 18:31)
I wasn't sure if that was related to the restaurant in that

[Speaker 8] (18:31 - 18:31)
to

[Speaker 6] (18:31 - 18:31)
plaza.

[Speaker 8] (18:31 - 18:32)
the building.

[Speaker 10] (18:32 - 18:36)
And, and selling liquor so close to the park, that, you know.

[Speaker 10] (18:37 - 18:46)
So what i in the other question I have is do we, does, is this supposed to come in front of us twice or no?

[Speaker 8] (18:47 - 18:48)
Because of the

[Speaker 8] (18:49 - 18:50)
Changing hours, is that what you're asking?

[Speaker 6] (18:50 - 18:52)
No, because of the policy that

[Speaker 10] (18:52 - 18:54)
Our policy is generally something comes in front of us twice.

[Speaker 8] (18:54 - 18:55)
Okay.

[Speaker 6] (18:55 - 18:57)
once to review, then once to

[Speaker 10] (18:57 - 18:57)
Right.

[Speaker 6] (18:57 - 18:57)
approve.

[Speaker 6] (18:59 - 19:04)
I mean, I think if there were direction for the applicants,

[Speaker 6] (19:05 - 19:07)
that is probably helpful.

[Speaker 6] (19:07 - 19:13)
So if it is, you know, today we are interested in not having an issue with transferring the license.

[Speaker 6] (19:14 - 19:19)
But we have an issue with the hours and we have to come back and have a conversation about the hours or

[Speaker 10] (19:21 - 19:26)
Were residents sent letters about this change in ownership?

[Speaker 10] (19:26 - 19:29)
Like did residents have an opportunity to come down?

[Speaker 12] (19:30 - 19:39)
We did publish an ad in the local paper 10 days before the hearing and told them they could attend the hearing for the transfer.

[Speaker 6] (19:43 - 19:43)
Which is why they're

[Speaker 10] (19:43 - 19:44)
And

[Speaker 6] (19:44 - 19:44)
afraid

[Speaker 10] (19:44 - 19:44)
which to is do what

[Speaker 6] (19:44 - 19:44)
it. Like

[Speaker 10] (19:44 - 19:44)
they

[Speaker 6] (19:44 - 19:44)
they were afraid

[Speaker 10] (19:44 - 19:44)
plan

[Speaker 6] (19:44 - 19:45)
by the

[Speaker 10] (19:45 - 19:45)
to

[Speaker 6] (19:45 - 19:45)
eighty?

[Speaker 10] (19:45 - 19:45)
do under the law.

[Speaker 6] (19:45 - 19:46)
Right. Right.

[Speaker 13] (19:47 - 19:52)
I will say, you know, the only thing that does give me pause is being open till 11.

[Speaker 13] (19:52 - 19:55)
Nothing is really open till 11 in this.

[Speaker 2] (19:55 - 19:55)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (19:55 - 20:14)
Um so that does give me a little bit of a pause but but you know I I certainly understand the the interest in wanting to do that. I'm really curious about um the change in the manager of record. Is that was that just a administrative decision or because you guys were just here right I mean it was

[Speaker 2] (20:14 - 20:15)
Well

[Speaker 3] (20:15 - 20:20)
So I think because of the change in ownership of the entity that's going to be holding the liquor license,

[Speaker 3] (20:20 - 20:23)
the manager is changing. So often like

[Speaker 1] (20:23 - 20:28)
Right. I just wonder why it was done so soon after starting out. If there was anything you wanted to volunteer about why.

[Speaker 4] (20:29 - 20:39)
Well, the s the seller is selling the business. So with the new with the new uh business coming in, they have their own manager and their own employees that they're gonna be using at the store.

[Speaker 1] (20:39 - 20:42)
Right. It it was just very quick, right? So

[Speaker 1] (20:43 - 20:47)
They just opened not even a year ago, I think. So it just seems like it was a quick change.

[Speaker 4] (20:48 - 20:50)
Oh, I'm not sure about that business decision.

[Speaker 1] (20:51 - 20:51)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (20:53 - 20:53)
Okay.

[Speaker 5] (20:53 - 20:56)
Can you should you come to the microphone if you're gonna speak?

[Speaker 6] (20:59 - 21:05)
I can answer the question for that. I have a family situation that elderly have to be taken care,

[Speaker 6] (21:05 - 21:09)
which is um that's why I took myself off to take care of the elderly.

[Speaker 6] (21:10 - 21:10)
Karen,

[Speaker 1] (21:11 - 21:12)
Okay. Thank you for that.

[Speaker 3] (21:12 - 21:13)
Thank you.

[Speaker 1] (21:13 - 21:13)
Thank you for that.

[Speaker 6] (21:13 - 21:13)
You're welcome.

[Speaker 3] (21:13 - 21:14)
Appreciate the insights.

[Speaker 4] (21:14 - 21:17)
And if I could just add one more thing about the hours,

[Speaker 4] (21:18 - 21:20)
the hours wouldn't be changing very much.

[Speaker 4] (21:21 - 21:23)
The hours Monday through Saturday,

[Speaker 4] (21:23 - 21:35)
we're just looking to open one hour earlier and stay open one hour later on Monday through Saturday. And then on Sundays, we would just be open for a few extra hours.

[Speaker 4] (21:35 - 21:38)
And I don't think the applicants plan on always being open all of those hours.

[Speaker 4] (21:38 - 21:41)
hours. I think with holidays, deliveries,

[Speaker 4] (21:41 - 21:52)
different things like that, they like having the choice in just the most hours possible approved on their license and then being able to make the business decisions, but it wouldn't be a drastic change in the hours, if that helps.

[Speaker 1] (21:52 - 21:54)
Okay, thank you. That does help.

[Speaker 1] (21:55 - 21:56)
I don't have anything else.

[Speaker 7] (21:56 - 22:04)
So I would be inclined to say yes without the change in hours. I would rather get through a year and then readdress hours at that time.

[Speaker 7] (22:06 - 22:08)
That's my feelings

[Speaker 1] (22:08 - 22:08)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (22:08 - 22:09)
on that.

[Speaker 3] (22:09 - 22:10)
Since this is a public hearing,

[Speaker 3] (22:10 - 22:13)
we obviously need to entertain questions from the public too.

[Speaker 3] (22:13 - 22:16)
So it looks like Mr. Demento's hand is up. So if you would authorize

[Speaker 7] (22:16 - 22:17)
You want to put it down?

[Speaker 3] (22:18 - 22:19)
unless it's up from prior.

[Speaker 1] (22:25 - 22:27)
Billy, you should be able to talk.

[Speaker 8] (22:29 - 22:30)
Thank you.

[Speaker 8] (22:32 - 22:34)
My question is

[Speaker 8] (22:36 - 23:02)
I have no issue with the transfer of ownership or any of that and I understand anyone has the right to sell but strange where the neighbors were so vocal at both the zoning board and the initial hearing that they're not there tonight and I'm wondering if the statute requires them to be noticed by by a letter by mail

[Speaker 8] (23:03 - 23:29)
as to this and I'd be a little reluctant to approve any hour changes unless you're absolutely sure the procedures were followed correctly and what's the harm in waiting and finding out if the neighbors were properly notified it's a little strange they were pretty vocal relative to hours and what's going on so I just

[Speaker 8] (23:30 - 23:33)
Speak out in caution that there's no real hurry,

[Speaker 8] (23:33 - 23:37)
and I think you should check it out as to the hours

[Speaker 8] (23:37 - 23:38)
Thank you

[Speaker 3] (23:39 - 23:40)
Thank you, Mr.

[Speaker 3] (23:40 - 23:40)
Demento.

[Speaker 3] (23:44 - 23:55)
I don't believe there's a requirement under the ABCC that they be mailed notification within any sort of radius for these changes.

[Speaker 3] (23:57 - 23:59)
I don't think we've ever done that prior,

[Speaker 3] (24:00 - 24:02)
so that would be something new.

[Speaker 3] (24:03 - 24:03)
Doug,

[Speaker 3] (24:03 - 24:04)
did you have a comment?

[Speaker 8] (24:05 - 24:08)
Yeah, that does seem like a combination of what Mr.

[Speaker 8] (24:08 - 24:25)
DeMentza said and what Mariella said that it would be reasonable to make sure unless there's someone there that I can't see that can speak to exactly who got what notice if it was just put in a local newspaper. I think we all know that that's probably not necessarily reaching that many people.

[Speaker 8] (24:27 - 24:32)
So I'd be interested to know definitively if there are any other requirements,

[Speaker 8] (24:33 - 24:45)
but even if there aren't requirements that, you know, that liquor store is situated very much in a neighborhood and it would be good to ensure that people are very much aware of what's happening.

[Speaker 3] (24:47 - 24:53)
Yeah, I don't argue the conclusion, just the supposition that they have to go forward with any additional...

[Speaker 3] (24:55 - 24:55)
Um

[Speaker 3] (24:56 - 25:14)
conditions under the ABCC. I agree that we can certainly table the hours piece and we can approve the transfer and we could, this is always something that they could come forward to again after a little bit more understanding on our side or upon renewal I think you guys can also request a change of hours,

[Speaker 3] (25:14 - 25:15)
which

[Speaker 5] (25:15 - 25:17)
Which is going to happen at our next meeting

[Speaker 3] (25:17 - 25:17)
was just

[Speaker 5] (25:17 - 25:17)
anyway.

[Speaker 3] (25:17 - 25:17)
yeah,

[Speaker 7] (25:17 - 25:18)
Right.

[Speaker 3] (25:18 - 25:19)
just around the corner.

[Speaker 7] (25:20 - 25:21)
And it helps everybody.

[Speaker 5] (25:21 - 25:24)
Yeah, so let's, so I'm happy to make a motion to

[Speaker 5] (25:24 - 25:28)
to approve the transfer of ownership and we'll table the hours discussion

[Speaker 3] (25:28 - 25:28)
and the change

[Speaker 5] (25:28 - 25:28)
to

[Speaker 3] (25:28 - 25:29)
of manager.

[Speaker 5] (25:29 - 25:30)
change a manager until,

[Speaker 5] (25:30 - 25:30)
yeah.

[Speaker 3] (25:31 - 25:44)
Okay, so the motion on the table right now is to approve the transfer and the manager change and to not to approve the hours right now to sort of see how it all settles. And do I have a second?

[Speaker 1] (25:44 - 25:44)
Second.

[Speaker 3] (25:45 - 25:45)
Okay,

[Speaker 3] (25:45 - 25:48)
and because we are again remote,

[Speaker 3] (25:48 - 25:49)
Doug,

[Speaker 3] (25:49 - 25:50)
do you want to go ahead and?

[Speaker 3] (25:51 - 25:52)
Yeah, but that's

[Speaker 8] (25:52 - 25:52)
All

[Speaker 3] (25:52 - 25:52)
fine.

[Speaker 8] (25:52 - 25:52)
right.

[Speaker 3] (25:52 - 25:53)
Hi,

[Speaker 3] (25:53 - 25:53)
Marianne,

[Speaker 7] (25:53 - 25:53)
Hi.

[Speaker 3] (25:53 - 25:54)
and I am also an I.

[Speaker 3] (25:55 - 25:58)
You guys are I's also,

[Speaker 3] (25:58 - 25:59)
just to be clear?

[Speaker 5] (25:59 - 25:59)
I.

[Speaker 3] (25:59 - 25:59)
Danielle?

[Speaker 7] (26:00 - 26:00)
Hi.

[Speaker 3] (26:00 - 26:01)
Okay, great.

[Speaker 3] (26:02 - 26:06)
So we have just approved the transfer,

[Speaker 3] (26:06 - 26:08)
thank you, and the change of management,

[Speaker 3] (26:08 - 26:11)
then next step will be, I think it goes forward to the ABCC,

[Speaker 3] (26:11 - 26:16)
and then we'd be happy to consider the hours at another time, but not tonight.

[Speaker 3] (26:17 - 26:18)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (26:18 - 26:18)
Thank you.

[Speaker 3] (26:18 - 26:18)
Thank

[Speaker 7] (26:18 - 26:18)
Thank

[Speaker 3] (26:18 - 26:18)
you

[Speaker 7] (26:18 - 26:18)
you,

[Speaker 3] (26:18 - 26:19)
very much.

[Speaker 7] (26:19 - 26:19)
Pat.

[Speaker 3] (26:19 - 26:24)
We have to close the um public hearing. So I'll take a motion to close the public hearing.

[Speaker 7] (26:24 - 26:25)
So moved.

[Speaker 5] (26:25 - 26:25)
Second.

[Speaker 6] (26:25 - 26:25)
Second.

[Speaker 3] (26:26 - 26:27)
Um

[Speaker 7] (26:27 - 26:27)
I.

[Speaker 3] (26:27 - 26:28)
I.

[Speaker 6] (26:29 - 26:29)
I.

[Speaker 7] (26:29 - 26:29)
I.

[Speaker 3] (26:29 - 26:29)
Doug.

[Speaker 6] (26:29 - 26:30)
Oh

[Speaker 8] (26:31 - 26:31)
Aye.

[Speaker 3] (26:31 - 26:33)
Okay, thank you. Thank you guys for

[Speaker 5] (26:33 - 26:33)
Thank

[Speaker 3] (26:33 - 26:33)
joining

[Speaker 5] (26:33 - 26:33)
you.

[Speaker 3] (26:33 - 26:34)
us.

[Speaker 5] (26:34 - 26:34)
Thank you.

[Speaker 3] (26:34 - 26:34)
And

[Speaker 5] (26:34 - 26:34)
Thank you

[Speaker 3] (26:34 - 26:34)
good

[Speaker 5] (26:34 - 26:34)
for

[Speaker 3] (26:34 - 26:34)
luck.

[Speaker 5] (26:34 - 26:35)
your time.

[Speaker 5] (26:35 - 26:35)
Thank you.

[Speaker 7] (26:36 - 26:43)
If I could just ask Nick if you wouldn't mind just seeing what the hours are for the rest of the liquor stores in town for the next when they come back.

[Speaker 6] (26:43 - 26:43)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 7] (26:43 - 26:45)
Just to see if they're similar,

[Speaker 7] (26:45 - 26:45)
so we know.

[Speaker 3] (26:47 - 26:48)
Are the liquor licenses,

[Speaker 3] (26:48 - 26:51)
will they be they will be on the next agenda

[Speaker 5] (26:51 - 26:51)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (26:51 - 26:51)
or the

[Speaker 7] (26:51 - 26:51)
Yeah,

[Speaker 3] (26:51 - 26:52)
next one

[Speaker 7] (26:52 - 26:52)
I think

[Speaker 3] (26:52 - 26:53)
of the next

[Speaker 7] (26:53 - 26:53)
so.

[Speaker 3] (26:53 - 26:53)
two agendas?

[Speaker 9] (26:53 - 26:59)
We have them on the draft for the third, but they couldn't speak the final meeting of

[Speaker 3] (26:59 - 26:59)
the Okay,

[Speaker 9] (26:59 - 26:59)
year.

[Speaker 3] (26:59 - 27:02)
so I think because we'd like probably to see them twice potentially,

[Speaker 9] (27:02 - 27:02)
It'll be a third,

[Speaker 3] (27:02 - 27:03)
we'll put

[Speaker 9] (27:03 - 27:03)
and

[Speaker 3] (27:03 - 27:03)
them

[Speaker 9] (27:03 - 27:03)
then

[Speaker 3] (27:03 - 27:05)
on the third and then

[Speaker 7] (27:05 - 27:10)
We also need an adjustment. Well, we need a wean needed adjustment on liquor

[Speaker 9] (27:10 - 27:10)
So

[Speaker 7] (27:10 - 27:10)
licenses

[Speaker 9] (27:10 - 27:11)
I'll talk like this and then catch

[Speaker 7] (27:11 - 27:12)
for the you holidays.

[Speaker 9] (27:12 - 27:13)
there? Okay.

[Speaker 3] (27:14 - 27:15)
Sorry, I'm distracted by what's

[Speaker 1] (27:15 - 27:15)
Yeah,

[Speaker 3] (27:15 - 27:16)
happening in the audience.

[Speaker 1] (27:16 - 27:21)
I'm sorry. They're talking about the one day liquor license, right, between and during his day?

[Speaker 9] (27:22 - 27:22)
No,

[Speaker 1] (27:22 - 27:22)
Oh,

[Speaker 9] (27:22 - 27:22)
I don't remember.

[Speaker 3] (27:22 - 27:23)
Oh, sorry, what are you talking about?

[Speaker 7] (27:23 - 27:39)
talking about the hours. There are there are restaurants that have liquor licenses where they have to adjust their hours for New Year's for Christmas Eve and New Year's Eve. In the past, we've made adjustments on specific days like those two days.

[Speaker 1] (27:40 - 27:41)
Correct. And mine's been away,

[Speaker 10] (27:41 - 27:42)
Huh.

[Speaker 1] (27:42 - 27:42)
which is why we

[Speaker 10] (27:42 - 27:42)
I haven't

[Speaker 1] (27:42 - 27:42)
haven't

[Speaker 10] (27:42 - 27:43)
been called doing on

[Speaker 1] (27:43 - 27:43)
that

[Speaker 10] (27:43 - 27:43)
that either.

[Speaker 1] (27:43 - 27:44)
we're going to do it on the third.

[Speaker 10] (27:45 - 27:45)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (27:45 - 27:48)
She and I have been talking about that because there is a time,

[Speaker 1] (27:48 - 27:52)
there's like It's a window. eight minutes between their license.

[Speaker 3] (27:53 - 27:53)
Okay.

[Speaker 5] (27:53 - 27:54)
I'm standing fully but

[Speaker 3] (27:54 - 27:55)
Alright,

[Speaker 3] (27:55 - 27:57)
well we will understand it fully next

[Speaker 9] (27:57 - 27:58)
We'll understand it fully on that.

[Speaker 7] (27:58 - 28:01)
I just don't want to have the be called to another meeting.

[Speaker 3] (28:01 - 28:02)
I agree.

[Speaker 3] (28:02 - 28:06)
So let's ensure that that's on the third so we can review.

[Speaker 3] (28:07 - 28:13)
Okay, moving on to update and discussion on the town's financial forecast and anticipated revenue and expenditures.

[Speaker 9] (28:14 - 28:15)
I'm sure you're all waiting with bated

[Speaker 3] (28:15 - 28:15)
Can't

[Speaker 9] (28:15 - 28:16)
breath wait. for this.

[Speaker 7] (28:16 - 28:17)
I love this.

[Speaker 3] (28:17 - 28:17)
Excited.

[Speaker 5] (28:21 - 28:22)
Yes, absolutely.

[Speaker 3] (28:29 - 28:29)
Patrick,

[Speaker 3] (28:29 - 28:30)
thanks for joining us again.

[Speaker 7] (28:31 - 28:32)
Nice.

[Speaker 5] (28:33 - 28:36)
I wasn't going to let him get away when there might be questions that I would have to answer for.

[Speaker 7] (28:38 - 28:38)
Thanks.

[Speaker 5] (28:38 - 28:40)
I asked him to be remote and he came. So we

[Speaker 3] (28:40 - 28:41)
Kudos to

[Speaker 5] (28:41 - 28:41)
got to

[Speaker 3] (28:41 - 28:41)
Sheryl.

[Speaker 5] (28:41 - 28:42)
thank him for that.

[Speaker 5] (28:53 - 28:54)
What's wrong with it? Cut off?

[Speaker 1] (28:54 - 28:55)
I think so.

[Speaker 5] (28:55 - 28:56)
I put it separately.

[Speaker 5] (28:56 - 28:56)
You It can is print

[Speaker 1] (28:56 - 28:57)
is.

[Speaker 5] (28:57 - 28:58)
the print out. I promise.

[Speaker 1] (29:00 - 29:01)
I'll just look at the screen, it's okay.

[Speaker 5] (29:02 - 29:02)
I know.

[Speaker 5] (29:09 - 29:10)
Okay, we can just go to the second slide.

[Speaker 9] (29:15 - 29:17)
So this slide is meant to level set.

[Speaker 9] (29:17 - 29:23)
I'm not going to read this off to you. I've some words to say, but it's to level set on the financial policies that we're working within

[Speaker 9] (29:24 - 29:28)
as we are creat creating these preliminary projections that we're presenting tonight.

[Speaker 9] (29:29 - 29:36)
Um the idea here is that we're delivering this information to you as directed by the charter, although I will acknowledge we are four days late.

[Speaker 9] (29:36 - 29:42)
And we will endeavor to be ahead of schedule in everything next year and for the rest of this budget season.

[Speaker 9] (29:42 - 29:45)
But we are ahead of where it was last year for a number of reasons.

[Speaker 9] (29:45 - 29:48)
The idea is that we want to provide you with the snapshot today.

[Speaker 9] (29:48 - 29:49)
It's informed by our

[Speaker 1] (29:51 - 29:54)
but it's just the initial early look.

[Speaker 1] (29:55 - 30:00)
We provide you with this information to review and to ask questions, and I'll do my best to answer tonight along with Patrick,

[Speaker 1] (30:00 - 30:04)
and if necessary we'll get any further information we need from the team for you all.

[Speaker 1] (30:05 - 30:12)
I then would hope to work with Katie to be on the agenda in the second meeting in December so that we can get some feedback at that point after you've had some time with this.

[Speaker 1] (30:13 - 30:21)
And at that point, I'd love to hear from you all about the goals and priorities and objectives that you have as it relates to the budget and sort of where we've given you this snapshot.

[Speaker 1] (30:22 - 30:39)
The second meeting that I'm discussing here is where the staff side can learn and get further information and guardrails so that as we're digging in to really have these deeper discussions with department heads that it's reflecting the initial feedback from you all so that we're sort of each working hand in hand towards the goals that we would like early in 26.

[Speaker 1] (30:39 - 30:40)
26.

[Speaker 1] (30:40 - 30:50)
So I don't want to read this all to you, but it's the financial policies focus a lot on revenue as opposed to expenditure. It's making sure that we're conservative and realistic about how we plan.

[Speaker 1] (30:51 - 31:04)
And then if things turned out more optimistically, it ends up being a question for us to find new ways to use those resources. But these are just some of the highlights, the local receipts, we don't exceed 90.

[Speaker 1] (31:04 - 31:08)
Ninety percent of the year prior grant revenue we don't build around.

[Speaker 1] (31:08 - 31:12)
We're trying to determine how sustainable it is and then obviously the top one is the big one.

[Speaker 1] (31:13 - 31:21)
We focus at this early stage on the two percent per year plus you know four hundred twenty five thousand of new growth.

[Speaker 1] (31:21 - 31:29)
We are over that for the five-year average but we still cap it at four twenty five so again we're being conservative and thoughtful about you know how we plan at this early stage.

[Speaker 1] (31:29 - 31:30)
We go to the next slide.

[Speaker 1] (31:31 - 31:34)
Actually I think it's a fourth. We can just go to the next one just to

[Speaker 1] (31:42 - 31:42)
Yes.

[Speaker 1] (31:43 - 31:44)
So this is, again,

[Speaker 1] (31:44 - 31:46)
a snapshot so that everyone is on the same page.

[Speaker 1] (31:46 - 31:51)
This is the maximum allowable levy with Prop 2.5. It is not how we build the budget,

[Speaker 1] (31:51 - 31:52)
but I want to make sure everyone sees it.

[Speaker 1] (31:52 - 31:54)
I know looking back over time,

[Speaker 1] (31:54 - 32:00)
this has always been part of the presentation so that folks can understand where we are versus what we used to plan.

[Speaker 1] (32:01 - 32:07)
This shows the 2.5% growth. I mean, the 2.5% increase in the property tax,

[Speaker 1] (32:07 - 32:08)
again,

[Speaker 1] (32:08 - 32:10)
it caps the 425 new growth.

[Speaker 1] (32:11 - 32:23)
And it includes obviously the debt exclusions which go into the maximum allowable level because they have been voted on by the community and over time we're paying those down because those are priorities that the community decided to fund.

[Speaker 1] (32:23 - 32:25)
We can go on to the next one.

[Speaker 1] (32:33 - 32:38)
So this is, yeah that's right, this is the projection based on the policy.

[Speaker 1] (32:39 - 32:40)
It's the 2%.

[Speaker 1] (32:40 - 33:07)
uh increase in property taxes plus 425 in new growth and as you can see the number is a bit lower but it's important that we follow the policies as we begin this effort in the projection and planning and so as you can see on the bottom right that is the estimated excess levy capacity at the very bottom right and above that is the two percent plus new growth uh are the levy number for that we're working from we can go on to the next slide

[Speaker 1] (33:15 - 33:17)
So at this point in this early stage,

[Speaker 1] (33:17 - 33:23)
as I said, we want to be very conservative. This slide is what we're planning for state aid, which is flat.

[Speaker 1] (33:23 - 33:30)
There's a number of factors that come into play both at the state and federal level that we think means the flat assumption makes sense and is worthwhile.

[Speaker 1] (33:32 - 33:36)
Number one, at the state level there's a hiring freeze and they're talking about incentives to separate employees,

[Speaker 1] (33:37 - 33:39)
whether early retirement or just to separate.

[Speaker 1] (33:41 - 33:46)
And then when we get to the federal level, which obviously funds a significant portion of state government and by extension us.

[Speaker 1] (33:47 - 33:52)
It's very hard for us to forecast that there will be increases of any kind or to understand exactly where that's going to land.

[Speaker 1] (33:52 - 33:56)
So we're just carrying forward a flat number with the hopes that we do get that.

[Speaker 1] (33:56 - 33:56)
And again,

[Speaker 1] (33:56 - 34:00)
this will be a discussion if that were to change when the governor's budget and the legislature acts,

[Speaker 1] (34:01 - 34:03)
which is something legislature usually wouldn't be acting until April.

[Speaker 1] (34:04 - 34:08)
But we would have a better sense of that when we're getting into the discussions in February and March.

[Speaker 1] (34:08 - 34:12)
But right now we're keeping it flat so that we don't build off an assumption that something...

[Speaker 1] (34:12 - 34:24)
might be there when there's really nothing that we can look at that would make us anticipate that it will be there as of right now so just wanted to again highlight how we're getting to where we are can we go to the next slide I

[Speaker 1] (34:28 - 34:38)
know this is tiny on the screen it's easier probably for people at home to see this but again local receipts is you know as with other revenue there are financial policies around what we

[Speaker 1] (34:39 - 34:44)
can plan for and what we do plan for so that we are not being overly optimistic in looking through rose-coloured glasses.

[Speaker 1] (34:46 - 34:50)
Um they're, you know, running down the list here as you can see

[Speaker 1] (34:51 - 34:53)
is there a technical problem?

[Speaker 2] (34:53 - 34:56)
Well two people have raised hands, so I'm wondering if there is a technical

[Speaker 1] (34:56 - 34:56)
Can we go

[Speaker 2] (34:56 - 34:56)
error.

[Speaker 1] (34:56 - 34:59)
to the teams just to see if there's a technical issue?

[Speaker 1] (35:05 - 35:06)
Can they not see it?

[Speaker 2] (35:06 - 35:06)
Uh

[Speaker 3] (35:08 - 35:10)
Yeah, the slides are the slides are showing online.

[Speaker 2] (35:11 - 35:11)
Okay, thanks

[Speaker 1] (35:11 - 35:11)
Thank

[Speaker 2] (35:11 - 35:12)
Doug.

[Speaker 1] (35:12 - 35:12)
you, Doug.

[Speaker 1] (35:15 - 35:15)
We

[Speaker 4] (35:15 - 35:15)
We

[Speaker 2] (35:18 - 35:20)
Would we try to share again, Diane?

[Speaker 4] (35:20 - 35:20)
Yep.

[Speaker 2] (35:39 - 35:41)
Doug, does that, can you see that any better?

[Speaker 3] (35:45 - 35:46)
Yes.

[Speaker 2] (35:46 - 35:47)
Okay, great.

[Speaker 2] (35:47 - 35:49)
And if you wouldn't, yeah, perfect.

[Speaker 1] (35:49 - 35:50)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (35:51 - 36:05)
So with local receipts, as with the others, we're looking at conservative projections that are percentages of prior years or averages. we're not trying to be overly optimistic to look at any particular local receipt and say that, you know, we can build a budget strongly around that.

[Speaker 1] (36:06 - 36:12)
You know, there's different things you can highlight. The building department, as an example, is doing well this year.

[Speaker 1] (36:14 - 36:21)
The, you know, over time we again don't want to build a budget over something that is higher than that. I cannot see either.

[Speaker 2] (36:24 - 36:25)
What are you looking for?

[Speaker 5] (36:25 - 36:25)
It's hard

[Speaker 1] (36:25 - 36:25)
I

[Speaker 5] (36:25 - 36:26)
with

[Speaker 1] (36:26 - 36:29)
just wanted to see if there were any other ones that I should highlight other than that. But in

[Speaker 1] (36:30 - 36:38)
In reality, we're planning a budget around things that are 85 and 90% of prior year budget or their historic actuals averaged over three to five years.

[Speaker 1] (36:39 - 36:43)
Can we go to the next slide, Diane, because this is really the one that we'll want to talk about probably.

[Speaker 1] (36:48 - 36:49)
Keep going.

[Speaker 1] (36:52 - 36:56)
So here looking at the estimated expenditures, which is part of what is requested by

[Speaker 1] (36:57 - 37:05)
charter and has not always historically been presented at this time but I wanted to make sure that we had this in front of folks now so that we could have a thoughtful discussion.

[Speaker 1] (37:06 - 37:08)
I want to caution as we review this that this is a first pass.

[Speaker 1] (37:09 - 37:16)
We're not yet at the point where we've gotten guidance from you all and others in the community about level service versus level funding versus the priorities.

[Speaker 1] (37:16 - 37:18)
So we're starting at a point to prompt the discussion.

[Speaker 1] (37:19 - 37:25)
I know that the teams on both with both the town and the school are very cognizant of the limited resources we have available.

[Speaker 1] (37:25 - 37:26)
available.

[Speaker 1] (37:26 - 37:32)
We're looking at this projection to include things like salary reserves,

[Speaker 1] (37:32 - 37:38)
but they are projections and those sit in general government because we have a number of open contracts with ongoing negotiations.

[Speaker 1] (37:38 - 37:50)
It also includes salaries intended to support the town hall resources across finance assessing and town clerk that we've discussed over time so that's also in there now and again open to discussion.

[Speaker 1] (37:51 - 37:53)
As you can see in the bottom right,

[Speaker 1] (37:53 - 37:57)
there is a projected deficit and it is, I want to caution,

[Speaker 1] (37:57 - 38:05)
it's a projection. We will continue to refine this as we go forward through this discussion and through our discussions with the department heads.

[Speaker 1] (38:05 - 38:10)
This is our best informed estimate of where we are today as we look at this as a snapshot.

[Speaker 1] (38:11 - 38:13)
I want to acknowledge that there's open contracts.

[Speaker 1] (38:13 - 38:20)
There's a solid waste contract that is expiring at the end of the year and health care costs that we can only estimate right now.

[Speaker 1] (38:20 - 38:21)
Health care is an example.

[Speaker 1] (38:22 - 38:29)
We have not yet gotten any guidance from GIC. It has historically happened that they've provided a range in December.

[Speaker 1] (38:29 - 38:32)
But we may or may not get that information in December.

[Speaker 1] (38:32 - 38:37)
It might be later in the year, later in 2026 when they actually provide what the number will be.

[Speaker 1] (38:37 - 38:40)
As we get better information in each of these lines,

[Speaker 1] (38:40 - 38:42)
we will continue to refine this as we go.

[Speaker 1] (38:42 - 38:46)
As I said, that's a living document, is a snapshot,

[Speaker 1] (38:46 - 38:50)
but for Patrick and I, it will be a living document as we're having discussions with department heads.

[Speaker 1] (38:50 - 38:51)
We're hearing about priorities,

[Speaker 1] (38:51 - 38:53)
goals, and objectives from you all,

[Speaker 1] (38:53 - 38:56)
and we're getting more certainty around contracts that are open.

[Speaker 1] (38:56 - 38:58)
both for services and for employees.

[Speaker 1] (38:59 - 39:02)
I hope this is a good jumping off point.

[Speaker 1] (39:02 - 39:05)
I apologise for those at home that didn't see the first slides.

[Speaker 1] (39:06 - 39:10)
I'm happy to talk to anyone that's interested at the office as well. I just wanna put that out there.

[Speaker 1] (39:10 - 39:19)
It's open door as I've said, but I'm also happy to take questions tonight and hope that I'll be able to answer them or lean on Patrick to get a little more colour if I'm not able to directly.

[Speaker 6] (39:21 - 39:24)
So let me just say what everybody is probably thinking.

[Speaker 6] (39:25 - 39:30)
The way I'm looking at this right now, it says a projected deficit of two million, right?

[Speaker 1] (39:30 - 39:31)
Correct.

[Speaker 6] (39:31 - 39:31)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (39:31 - 39:32)
2.3.

[Speaker 6] (39:32 - 39:35)
Thank you. I wanted to make sure I could actually see what this is.

[Speaker 1] (39:35 - 39:37)
And to highlight health care,

[Speaker 1] (39:38 - 39:44)
we are carrying a number, but it could be not optimum, you know, we could be too optimistic. I don't think.

[Speaker 2] (40:02 - 40:02)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (40:02 - 40:06)
know I think what other communities are seeing are up to eight percent

[Speaker 1] (40:06 - 40:08)
And increased costs in solid waste.

[Speaker 1] (40:08 - 40:13)
The Solid Waste Advisory Committee is doing a very deep dive on both what we want,

[Speaker 1] (40:13 - 40:15)
what we would like to have,

[Speaker 1] (40:15 - 40:17)
what we need, and the best ways to save money.

[Speaker 1] (40:18 - 40:32)
And one of the things that's been discussed, I know I haven't been in those meetings every week in the last two weeks, but prior it was, you know, even do we look at extending for one year at a small increase as possible so that we can fully vet out any and all options.

[Speaker 1] (40:33 - 40:36)
But those are significant drivers that will be.

[Speaker 1] (40:36 - 40:45)
sort of you know they'll have to be built in and they're not entirely under our control where they land so I want to just highlight those but yes it does show a deficit of 2.3 so

[Speaker 3] (40:45 - 40:46)
So, Nick,

[Speaker 3] (40:47 - 40:50)
would you characterize this as generally,

[Speaker 3] (40:50 - 40:51)
not only on the revenue side,

[Speaker 3] (40:51 - 40:56)
but also on the expense side as you're taking a conservative approach in each of those areas?

[Speaker 1] (40:58 - 41:01)
revenue side is conservative yes this

[Speaker 1] (41:02 - 41:05)
I want to make sure that we're both using conservative the same way.

[Speaker 1] (41:06 - 41:08)
This is, I don't think,

[Speaker 1] (41:08 - 41:09)
no,

[Speaker 3] (41:09 - 41:14)
You're assuming higher increases than you would really expect at this point.

[Speaker 1] (41:16 - 41:19)
I don't think that I'm being as conservative as I could be in that regard.

[Speaker 1] (41:19 - 41:23)
I think on the operations, the salary and expense lines,

[Speaker 1] (41:23 - 41:25)
where we can,

[Speaker 1] (41:25 - 41:27)
we are, you know, sort of holding the line.

[Speaker 1] (41:28 - 41:47)
that has been held repeatedly for percentage increases the general government as I said is where for now we hold salary reserves so that's one that is bigger but in addition to that as I cautioned over time when we discussed sort of market adjustment for senior level staff that we need to bring on my

[Speaker 1] (41:48 - 41:57)
You know sort of visceral reaction to asking you all for support of that is it means that my baseline and maintenance will be higher and it has been historically.

[Speaker 1] (41:58 - 42:02)
So there's it is not the most conservative if you're saying,

[Speaker 1] (42:02 - 42:07)
you know, the most realistic and only option.

[Speaker 1] (42:09 - 42:10)
I think we're being

[Speaker 1] (42:11 - 42:16)
aggressive in a way that we can work very hard to meet in many of these lines,

[Speaker 1] (42:16 - 42:18)
but there are some significant drivers that we don't have control over,

[Speaker 1] (42:18 - 42:25)
particularly the three that I mentioned that could have a significant impact depending on where they land.

[Speaker 4] (42:27 - 42:28)
So, Nick,

[Speaker 4] (42:28 - 42:30)
just a quick question on culture and recreation.

[Speaker 4] (42:30 - 42:32)
Culture would be library.

[Speaker 4] (42:32 - 42:38)
Recreation historically has sat outside of the general fund in a revolving account,

[Speaker 4] (42:38 - 42:40)
at least for salary,

[Speaker 4] (42:40 - 42:40)
correct?

[Speaker 5] (42:41 - 42:41)
For salary?

[Speaker 4] (42:41 - 42:42)
Yeah.

[Speaker 5] (42:42 - 42:42)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 4] (42:42 - 42:43)
Yeah.

[Speaker 5] (42:43 - 42:43)
Yeah.

[Speaker 4] (42:43 - 42:43)
So.

[Speaker 6] (42:43 - 42:45)
They still have a line item in the budget, though.

[Speaker 5] (42:45 - 42:47)
Yeah, we have, there's still a line item in the budget.

[Speaker 3] (42:47 - 42:47)
For.

[Speaker 6] (42:47 - 42:47)
Uh.

[Speaker 5] (42:47 - 42:51)
Like, lifeguards and other activities that the entire town

[Speaker 4] (42:51 - 42:53)
Got it. Got it. Okay.

[Speaker 5] (42:53 - 42:54)
it's a, it's a small number.

[Speaker 4] (42:54 - 43:02)
Okay. Okay. So I, I just, I just wanted to make sure that that was, that that was allocated properly and I just, I just don't have that detail.

[Speaker 4] (43:02 - 43:03)
So.

[Speaker 1] (43:03 - 43:04)
Patrick,

[Speaker 1] (43:04 - 43:04)
could you help?

[Speaker 1] (43:05 - 43:08)
Highlight what falls under that for me please. I apologize.

[Speaker 7] (43:08 - 43:14)
Yep, so the culture and recreation category includes the library department salary and expense,

[Speaker 7] (43:14 - 43:25)
and it includes salaries for lifeguards and certain expenditures of the rec department that are outside rec revolving, such as 4th of July lifeguard supplies,

[Speaker 7] (43:25 - 43:29)
community events that are funded through the general fund.

[Speaker 1] (43:29 - 43:30)
Thank you.

[Speaker 3] (43:30 - 43:30)
Thank you.

[Speaker 5] (43:31 - 43:33)
Patrick, what,

[Speaker 5] (43:33 - 43:36)
as far as investment income,

[Speaker 5] (43:36 - 43:38)
you have that dropping down,

[Speaker 1] (43:40 - 43:41)
That's a,

[Speaker 6] (43:41 - 43:42)
On the prior slide.

[Speaker 1] (43:42 - 43:42)
yeah,

[Speaker 1] (43:42 - 43:44)
do you want to, that's in the revenue,

[Speaker 1] (43:44 - 43:44)
right?

[Speaker 1] (43:44 - 43:45)
Our local receipts.

[Speaker 5] (43:45 - 43:46)
local receipts.

[Speaker 5] (43:48 - 43:51)
So you can go to local receipts. I have a couple questions in that category.

[Speaker 1] (43:51 - 43:53)
That's the impact of the market and interest rates in general.

[Speaker 1] (43:54 - 43:55)
Is that correct, Patrick?

[Speaker 7] (43:55 - 43:56)
Yes.

[Speaker 1] (43:56 - 43:56)
Thank you.

[Speaker 5] (43:58 - 44:02)
And miscellaneous recurring,

[Speaker 5] (44:03 - 44:08)
actually I don't care about that. Miscellaneous, non-recurring.

[Speaker 6] (44:11 - 44:13)
You mean what has sat in there in the past under the historics?

[Speaker 5] (44:15 - 44:17)
What's the what's the detail on that?

[Speaker 7] (44:18 - 44:20)
I can speak for FY25,

[Speaker 7] (44:20 - 44:23)
which is the most recent actual on the report.

[Speaker 7] (44:23 - 44:29)
There's a million dollars in there that we received from National Grid related to energy incentives for the new school.

[Speaker 7] (44:29 - 44:30)
Obviously, in

[Speaker 5] (44:30 - 44:30)
Right.

[Speaker 7] (44:30 - 44:32)
the context of the forecast,

[Speaker 7] (44:33 - 44:37)
we don't assume any miscellaneous revenues for forecasting because they're not guaranteed.

[Speaker 5] (44:38 - 44:55)
Right, so I, you know, on that money, on the National Grid money, I know we really didn't want to be counting that money because we wanted that money invested back into infrastructure so we could get additional additional grants. But last year because of the major FUPA on four hundred and forty thousand dollars not being accounted for,

[Speaker 5] (44:55 - 45:05)
we had to put, we had to use that money to balance out. So what is left as far as what's coming in from National Grid, do you know?

[Speaker 7] (45:07 - 45:11)
I don't have an exact amount because I don't believe we have an exact amount from National Grid.

[Speaker 5] (45:11 - 45:11)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (45:11 - 45:14)
That's something that Max coordinates with them on.

[Speaker 5] (45:14 - 45:14)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 7] (45:14 - 45:18)
I believe there's some additional incentives that will be expected,

[Speaker 7] (45:18 - 45:21)
but I don't have timing or amounts from

[Speaker 5] (45:21 - 45:21)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (45:21 - 45:22)
him.

[Speaker 5] (45:24 - 45:25)
All right.

[Speaker 3] (45:28 - 45:32)
It is to stick on that, I think we had this conversation a meeting or two ago,

[Speaker 3] (45:32 - 45:34)
so that million miscellaneous not recurring,

[Speaker 3] (45:35 - 45:36)
that is the national grid money.

[Speaker 7] (45:38 - 45:43)
Yes, there are some other smaller items in there, but that would be the notable item I would call out.

[Speaker 5] (45:45 - 46:01)
So I thought for some reason when I'm I remember reading this I thought we had about two and a half million coming in for that and it was staggered it was we got some last year and some this year and the only way to continue to get any additional money was to to reinvest.

[Speaker 5] (46:02 - 46:15)
into infrastructure like solar and things like that for National Grid. But I do remember that there was money coming after the initial money that we brought in this year. So if we could just look that up for a later time.

[Speaker 7] (46:15 - 46:16)
And circle back with Max

[Speaker 5] (46:16 - 46:16)
Yeah,

[Speaker 7] (46:16 - 46:17)
on

[Speaker 5] (46:17 - 46:17)
that'd be great.

[Speaker 7] (46:17 - 46:19)
what he has in the hopper for energy incentives.

[Speaker 4] (46:20 - 46:20)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (46:20 - 46:27)
And I yeah, I remember it Mariano, I think there were different categories so some was national grid and some were other other incentive programs.

[Speaker 3] (46:27 - 46:28)
There I

[Speaker 5] (46:28 - 46:28)
were

[Speaker 3] (46:28 - 46:28)
don't think

[Speaker 5] (46:28 - 46:28)
two,

[Speaker 3] (46:28 - 46:29)
there was

[Speaker 5] (46:29 - 46:29)
yeah.

[Speaker 4] (46:29 - 46:29)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 3] (46:30 - 46:30)
Yes.

[Speaker 5] (46:30 - 46:47)
There were two categories. One had to be used for school debt and the other had to be used, could be used for anything we wanted, but in our conversations it was to use it for infrastructure to keep investing,

[Speaker 5] (46:47 - 46:53)
you know, in infrastructure, specifically around the schools and making them more energy efficient.

[Speaker 1] (46:55 - 46:56)
We'll talk to Max.

[Speaker 5] (46:56 - 46:58)
Yep, just get those dollars.

[Speaker 1] (47:04 - 47:05)
Do you want to go back to the last slide again?

[Speaker 1] (47:07 - 47:07)
Thanks.

[Speaker 1] (47:08 - 47:13)
Now, can we just do we have any other questions on the can you go to the expenditures on one? Thank you.

[Speaker 1] (47:15 - 47:18)
I didn't know if you all were done asking questions about this because we had bounced around.

[Speaker 5] (47:19 - 47:20)
I just have a question on debt service.

[Speaker 5] (47:23 - 47:29)
So on debt service, that's you have the debt service pretty much in this flat from

[Speaker 5] (47:32 - 47:34)
your twenty five actual to your

[Speaker 5] (47:35 - 47:37)
twenty six budgeted.

[Speaker 5] (47:39 - 47:44)
Can you s send us or can you circle back later and just give us a table of roll-offs?

[Speaker 7] (47:45 - 47:45)
I can.

[Speaker 5] (47:46 - 47:46)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (47:47 - 47:58)
And just assure everybody that the number for debt service is pretty solid because it's based on you know an itemized forecast of debt based on the five-year plan that was presented to town meeting.

[Speaker 7] (47:58 - 48:00)
And so I feel pretty good about that number,

[Speaker 7] (48:00 - 48:06)
but I'll copy out that we'll update that as we progress through capital plan updates ahead of you know having to finalize this budget,

[Speaker 7] (48:06 - 48:08)
but that's the best number we have right now.

[Speaker 6] (48:15 - 48:23)
Can you um repeat again for us what your steps will be going forward on the budget timeline now?

[Speaker 1] (48:23 - 48:25)
Yeah. Can you go to the last slide now.

[Speaker 6] (48:25 - 48:26)
Oh is that? Am I teeing you up?

[Speaker 1] (48:26 - 48:26)
Yeah, thank you.

[Speaker 6] (48:26 - 48:27)
Great.

[Speaker 1] (48:27 - 48:39)
Um so as I said we'll we'll be working with department heads um in December and January but we'll also you know as I said we would love to come back before you for that last meeting of the calendar year.

[Speaker 1] (48:40 - 48:48)
We get just initial broad feedback goals, priorities, objectives because that will inform the discussions we have, level service versus level funding, you know, things like that.

[Speaker 1] (48:49 - 49:04)
Um I'm meeting with FinCom obviously as I said tomorrow, CIC also is uh gonna kick off in a a more um intense way soon. Um but we will put together the preliminary budget for the end of January. The school department

[Speaker 1] (49:04 - 49:09)
We anticipate being complete with their effort in February,

[Speaker 1] (49:09 - 49:17)
and we would be before you several times between now and then, both for feedback and presentations on where we stand in the process.

[Speaker 1] (49:17 - 49:22)
I would absolutely plan to come before you with a separate agenda item, not just in the T.A. report,

[Speaker 1] (49:22 - 49:26)
as we get more information specifically about those large drivers that I mentioned,

[Speaker 1] (49:27 - 49:30)
because those are things that I want to share with you all as soon as we have them.

[Speaker 5] (49:33 - 49:35)
And this is based on two percent, not two and a half,

[Speaker 1] (49:35 - 49:35)
Correct.

[Speaker 5] (49:35 - 49:36)
okay.

[Speaker 1] (49:36 - 49:39)
Yes, it's all base which is within the financial policies. We are we're working

[Speaker 2] (49:43 - 49:45)
And so this is, again,

[Speaker 2] (49:45 - 49:48)
it's a snapshot right now. There's some things that are still out there that are not.

[Speaker 2] (49:49 - 50:09)
um insignificant. But as we get more information on those, I will share with you as soon as I can, so that we can continue to make informed decisions and you can provide informed feedback to us. Um so what we come to you matches as best as possible your goals, priorities, objectives uh throughout. I would anticipate, as I said, I'll be before you with information about this uh

[Speaker 2] (50:10 - 50:17)
Or I'll be asking you more than once over time in addition to any update that I get to those significant drivers.

[Speaker 2] (50:17 - 50:19)
Does that answer your question?

[Speaker 3] (50:19 - 50:19)
It does.

[Speaker 3] (50:19 - 50:39)
I think one of the things I am cognizant of given last year's budget process is we sort of talked about an idea of maybe having department heads be more present alongside us as we understand some of the items in the budget.

[Speaker 3] (50:39 - 50:44)
I don't know if that really is something that will come to fruition this year,

[Speaker 3] (50:44 - 50:45)
how you see it playing out.

[Speaker 3] (50:45 - 50:51)
You just want to take the information and present to us as, you know, the TA's budget and move on from there.

[Speaker 3] (50:52 - 50:55)
Or, you know, in years past there were, I think prior to Sean,

[Speaker 3] (50:56 - 51:00)
there were budget conversations where department heads would come in and sort of

[Speaker 2] (51:01 - 51:08)
Yeah, I'd be happy to spend time in January with that after we've had the initial internal discussions where we come and talk through where we are.

[Speaker 2] (51:08 - 51:09)
And again,

[Speaker 2] (51:09 - 51:15)
for me, that needs to be informed by some feedback in advance from you all so that we are focused.

[Speaker 2] (51:15 - 51:17)
And I'm using these too because they're...

[Speaker 2] (51:18 - 51:24)
Sort of big picture, it's not the only feedback I'm looking for, but level service versus level funding are two very different things as an example.

[Speaker 2] (51:25 - 51:36)
But we would want to know which direction you want to be pointing us in so that we can be responsive to that. And then I would be happy to have department heads come in whenever we choose to have sort of a great big department head night.

[Speaker 2] (51:36 - 51:43)
I'll look at how you've done it in the past. I'm not familiar with the customs and how it's been done here, but I'm happy to make sure that.

[Speaker 2] (51:44 - 52:08)
They are involved and they are answering the questions as well, 'cause it's it's a recommendation that comes from all of our hard work together from me ultimately to you all um and then the vote take is you know to put something before a town meeting. So um yeah, I'm happy to bring department heads and others before you all and I'd be happy to work with you and others individually to make sure that it's the right folks and it's not just, you know, police, fire, D.P.W., but we'll make sure everyone gets in front of you at some point.

[Speaker 3] (52:08 - 52:11)
Yeah, I mean I just looking for feedback from the board

[Speaker 3] (52:12 - 52:15)
If that is the direction we're asking Nick to go in or if

[Speaker 4] (52:16 - 52:28)
I think that's the most collaborative way to go about it. And it really gives us an understanding of what, you know, as opposed to just reading lines, items on a budget, we're understanding from those department heads what's important, what's critical.

[Speaker 4] (52:28 - 52:31)
what might be a nice to have, what what might not be

[Speaker 2] (52:31 - 52:31)
Right.

[Speaker 4] (52:31 - 52:34)
right, and really hearing it from the people that do the work every day,

[Speaker 2] (52:35 - 52:35)
Right.

[Speaker 4] (52:35 - 52:36)
so it's certainly helpful.

[Speaker 2] (52:36 - 52:41)
And if we were to go to talk with just this and this was all we all the discussion,

[Speaker 2] (52:41 - 52:42)
there would be no expansion,

[Speaker 2] (52:43 - 52:54)
no you know, it's making sure you fit within what we have. So if you all have questions from particular departments about any particular expansion, things that you've heard out heard about from the community, things that someone has suggested we wanted over time.

[Speaker 4] (52:55 - 52:55)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 2] (52:55 - 52:56)
I think that would give us, you know,

[Speaker 2] (52:56 - 53:04)
that would be a great forum to have those questions, and it's not, again, not just myself and the folks in finance answering, it's it's the ones that are doing the work in an individual department.

[Speaker 4] (53:04 - 53:05)
Absolutely.

[Speaker 4] (53:05 - 53:06)
Yep, that's a great approach.

[Speaker 3] (53:07 - 53:15)
I think it's hard uh to just I mean obviously we are each gonna give direction, uh you know, you're looking level set versus level funded.

[Speaker 2] (53:15 - 53:16)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 3] (53:16 - 53:17)
There's exceptions.

[Speaker 3] (53:18 - 53:19)
To any of that right

[Speaker 2] (53:19 - 53:19)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (53:19 - 53:21)
you say like okay obviously we want to be level funded,

[Speaker 3] (53:22 - 53:25)
but then we have these carve outs right or vice versa

[Speaker 3] (53:26 - 53:35)
So it would be more collaborative. I agree to have that conversation well in advance So we're able to fix all the issues before we get to a point where we can't

[Speaker 2] (53:35 - 53:43)
And my goal in doing, asking for that feedback in December is so that when we're doing the initial internal discussions.

[Speaker 2] (53:45 - 53:51)
we're just aligned. It's not that, to your point, everyone is going to be exactly set to to one guardrail.

[Speaker 3] (53:51 - 53:52)
Right.

[Speaker 2] (53:52 - 54:12)
We'll tell you what it looks like for each each department, the department head will be here to talk about it with you all, and that way we understand the impacts of any just any decision. But what we're putting together is responsive and aligned with what you all share after you've had a little little bit of time to look at this and obviously if you have other questions I'm happy to answer them after tonight as well and advance of that second meeting in December.

[Speaker 3] (54:13 - 54:13)
Great.

[Speaker 4] (54:13 - 54:14)
That's a great approach.

[Speaker 2] (54:15 - 54:16)
Doug, did you have something?

[Speaker 5] (54:19 - 54:30)
Well, I think the next item on the agenda, you know, adds further context to all of this too in terms of what the tax rate increase is looking like.

[Speaker 5] (54:30 - 54:31)
So,

[Speaker 5] (54:31 - 54:36)
you know, this will all kind of play out as we get more information.

[Speaker 2] (54:37 - 54:38)
Great. Okay.

[Speaker 3] (54:41 - 54:42)
Thanks, Doug.

[Speaker 3] (54:43 - 54:46)
All right, moving on to item number three on the agenda,

[Speaker 3] (54:46 - 54:53)
update and discussion of upcoming TOR filings related to fiscal year 2026 classification hearing.

[Speaker 3] (54:54 - 54:59)
This is a joint meeting with the board of assessors, so you all have to call your meeting to order.

[Speaker 6] (54:59 - 55:02)
Well, Charlie is on his way. He was at a housing authority meeting.

[Speaker 3] (55:02 - 55:03)
Okay.

[Speaker 6] (55:03 - 55:07)
So I think we can begin the discussion and then.

[Speaker 3] (55:07 - 55:08)
And

[Speaker 6] (55:08 - 55:08)
You

[Speaker 3] (55:08 - 55:08)
then you can have follow to it

[Speaker 6] (55:08 - 55:08)
see

[Speaker 3] (55:08 - 55:09)
to order

[Speaker 6] (55:09 - 55:09)
a call

[Speaker 3] (55:09 - 55:09)
when

[Speaker 6] (55:09 - 55:09)
to

[Speaker 3] (55:09 - 55:09)
you're

[Speaker 6] (55:09 - 55:09)
order

[Speaker 3] (55:09 - 55:09)
up there.

[Speaker 6] (55:09 - 55:10)
and go from there.

[Speaker 3] (55:10 - 55:11)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (55:11 - 55:13)
You know, I just have a quick question before we start.

[Speaker 4] (55:13 - 55:15)
Has has the Board of Assessors reviewed these numbers?

[Speaker 6] (55:17 - 55:17)
We just

[Speaker 7] (55:17 - 55:17)
Okay,

[Speaker 6] (55:17 - 55:18)
got

[Speaker 7] (55:18 - 55:18)
just got

[Speaker 6] (55:18 - 55:18)
them.

[Speaker 7] (55:18 - 55:18)
them today.

[Speaker 4] (55:19 - 55:20)
You just got them today.

[Speaker 6] (55:20 - 55:21)
Yeah.

[Speaker 4] (55:21 - 55:22)
And who do you get them from?

[Speaker 6] (55:23 - 55:24)
Patriot Property.

[Speaker 4] (55:24 - 55:24)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (55:27 - 55:37)
And so if I may, just before Paul gets started, we wanted to get in front of you all to share this information knowing that it's coming late from Patriot Property and we're trying to get everything together.

[Speaker 2] (55:38 - 55:54)
We wanted to make sure that this was an opportunity to talk and Paul can go into greater detail about the numbers where they are so that questions can be asked, we can get answers both tonight and over time, but we didn't want to push this to December as the first time you hear about any of this, but we will have to come back to do the final.

[Speaker 2] (55:54 - 56:01)
Classification hearing, this is to make sure you have some information and we were not just delaying the share of information as well.

[Speaker 8] (56:02 - 56:15)
Right, it just seems like every year there seems to be an issue with Patriot property delivering information in a timely manner. So, and we're being shown numbers prior to the Board of Assessors even seeing numbers.

[Speaker 5] (56:16 - 56:19)
Well, in all fairness to Patriot Properties, it wasn't all them.

[Speaker 5] (56:20 - 56:25)
I took on more than I probably should have this year trying to get things looked at,

[Speaker 5] (56:25 - 56:29)
which took me a lot longer than I ever possibly anticipated.

[Speaker 5] (56:31 - 56:42)
So moving forward to next year, there's going to be a little bit different ball game in how I proceed and then how we work with Patriot Properties as well.

[Speaker 6] (56:44 - 56:48)
Can you could you elaborate on that on that process,

[Speaker 5] (56:48 - 56:48)
Yeah,

[Speaker 6] (56:48 - 56:48)
please?

[Speaker 5] (56:48 - 56:52)
I mean, when I started last year, it was kind of middle of everything.

[Speaker 5] (56:52 - 56:56)
We worked on exemptions, got through that, got through abatement season,

[Speaker 5] (56:56 - 57:03)
and then there were issues that came up that I felt needed to be reviewed.

[Speaker 5] (57:04 - 57:09)
And there were two neighborhoods specifically, and that was the oceanfront neighborhoods.

[Speaker 5] (57:09 - 57:14)
And so I looked at each and every one of those properties individually.

[Speaker 5] (57:15 - 57:17)
I looked at flyovers,

[Speaker 5] (57:17 - 57:18)
I looked at MLS,

[Speaker 5] (57:18 - 57:19)
I looked at building permits,

[Speaker 5] (57:19 - 57:20)
deeds,

[Speaker 5] (57:20 - 57:21)
plans,

[Speaker 5] (57:21 - 57:22)
everything.

[Speaker 5] (57:23 - 57:31)
And in the process, I found things that needed to be corrected and rectified and kind of move on from there. The oceanfront neighborhoods.

[Speaker 5] (57:32 - 57:36)
I think are the most complicated neighborhoods in the swamp Scott.

[Speaker 5] (57:37 - 57:45)
So as I try to review further as we kind of move in town with some of the other neighborhoods,

[Speaker 5] (57:45 - 57:47)
then hopefully things will get a little bit smoother.

[Speaker 5] (57:47 - 57:55)
I certainly did not anticipate that things were going to be as complicated as they are.

[Speaker 5] (57:56 - 57:58)
Swamp Scott is a very complex town.

[Speaker 5] (57:59 - 58:01)
And so that makes it a little bit more complicated.

[Speaker 5] (58:02 - 58:06)
And so, you know, we're trying to get forward and, you know, again,

[Speaker 5] (58:06 - 58:07)
with 15 hours a week,

[Speaker 5] (58:07 - 58:11)
you know, it is a lot there.

[Speaker 5] (58:11 - 58:15)
So we're hoping that things will kind of smooth out a little bit.

[Speaker 5] (58:15 - 58:19)
But yeah, there'll be a different format moving forward.

[Speaker 5] (58:20 - 58:21)
What I'm finding is that

[Speaker 5] (58:22 - 58:25)
After five years, some things have changed.

[Speaker 5] (58:25 - 58:27)
Some things have changed with the Department of Revenue.

[Speaker 5] (58:28 - 58:44)
And for me, it's been a little bit more of trying to remember how I did things five years ago before I retired in setting values and everything else. So, you know, from my perspective, it did things a little bit backwards,

[Speaker 5] (58:44 - 58:51)
but we, with the help of Patriot, we're kind of, you know, set to move forward in hopefully a better direction.

[Speaker 8] (58:52 - 58:53)
I have a couple questions.

[Speaker 8] (58:53 - 58:55)
How many neighborhoods do we have in Swampscott?

[Speaker 6] (58:55 - 59:00)
Offhand, I don't know. I would probably venture and you're talking single-family neighborhoods,

[Speaker 6] (59:01 - 59:05)
probably about a dozen, I think. Yeah, I think there's more. Probably more,

[Speaker 6] (59:05 - 59:06)
yeah.

[Speaker 8] (59:06 - 59:06)
Well,

[Speaker 6] (59:06 - 59:06)
I wouldn't

[Speaker 8] (59:06 - 59:07)
let's just,

[Speaker 6] (59:07 - 59:08)
right around 20.

[Speaker 8] (59:08 - 59:14)
so we have 20 neighborhoods and then you decided to look at two neighborhoods and

[Speaker 8] (59:15 - 59:17)
what like bring them up to where

[Speaker 5] (59:17 - 59:17)
Well,

[Speaker 8] (59:17 - 59:17)
they should

[Speaker 5] (59:17 - 59:18)
again,

[Speaker 8] (59:18 - 59:18)
be

[Speaker 5] (59:18 - 59:18)
we're looking

[Speaker 8] (59:18 - 59:18)
or

[Speaker 5] (59:18 - 59:19)
for issues.

[Speaker 5] (59:19 - 59:25)
The thing that I'm most concerned with is consistency and some uniformity within the neighborhoods,

[Speaker 5] (59:25 - 59:28)
within the building styles and, you know, grades,

[Speaker 5] (59:28 - 59:28)
etc.

[Speaker 5] (59:29 - 59:34)
And so I think that's an important step to take to get things.

[Speaker 1] (59:40 - 59:44)
Once things are a little bit more in balance somewhere down in the future,

[Speaker 1] (59:44 - 59:45)
then...

[Speaker 1] (59:46 - 59:52)
Things should be a little bit easier when you're looking at doing your sales and trying to determine what needs to be done,

[Speaker 1] (59:52 - 59:53)
what needs to be adjusted.

[Speaker 1] (59:53 - 59:57)
But right now, some of it's a little bit of a hodgepodge.

[Speaker 1] (59:57 - 1:00:00)
And some things just really go back decades.

[Speaker 1] (1:00:00 - 1:00:03)
And I don't, you know, I think some things just haven't been looked at.

[Speaker 1] (1:00:04 - 1:00:06)
So, you know, fortunately,

[Speaker 1] (1:00:06 - 1:00:08)
you know, with Patriot there,

[Speaker 1] (1:00:08 - 1:00:15)
you know, I can rely on them for a second pair of eyes so that we can move forward.

[Speaker 2] (1:00:16 - 1:00:23)
So the concern that I have is did we take two neighborhoods and the waterfront neighborhood and

[Speaker 2] (1:00:23 - 1:00:25)
whatever other neighborhood,

[Speaker 2] (1:00:25 - 1:00:32)
and adjust them to make them right, and meanwhile there's another 18 neighborhoods out there that aren't just adjusted.

[Speaker 1] (1:00:32 - 1:00:32)
Well,

[Speaker 2] (1:00:32 - 1:00:33)
So does that

[Speaker 1] (1:00:33 - 1:00:33)
there's one

[Speaker 2] (1:00:33 - 1:00:33)
mean

[Speaker 1] (1:00:33 - 1:00:33)
of me

[Speaker 2] (1:00:33 - 1:00:33)
that

[Speaker 1] (1:00:33 - 1:00:34)
in if 15

[Speaker 2] (1:00:34 - 1:00:34)
you couldn't

[Speaker 1] (1:00:34 - 1:00:34)
hours.

[Speaker 2] (1:00:34 - 1:00:41)
finish, let me finish, does that mean that there's another 18 neighborhoods out there that are going to reap the benefit of these two?

[Speaker 2] (1:00:42 - 1:00:44)
So my concerns are inequity.

[Speaker 2] (1:00:45 - 1:00:51)
inequity. And I do know that the past town administrator did look at waterfront within the first couple years.

[Speaker 2] (1:00:51 - 1:00:56)
And I think my concerns are, do we immediately go to waterfront and make adjustments?

[Speaker 2] (1:00:57 - 1:01:04)
And how does the whole town, because as assessors, you're really not setting a tax rate, you're setting the fairness of taxes.

[Speaker 2] (1:01:04 - 1:01:10)
So as assessors, do we really have a town fairness or are we just identifying two.

[Speaker 2] (1:01:11 - 1:01:16)
two neighborhoods out of twenty. Tho that's where my cons my concerns really are

[Speaker 1] (1:01:16 - 1:01:21)
The two neighborhoods were waterfront neighborhoods and that consisted of a hundred and forty homes.

[Speaker 2] (1:01:22 - 1:01:22)
Uh-huh.

[Speaker 1] (1:01:22 - 1:01:36)
Uh the next neighborhood I would like to look at would be the next one which would be ocean very good neighborhood. Those are the people right behind the oceanfront properties. Um, and I think there's uh probably under two hundred of those homes as well. Um

[Speaker 1] (1:01:37 - 1:01:40)
This problem has been there for a long time.

[Speaker 1] (1:01:40 - 1:01:41)
Again,

[Speaker 1] (1:01:41 - 1:01:46)
with the turnover of assessors every year or so hasn't helped.

[Speaker 1] (1:01:47 - 1:01:49)
You know, you want fairness and equity,

[Speaker 1] (1:01:50 - 1:01:55)
but to get fairness and equity, you have to start reviewing things and looking at things.

[Speaker 1] (1:01:55 - 1:01:56)
And that's a process.

[Speaker 1] (1:01:57 - 1:02:00)
It's not going to happen in one year. It's not going to happen in a few months.

[Speaker 1] (1:02:00 - 1:02:01)
I told my board,

[Speaker 1] (1:02:01 - 1:02:03)
you're probably looking at three to five years.

[Speaker 2] (1:02:04 - 1:02:05)
So I want to just

[Speaker 1] (1:02:05 - 1:02:06)
And

[Speaker 2] (1:02:06 - 1:02:06)
say,

[Speaker 1] (1:02:06 - 1:02:10)
that would probably, we're probably working full-time, not fifteen hours a week.

[Speaker 2] (1:02:12 - 1:02:13)
So I just want to say you've

[Speaker 3] (1:02:13 - 1:02:16)
You've been there a year now, right? Is that?

[Speaker 1] (1:02:16 - 1:02:18)
Yes, surprising to me, yes.

[Speaker 3] (1:02:19 - 1:02:26)
Um and I thank you for that, 'cause it there is a uh there was a m you were put into a situation um of great difficulty, right, and

[Speaker 4] (1:02:26 - 1:02:27)
It was, yeah.

[Speaker 3] (1:02:27 - 1:02:41)
very much understaffed. And as you say to your point, working for fifteen hours a week, you can't fix everything in ten minutes, right? So I appreciate that the time you're putting in and looking at it systematically, and I'm thinking from what you're saying

[Speaker 3] (1:02:41 - 1:02:50)
you've tackled two neighborhoods and you're progressively going to get to the rest right, but you've gotta start somewhere, right. And that's kind of your approach is you've

[Speaker 1] (1:02:50 - 1:02:52)
Yeah, and I appreciate that.

[Speaker 1] (1:02:52 - 1:02:54)
This is why when I first came in,

[Speaker 1] (1:02:54 - 1:02:58)
what I started telling everybody is you need a full-time assessor.

[Speaker 2] (1:02:58 - 1:02:59)
Absolutely. Absolutely. Remember that.

[Speaker 1] (1:03:00 - 1:03:03)
There have been missed opportunities for this town.

[Speaker 1] (1:03:03 - 1:03:10)
Missed opportunities probably with more growth and getting things a little bit more balanced and uniform and consistent.

[Speaker 3] (1:03:11 - 1:03:11)
Yep.

[Speaker 1] (1:03:11 - 1:03:13)
And again,

[Speaker 1] (1:03:13 - 1:03:16)
you know, it's very difficult to try to pick up the pieces.

[Speaker 3] (1:03:16 - 1:03:17)
Yep.

[Speaker 1] (1:03:17 - 1:03:20)
Yes, am I going to step on toes in the process?

[Speaker 1] (1:03:20 - 1:03:21)
Absolutely.

[Speaker 1] (1:03:21 - 1:03:26)
Is there going to be some pain involved in trying to get things rectified? Of course there will be.

[Speaker 3] (1:03:26 - 1:03:30)
Sure, but I appreciate the undertaking because I know it's not small and

[Speaker 5] (1:03:30 - 1:03:32)
And we weren't just picking on Oceanside.

[Speaker 3] (1:03:32 - 1:03:33)
Of course, yeah, no.

[Speaker 5] (1:03:33 - 1:03:34)
It's just you've

[Speaker 3] (1:03:34 - 1:03:34)
It's a systematic approach.

[Speaker 5] (1:03:34 - 1:03:35)
got to stop somewhere

[Speaker 3] (1:03:35 - 1:03:35)
Yeah.

[Speaker 5] (1:03:35 - 1:03:37)
and we've had six assessments in

[Speaker 3] (1:03:37 - 1:03:38)
Yeah.

[Speaker 5] (1:03:38 - 1:03:39)
ten years and

[Speaker 3] (1:03:39 - 1:03:39)
Right.

[Speaker 5] (1:03:39 - 1:03:43)
six different people and two years we didn't have anyone and there's

[Speaker 3] (1:03:43 - 1:03:44)
Completely understandable.

[Speaker 1] (1:03:44 - 1:03:44)
Yeah.

[Speaker 5] (1:03:44 - 1:03:48)
a lot that needs to be fixed and Paul's doing a great job and it's going to take time but.

[Speaker 3] (1:03:48 - 1:03:49)
Absolutely.

[Speaker 3] (1:03:49 - 1:03:50)
I agree.

[Speaker 1] (1:03:50 - 1:03:52)
Through the sales review process,

[Speaker 1] (1:03:52 - 1:03:54)
yes, we are looking at

[Speaker 1] (1:03:53 - 1:04:20)
at we have made changes in town some of the neighborhood land values have come up and then we're looking at things as they come along one of the things we Patriot and I looked at and talked about were some of the table changes for building style because those were you know I had some old styles which were calculated the higher cost per square foot the colonial's antiques are contemporaries in town we do have a lot of

[Speaker 1] (1:04:20 - 1:04:24)
lot of colonials and certainly antiques and God knows you have a lot of contemporaries.

[Speaker 3] (1:04:24 - 1:04:31)
True. And I mean I really do want to understand I want everyone to understand the difficulty in filling this position,

[Speaker 3] (1:04:31 - 1:04:44)
right? Let's understand there's not a whole you know it's like needle in a haystack finding an experienced assessor to get in and do the work, right? That you've been undertaking which is a mountain of work and in the very beginning you said that, you know, I

[Speaker 1] (1:04:44 - 1:04:44)
Yeah,

[Speaker 3] (1:04:44 - 1:04:44)
can't

[Speaker 1] (1:04:44 - 1:04:44)
I you

[Speaker 3] (1:04:44 - 1:04:46)
do it by myself in 15 hours a week so.

[Speaker 3] (1:04:46 - 1:04:48)
So, thank you for your diligence

[Speaker 1] (1:04:48 - 1:04:48)
I'd

[Speaker 3] (1:04:48 - 1:04:48)
and

[Speaker 1] (1:04:48 - 1:04:52)
like to think that I'm looking at trying to get the town's best interest

[Speaker 3] (1:04:52 - 1:04:52)
Of course,

[Speaker 1] (1:04:52 - 1:04:52)
here.

[Speaker 3] (1:04:52 - 1:04:52)
yeah.

[Speaker 1] (1:04:53 - 1:04:58)
And I have lots of ideas on how things could be done,

[Speaker 1] (1:04:58 - 1:04:59)
but again,

[Speaker 1] (1:05:00 - 1:05:00)
you know, I

[Speaker 3] (1:05:00 - 1:05:01)
We need to help you. You

[Speaker 1] (1:05:01 - 1:05:01)
can't bite

[Speaker 3] (1:05:01 - 1:05:02)
need to off get more that.

[Speaker 1] (1:05:02 - 1:05:03)
than I can chew.

[Speaker 1] (1:05:03 - 1:05:07)
I mean, there are things that I'd like to see done probably more.

[Speaker 1] (1:05:07 - 1:05:08)
Quicker

[Speaker 3] (1:05:08 - 1:05:08)
Sure.

[Speaker 1] (1:05:08 - 1:05:12)
than not, but I realize that I simply can't do it.

[Speaker 3] (1:05:12 - 1:05:14)
Absolutely. No, I appreciate that.

[Speaker 6] (1:05:14 - 1:05:14)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (1:05:14 - 1:05:16)
I appreciate your honesty as well. Thank you.

[Speaker 6] (1:05:16 - 1:05:17)
So, Paul,

[Speaker 6] (1:05:17 - 1:05:29)
if we, you know, when we hire a full-time assessor, how much more rapidly can this process progress instead of it being two of 20 neighborhoods, let's say,

[Speaker 6] (1:05:29 - 1:05:32)
someone full-time comes in and within...

[Speaker 6] (1:05:33 - 1:05:41)
12 months where where where should we be given just given the fact that you're you've been in the seat for you know for for a year now

[Speaker 2] (1:05:41 - 1:05:41)
How

[Speaker 6] (1:05:41 - 1:05:41)
how

[Speaker 2] (1:05:41 - 1:05:42)
long will it take us to get

[Speaker 6] (1:05:42 - 1:05:44)
long will it take us to to to to catch

[Speaker 1] (1:05:44 - 1:05:44)
Again,

[Speaker 6] (1:05:44 - 1:05:44)
up

[Speaker 1] (1:05:44 - 1:05:46)
I still maintain three to five years.

[Speaker 6] (1:05:46 - 1:05:47)
three to five

[Speaker 1] (1:05:48 - 1:05:50)
I was in Western for almost 25 years.

[Speaker 3] (1:05:50 - 1:05:50)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:05:50 - 1:05:56)
When I took the job, I saw that there were lots of inequities in little neighborhoods and all over the place.

[Speaker 1] (1:05:57 - 1:05:58)
With a full-time staff,

[Speaker 1] (1:05:59 - 1:06:02)
working full-time, a full-time assessor, three admin people in my office.

[Speaker 1] (1:06:03 - 1:06:06)
It still took me three years to

[Speaker 3] (1:06:06 - 1:06:06)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (1:06:06 - 1:06:08)
go through each neighborhood,

[Speaker 1] (1:06:09 - 1:06:10)
land values,

[Speaker 1] (1:06:10 - 1:06:11)
rectify some neighborhoods,

[Speaker 1] (1:06:11 - 1:06:15)
look at building grades and cost tables and everything else.

[Speaker 1] (1:06:15 - 1:06:18)
Once all that's kind of in place,

[Speaker 1] (1:06:18 - 1:06:26)
I don't want to say you're an autopilot, but then it's a little easier to look at your sales and see what's going on and where you need to go.

[Speaker 1] (1:06:27 - 1:06:30)
In single families, and you have a lot of two families in town,

[Speaker 1] (1:06:30 - 1:06:36)
condos are a little bit different animal because every time a new condo is created, it creates its own neighborhood.

[Speaker 1] (1:06:37 - 1:06:39)
or even if it's just the conducts,

[Speaker 3] (1:06:39 - 1:06:39)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (1:06:39 - 1:06:44)
right? And so those sale prices will immediately tell you where things are going.

[Speaker 3] (1:06:44 - 1:06:44)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:06:44 - 1:07:01)
Um single families you have much different neighbourhoods. Um and I would probably venture to guess um that even in one neighbourhood you might see a differential um a difference in probably building grades in how those resales and sales take place.

[Speaker 3] (1:07:01 - 1:07:02)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:02 - 1:07:03)
And that can happen as well.

[Speaker 3] (1:07:03 - 1:07:04)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:04 - 1:07:10)
So I know that there are parts of town that are, you know, more definite than other parts of town,

[Speaker 1] (1:07:10 - 1:07:12)
which are a little more blue collar.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:13 - 1:07:14)
And so, but again,

[Speaker 1] (1:07:14 - 1:07:20)
even with some of the two families I've seen, even on the same street where they were converted to condos.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:21 - 1:07:25)
That on the resales on the same street we have this,

[Speaker 3] (1:07:25 - 1:07:25)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:25 - 1:07:29)
right? Because resale's not to tell you what's really happening in the market.

[Speaker 3] (1:07:29 - 1:07:30)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:30 - 1:07:34)
And to the extent the property may have been renovated or not renovated

[Speaker 3] (1:07:34 - 1:07:34)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:34 - 1:07:44)
and you know again and we're coming into some very uncertain times with the economy and the market. So there's no projecting what will happen in the future.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:45 - 1:07:47)
My only goal you know whether

[Speaker 1] (1:07:47 - 1:07:52)
values go up, down, it doesn't matter to me, I just wanna get some consistency in uniformity

[Speaker 3] (1:07:52 - 1:07:52)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (1:07:52 - 1:07:53)
so that

[Speaker 1] (1:07:55 - 1:07:59)
the town can move forward. Who who ever is here um is is a full-time assessor.

[Speaker 3] (1:07:59 - 1:08:00)
Right.

[Speaker 3] (1:08:00 - 1:08:01)
That makes sense.

[Speaker 7] (1:08:03 - 1:08:06)
So two things. One, I just sorry Doug, go ahead.

[Speaker 8] (1:08:07 - 1:08:08)
You know, let's pick, right?

[Speaker 7] (1:08:08 - 1:08:09)
I was just gonna,

[Speaker 7] (1:08:09 - 1:08:09)
well,

[Speaker 7] (1:08:09 - 1:08:12)
number one, Charlie's here so we can open their, you

[Speaker 5] (1:08:12 - 1:08:12)
We did.

[Speaker 7] (1:08:12 - 1:08:14)
did in secret.

[Speaker 5] (1:08:15 - 1:08:15)
Well,

[Speaker 5] (1:08:15 - 1:08:16)
not in secret,

[Speaker 7] (1:08:16 - 1:08:16)
I'm

[Speaker 5] (1:08:16 - 1:08:16)
but kind

[Speaker 7] (1:08:16 - 1:08:17)
just kidding.

[Speaker 5] (1:08:17 - 1:08:17)
of.

[Speaker 7] (1:08:17 - 1:08:35)
I think the other thing that I would just like to say is this is not the first time we've heard any of this information. This is maybe the first time we heard we only made it to two neighborhoods and those two neighborhoods were X. But Charlie, you've been to our meeting how many times and discussed necessary the necessity?

[Speaker 7] (1:08:35 - 1:08:44)
necessity for a full-time assessor. We've heard it not just from you, but from others, from Paul, from Nick, and Nick's only been here how long we've heard it.

[Speaker 7] (1:08:44 - 1:08:48)
So this will be a consistent issue until we solve.

[Speaker 7] (1:08:49 - 1:09:00)
that problem because we just there just are not enough hours for you to get the baseline back to where it needs to be for us to have that equity and consistency it's just not it's

[Speaker 1] (1:09:00 - 1:09:00)
Yeah.

[Speaker 7] (1:09:00 - 1:09:01)
not viable

[Speaker 1] (1:09:01 - 1:09:05)
I'd like to add that I probably did something that maybe has never been done in town.

[Speaker 1] (1:09:06 - 1:09:12)
I sent out impact letters to all the oceanfront people that yes, we are looking.

[Speaker 1] (1:09:12 - 1:09:16)
Yes, they may go up, down or they maybe they'll stay about the same.

[Speaker 1] (1:09:16 - 1:09:19)
You know, but as the review process goes through,

[Speaker 1] (1:09:20 - 1:09:21)
the review,

[Speaker 1] (1:09:21 - 1:09:29)
part of the review process is when I'm, if I come out and I look at a house for an abatement or somebody wants me to go out and look at a house, you're trying to get the information correct.

[Speaker 1] (1:09:29 - 1:09:32)
which re-establishes what that base value would be.

[Speaker 1] (1:09:32 - 1:09:33)
And then once that's there,

[Speaker 1] (1:09:33 - 1:09:35)
then we start looking at sales,

[Speaker 1] (1:09:35 - 1:09:37)
and then we need to see where that's going to go.

[Speaker 1] (1:09:38 - 1:09:40)
I've had a lot of condos that have come down in value,

[Speaker 1] (1:09:41 - 1:09:45)
and some have gone up, some have stayed the same, same with some of the single families and some of the neighborhoods.

[Speaker 1] (1:09:45 - 1:09:46)
So again,

[Speaker 1] (1:09:46 - 1:09:49)
you know, it's a process and that will,

[Speaker 1] (1:09:50 - 1:09:52)
you know, that's always changing.

[Speaker 2] (1:09:54 - 1:09:58)
Alright, so why don't we move on to the presentation if you don't mind.

[Speaker 3] (1:09:59 - 1:10:00)
Okay,

[Speaker 3] (1:10:00 - 1:10:00)
I've

[Speaker 2] (1:10:00 - 1:10:00)
Yes, Doug.

[Speaker 3] (1:10:00 - 1:10:01)
got a question if

[Speaker 2] (1:10:01 - 1:10:01)
Oh,

[Speaker 3] (1:10:01 - 1:10:01)
you don't

[Speaker 2] (1:10:01 - 1:10:01)
sorry.

[Speaker 3] (1:10:01 - 1:10:02)
mind me.

[Speaker 3] (1:10:02 - 1:10:05)
I'm not sure if this is covering the presentation, but I want to go,

[Speaker 3] (1:10:05 - 1:10:07)
sorry, a little bit back to what Mary Ellen was asking.

[Speaker 3] (1:10:08 - 1:10:08)
Paul,

[Speaker 3] (1:10:08 - 1:10:13)
can you just try to state as simply for layman's terms as possible,

[Speaker 3] (1:10:13 - 1:10:17)
what led you to choose certain neighborhoods?

[Speaker 3] (1:10:18 - 1:10:21)
Like, did you have certain data that indicated?

[Speaker 3] (1:10:22 - 1:10:25)
That they were out of whack.

[Speaker 3] (1:10:25 - 1:10:30)
I'm just trying to get a sense of like why out of all the neighborhoods you chose the ones you did

[Speaker 1] (1:10:31 - 1:10:39)
Well, a lot of us stem from some complaints because what some I was hearing and after doing an initial review,

[Speaker 1] (1:10:39 - 1:10:47)
I agree with the person that his home was graded and valued at X amount of dollars.

[Speaker 1] (1:10:48 - 1:10:57)
And yet he had neighbors which had newer construction of similar quality but were valued lower.

[Speaker 1] (1:10:57 - 1:10:59)
And again,

[Speaker 1] (1:10:59 - 1:11:06)
so my perspective is it's not enough to look at his home and two or three of his neighbors.

[Speaker 1] (1:11:06 - 1:11:10)
I decided to look at literally the entire neighborhood.

[Speaker 1] (1:11:11 - 1:11:14)
And I felt that if I hadn't done that,

[Speaker 1] (1:11:14 - 1:11:16)
then I really wouldn't be doing my job.

[Speaker 1] (1:11:17 - 1:11:20)
or, you know, doing my job to the way I thought that it should be done.

[Speaker 1] (1:11:21 - 1:11:25)
So yes, sometimes a complaint will kinda

[Speaker 2] (1:11:26 - 1:11:26)
Trigger.

[Speaker 1] (1:11:26 - 1:11:28)
kinda kickstart something,

[Speaker 1] (1:11:29 - 1:11:31)
and again, you know,

[Speaker 1] (1:11:31 - 1:11:32)
being a complicated neighbourhood,

[Speaker 1] (1:11:33 - 1:11:34)
it wasn't

[Speaker 1] (1:11:34 - 1:11:36)
The most pleasant thing to do,

[Speaker 1] (1:11:36 - 1:11:40)
there was a lot of time involved in looking at this.

[Speaker 1] (1:11:40 - 1:11:44)
There were some properties because of looking at permits, some building plans,

[Speaker 1] (1:11:44 - 1:11:45)
resketching properties,

[Speaker 1] (1:11:46 - 1:11:48)
a ton of review work.

[Speaker 1] (1:11:49 - 1:11:54)
There were times where it would take me two or three hours just to review one property.

[Speaker 4] (1:11:54 - 1:11:55)
Hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:11:57 - 1:11:59)
So I don't know if that answers your question,

[Speaker 1] (1:11:59 - 1:12:01)
but you know sometimes you know

[Speaker 3] (1:12:01 - 1:12:05)
Right. Yeah, no, I was just curious because I didn't know if there was some way in which you had

[Speaker 3] (1:12:07 - 1:12:21)
I assume you can't really know this until you actually get in and evaluate them, but if there was any way of reasoning that you would be able to have a sense of which neighborhoods are the most, you know, over or under assessed,

[Speaker 3] (1:12:21 - 1:12:30)
you know, even before you get there, if there's general trends that lead you to have that kind of hunch to begin with.

[Speaker 1] (1:12:31 - 1:12:31)
Yeah,

[Speaker 1] (1:12:31 - 1:12:35)
what I find, and sometimes I'm just looking at a property,

[Speaker 1] (1:12:35 - 1:12:37)
it doesn't matter what part of town,

[Speaker 1] (1:12:37 - 1:12:47)
I see things that flash to me and signals that maybe something needs to be looked at, it might be a problem here,

[Speaker 1] (1:12:47 - 1:12:50)
and then it's not just looking at that one property,

[Speaker 1] (1:12:50 - 1:12:55)
but what I've done is I'll run a report to see potentially how many other properties.

[Speaker 1] (1:12:55 - 1:12:57)
It might be affected the same way.

[Speaker 1] (1:12:58 - 1:12:59)
And again,

[Speaker 1] (1:12:59 - 1:13:03)
so that spurs one thing and then it becomes many.

[Speaker 1] (1:13:04 - 1:13:05)
So again,

[Speaker 1] (1:13:05 - 1:13:13)
you know, I would like to continue looking at the neighborhoods as moving forward and then trying to establish that.

[Speaker 1] (1:13:13 - 1:13:17)
I think that as I move and progress inward,

[Speaker 1] (1:13:19 - 1:13:24)
that some of the neighborhoods will start to become a little bit easier to look at.

[Speaker 1] (1:13:26 - 1:13:27)
Some of your more affluent neighbors,

[Speaker 1] (1:13:27 - 1:13:37)
I mean, we're not talking cookie cutter homes, we're talking, you know, lots of different, you know, grades and, you know, sale prices and everything else.

[Speaker 1] (1:13:37 - 1:13:49)
So the idea is as we move inward towards town and probably towards Lynn line that things will start smoothing out and it'll be a little easier to look at.

[Speaker 5] (1:13:51 - 1:13:53)
I have a quick question, when somebody pulls

[Speaker 5] (1:13:53 - 1:14:04)
pulls a building permit and they're finished with their work, I don't know who would know the answer to this, do does the building inspector have to go in and do an occupancy?

[Speaker 1] (1:14:06 - 1:14:08)
The building inspector does his occupancy permit.

[Speaker 1] (1:14:08 - 1:14:21)
What I would like to do and one of the things I would like to propose, now whether it's feasible for me to do it, I don't know, is that what I implemented in Westford when I started, we started working with the building inspector's office.

[Speaker 1] (1:14:22 - 1:14:29)
And the assessor's office became part of the signing off process for an occupancy permit.

[Speaker 1] (1:14:29 - 1:14:35)
And what that means is that a builder or a homeowner, they would do an extensive renovations, new construction,

[Speaker 1] (1:14:35 - 1:14:36)
addition,

[Speaker 1] (1:14:36 - 1:14:41)
whatever it was, before the building inspector released the occupancy permit,

[Speaker 1] (1:14:42 - 1:14:44)
they had to come to my department first.

[Speaker 1] (1:14:45 - 1:14:46)
And we did the inspection,

[Speaker 1] (1:14:46 - 1:14:55)
and again, the idea here is that we walk in the door that we're trying to get the information as accurate as possible so that we can assess it correctly.

[Speaker 1] (1:14:56 - 1:15:01)
Once we did our job, then all the other permitting for plumbing, electrical,

[Speaker 1] (1:15:01 - 1:15:02)
everybody's in line,

[Speaker 1] (1:15:03 - 1:15:04)
everybody signed off.

[Speaker 1] (1:15:04 - 1:15:10)
At that point, then the building commissioner would issue the occupancy permit. The

[Speaker 1] (1:15:12 - 1:15:13)
thing with doing...

[Speaker 1] (1:15:13 - 1:15:19)
Permit inspections after the fact is the odds of getting into a home afterwards are

[Speaker 5] (1:15:19 - 1:15:19)
Hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:15:19 - 1:15:21)
basically nil.

[Speaker 1] (1:15:29 - 1:15:37)
So we're looking at, you know, there's a lot of information with the building department and I've utilized OpenGov a lot.

[Speaker 5] (1:15:38 - 1:15:42)
Do we have software that comes into the

[Speaker 1] (1:15:45 - 1:15:48)
It doesn't come to my office, I have access to it.

[Speaker 5] (1:15:48 - 1:15:48)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:15:48 - 1:15:50)
And so what I do from there is like, you know,

[Speaker 1] (1:15:50 - 1:15:53)
if Patriot's going to do data entry to enter the permit information,

[Speaker 1] (1:15:54 - 1:16:09)
I run a report from them. But what I've done is when I'm have looked at neighbourhoods or any house basically, is is I'm looking at building permits and where I can't find anything more recent because I'm not sure how far back.

[Speaker 1] (1:16:09 - 1:16:35)
open gov does does go I'll ask for any archived information and I've looked at those as well and in the process I've actually saved all this stuff in a separate folder on my desktop so there I would find building plans and then I kind of review the building plans to the sketch that I'm looking at and if things look like they match great if they look like they might be off then I may go in and alter the sketch

[Speaker 1] (1:16:35 - 1:16:48)
sketch or I'll just delete it and start the sketch all over again. But again, when you start looking at a you know four, five, six, eight thousand square foot house, no not easy to do. It's it's very time-consuming.

[Speaker 1] (1:16:51 - 1:16:54)
But open God there's a lot of information there, a lot.

[Speaker 1] (1:16:58 - 1:17:04)
I mean also I don't look just at the plum at installing permits, I looked at plumbing and electrical as well.

[Speaker 1] (1:17:07 - 1:17:08)
No stone unturned.

[Speaker 2] (1:17:12 - 1:17:16)
Okay, a lot of information, appreciate the backdrop,

[Speaker 2] (1:17:16 - 1:17:22)
but we will, I think, move on to the presentation if you don't mind.

[Speaker 2] (1:17:22 - 1:17:23)
Diane, do you have that?

[Speaker 1] (1:17:39 - 1:17:46)
So the start is one to make sure that we all know that these are basically proposed numbers that I'm looking at.

[Speaker 1] (1:17:47 - 1:17:53)
Once the board issues and I have signatures, it'll be submitted to the Department of Revenue,

[Speaker 1] (1:17:53 - 1:18:00)
at which point they will review the information and then we'll pay for their review and certification.

[Speaker 2] (1:18:00 - 1:18:04)
Excuse me, Paul, one second. Doug, can you see the slides through Teams?

[Speaker 3] (1:18:06 - 1:18:07)
Yes, I can.

[Speaker 2] (1:18:07 - 1:18:08)
Okay, thank you. Go ahead, sorry.

[Speaker 1] (1:18:10 - 1:18:17)
So right now, as we stand now, that the total taxable value in town is well over $5 billion.

[Speaker 1] (1:18:18 - 1:18:21)
That's an increase of about 4% from FY25.

[Speaker 1] (1:18:22 - 1:18:29)
So this is where we are is looking at all the neighborhoods, single families, condos, everything else,

[Speaker 1] (1:18:29 - 1:18:30)
any increase in value.

[Speaker 1] (1:18:30 - 1:18:33)
So there has been an increase in value from last year.

[Speaker 1] (1:18:34 - 1:18:36)
On the grand total, about four percent.

[Speaker 1] (1:18:42 - 1:18:42)
That was all.

[Speaker 5] (1:18:43 - 1:18:47)
Does that include any of our does that also c include the elementary school?

[Speaker 1] (1:18:47 - 1:18:48)
Pardon?

[Speaker 5] (1:18:48 - 1:18:49)
Does that include the elementary school?

[Speaker 1] (1:18:50 - 1:18:54)
The elementary school is an exempt property, so that is not taxable.

[Speaker 5] (1:18:54 - 1:18:55)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:18:55 - 1:18:59)
I mean there are there is a value for exempt properties which we do account for every year

[Speaker 5] (1:18:59 - 1:19:00)
This is taxable.

[Speaker 1] (1:19:00 - 1:19:00)
to follow our

[Speaker 5] (1:19:00 - 1:19:01)
I'm just thinking of asset.

[Speaker 5] (1:19:02 - 1:19:02)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:19:04 - 1:19:10)
New growth this year, the number here that you see of $41 million in growth value,

[Speaker 1] (1:19:10 - 1:19:18)
when I first looked at it, the numbers were coming in and they looked at it called odd numbers. What I didn't do and it was to,

[Speaker 1] (1:19:19 - 1:19:24)
I have to account for or remove any abatements that were done this year which would alter that growth.

[Speaker 1] (1:19:25 - 1:19:36)
So right now what would be looking at proposing to the Department of Revenue is probably about 38 million dollars plus in new growth value.

[Speaker 1] (1:19:37 - 1:19:45)
That would transfer if everything is approved of about 492 thousand dollars in growth revenue.

[Speaker 1] (1:19:46 - 1:19:54)
$491,497 assuming everything gets approved and certified.

[Speaker 1] (1:19:54 - 1:20:02)
So that's an increase from last year of about 22% from last year's growth value,

[Speaker 1] (1:20:02 - 1:20:03)
growth revenue,

[Speaker 1] (1:20:03 - 1:20:04)
which was around $400,000.

[Speaker 1] (1:20:07 - 1:20:09)
So how we look at growth?

[Speaker 1] (1:20:10 - 1:20:21)
is, you know, we kind of look at, we're looking at building permits, MLS, any information, any changes in the property that we're now assessing that we hadn't assessed in the past constitutes new growth.

[Speaker 1] (1:20:29 - 1:20:30)
So right now...

[Speaker 1] (1:20:32 - 1:20:34)
You know, Patrick's still doing his thing.

[Speaker 1] (1:20:34 - 1:20:41)
The estimated levy that I took is kind of what's currently showing with the Department of Revenue and part of the recap.

[Speaker 1] (1:20:41 - 1:20:42)
So again,

[Speaker 1] (1:20:42 - 1:20:44)
for illustrative purposes,

[Speaker 1] (1:20:44 - 1:20:45)
we're going to go with that number.

[Speaker 1] (1:20:46 - 1:20:59)
So the proposed single tax rate based on a $65 million levy against the $5 billion taxable value of properties in town is $13.01.

[Speaker 1] (1:21:00 - 1:21:02)
So historically,

[Speaker 1] (1:21:02 - 1:21:08)
Swampscott has shifted for the full max on commercial,

[Speaker 1] (1:21:08 - 1:21:10)
industrial personal property,

[Speaker 1] (1:21:10 - 1:21:14)
and so also looking at the minimum residential factor.

[Speaker 1] (1:21:15 - 1:21:25)
So assuming that the board will be doing the same thing, and I can't imagine that you won't, the residential rate would be looking around $12.33,

[Speaker 1] (1:21:25 - 1:21:27)
which is an increase from last year,

[Speaker 1] (1:21:27 - 1:21:28)
which was $11.47.

[Speaker 1] (1:21:30 - 1:21:35)
The commercial properties are projected to be about $22.88.

[Speaker 1] (1:21:37 - 1:21:45)
And these numbers may change a little bit once we have the final levy number.

[Speaker 2] (1:21:50 - 1:21:52)
What's the current commercial rate?

[Speaker 3] (1:21:52 - 1:21:53)
Oh my

[Speaker 2] (1:21:53 - 1:21:53)
You

[Speaker 3] (1:21:53 - 1:21:53)
God.

[Speaker 2] (1:21:53 - 1:21:58)
said that the current residential was eleven uh forty seven, but what's commercial?

[Speaker 1] (1:21:58 - 1:22:04)
Yeah, um yeah, the residential rate last year was eleven forty seven, so what's proposed is twelve thirty three.

[Speaker 2] (1:22:04 - 1:22:04)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (1:22:04 - 1:22:17)
Uh the commo commercial, the C_I_P_ rate for F_ Y_ twenty six, we're pr looking at proposal of twenty two dollars and eighty eight cents, and that is up from what it right now I believe it's twenty one dollars and

[Speaker 1] (1:22:18 - 1:22:20)
I think seventy something cents, yeah.

[Speaker 2] (1:22:20 - 1:22:20)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:22:26 - 1:22:44)
So quick look, it was kind of a little bit down and dirty, um looking at what the average assessed single family is, um based on the information as is, that average single family assessment is at nine hundred fifty one thousand dollars.

[Speaker 1] (1:22:45 - 1:22:57)
And so that means that the average single family is going to see an increase in their taxes based on what we know right now, and that average will go up about $1,100 a year.

[Speaker 1] (1:23:01 - 1:23:04)
And I haven't looked at median value yet.

[Speaker 1] (1:23:09 - 1:23:20)
So last year's average tax was ten thousand six hundred and eighteen dollars. This year we're projecting that to be eleven thousand seven hundred thirty dollars.

[Speaker 1] (1:23:28 - 1:23:33)
And so as the levy changes goes up or down you know taxes will change too.

[Speaker 2] (1:23:38 - 1:23:38)
So

[Speaker 4] (1:23:38 - 1:23:38)
Community

[Speaker 2] (1:23:38 - 1:23:38)
you can turn

[Speaker 4] (1:23:38 - 1:23:39)
Preservation

[Speaker 2] (1:23:39 - 1:23:39)
the parts.

[Speaker 4] (1:23:39 - 1:23:39)
Act.

[Speaker 5] (1:23:39 - 1:23:39)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (1:23:40 - 1:23:41)
Let's

[Speaker 1] (1:23:41 - 1:23:41)
Oh, the

[Speaker 2] (1:23:41 - 1:23:41)
see. Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (1:23:41 - 1:23:42)
Community Preservation Act? Yeah.

[Speaker 2] (1:23:42 - 1:23:43)
Community Preservation Act.

[Speaker 1] (1:23:43 - 1:24:03)
So this year the Community Preservation Act is new. Um that does not impact the overlay at all, that's counted separately. And so yes, the activity preservation act is gonna add a little bit more on top of that tax bill. Um but Swampscott is actually, you know, with the hundred thousand exemption and I believe you went to a h one and a half percent? Is that correct?

[Speaker 4] (1:24:03 - 1:24:04)
Yep.

[Speaker 1] (1:24:04 - 1:24:04)
Yeah.

[Speaker 2] (1:24:04 - 1:24:04)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (1:24:04 - 1:24:05)
So

[Speaker 1] (1:24:06 - 1:24:09)
It really becomes that little extra surcharge on your tax.

[Speaker 6] (1:24:10 - 1:24:14)
What was the average on that on that extra surcharge?

[Speaker 2] (1:24:17 - 1:24:18)
I don't recall.

[Speaker 6] (1:24:18 - 1:24:19)
The average annual cost?

[Speaker 2] (1:24:20 - 1:24:21)
Doug, do you recall?

[Speaker 6] (1:24:22 - 1:24:22)
Doug must know.

[Speaker 7] (1:24:23 - 1:24:27)
Yeah, I think it was just uh I don't know the figure somewhere between 100 and 150.

[Speaker 6] (1:24:27 - 1:24:30)
Yeah, 137 for some reason is sticking in my head.

[Speaker 6] (1:24:32 - 1:24:33)
It is weird,

[Speaker 8] (1:24:33 - 1:24:33)
And

[Speaker 6] (1:24:33 - 1:24:35)
I know. we've also had an increase in water and sewer.

[Speaker 7] (1:24:39 - 1:24:43)
Yeah, so how does this 10.5% compare to prior years?

[Speaker 7] (1:24:44 - 1:24:45)
Does anybody know that off?

[Speaker 1] (1:24:46 - 1:24:47)
Yeah, I had not looked at prior years.

[Speaker 1] (1:24:47 - 1:24:49)
All this was done at 8 o'clock last night.

[Speaker 6] (1:24:52 - 1:24:53)
Patrick, do you have any idea?

[Speaker 9] (1:24:54 - 1:25:10)
Off the top of my head I don't have a solid comparison. I know we've seen some decent leaps the last few years generally because of trends in property values. I think Paul would agree with that statement. But we can get that data for the board ahead of the classification hearing.

[Speaker 7] (1:25:14 - 1:25:16)
So, I don't know if it's Paul or Patrick,

[Speaker 7] (1:25:16 - 1:25:19)
just help me or maybe others understand,

[Speaker 7] (1:25:19 - 1:25:20)
you know, if the

[Speaker 7] (1:25:21 - 1:25:24)
The value of a single family home is going up 3%.

[Speaker 1] (1:25:24 - 1:25:26)
Yes, based

[Speaker 7] (1:25:26 - 1:25:27)
Sure.

[Speaker 1] (1:25:27 - 1:25:28)
on last year's average,

[Speaker 1] (1:25:28 - 1:25:28)
correct.

[Speaker 7] (1:25:29 - 1:25:30)
Sure. And why is the,

[Speaker 7] (1:25:31 - 1:25:34)
I mean, I don't know about anyone else,

[Speaker 7] (1:25:34 - 1:25:38)
but unless there's something that I'm missing here,

[Speaker 7] (1:25:38 - 1:25:40)
this 10.5% is pretty alarming.

[Speaker 7] (1:25:42 - 1:25:47)
Why is it going up 10.5 if the single family home is going up in three?

[Speaker 7] (1:25:48 - 1:25:49)
Does it have something to do with the levy?

[Speaker 1] (1:25:49 - 1:25:50)
Yes, it's

[Speaker 6] (1:25:50 - 1:25:50)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (1:25:50 - 1:25:52)
always based on the levy.

[Speaker 7] (1:25:53 - 1:25:53)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (1:25:53 - 1:25:54)
Property

[Speaker 7] (1:25:54 - 1:25:54)
Does

[Speaker 1] (1:25:54 - 1:25:54)
values

[Speaker 7] (1:25:54 - 1:25:54)
it mean the levy

[Speaker 1] (1:25:54 - 1:25:54)
create

[Speaker 7] (1:25:54 - 1:25:55)
is going

[Speaker 1] (1:25:55 - 1:25:55)
a

[Speaker 7] (1:25:55 - 1:25:55)
up,

[Speaker 1] (1:25:55 - 1:25:55)
levy.

[Speaker 7] (1:25:55 - 1:25:56)
but is it particularly,

[Speaker 7] (1:25:56 - 1:25:57)
but

[Speaker 6] (1:25:58 - 1:25:59)
Because of our spending.

[Speaker 7] (1:25:59 - 1:26:00)
it's going up,

[Speaker 6] (1:26:01 - 1:26:02)
It's how much we're spending,

[Speaker 6] (1:26:02 - 1:26:02)
Doug.

[Speaker 7] (1:26:07 - 1:26:08)
so this levy is not about the spending.

[Speaker 6] (1:26:10 - 1:26:14)
The levy is going to have to cover how much we're spending.

[Speaker 1] (1:26:22 - 1:26:24)
the staff to be able to provide this to you.

[Speaker 1] (1:26:25 - 1:26:26)
Rather than the

[Speaker 6] (1:26:26 - 1:26:26)
Oh, okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:26:26 - 1:26:27)
PowerPoint.

[Speaker 1] (1:26:27 - 1:26:38)
The current tax levy that we're we're that's being estimated right now is twelve percent and over last year's tax levy. So your tax levy has gone up.

[Speaker 1] (1:26:39 - 1:26:39)
Uh-huh.

[Speaker 1] (1:26:43 - 1:26:49)
And again, these are all just prop proposed numbers. Um you know the final numbers aren't there yet.

[Speaker 2] (1:27:07 - 1:27:07)
additional questions?

[Speaker 10] (1:27:11 - 1:27:14)
Where are we with having a full-time assessor?

[Speaker 11] (1:27:15 - 1:27:17)
As I mentioned at the beginning,

[Speaker 2] (1:27:17 - 1:27:18)
I think we also

[Speaker 11] (1:27:18 - 1:27:21)
we'll be re reposting at a new salary.

[Speaker 10] (1:27:21 - 1:27:22)
Thank you.

[Speaker 11] (1:27:22 - 1:27:28)
This is one of the few positions, and I put it in with Rich as an example, where it has a very specific impact

[Speaker 10] (1:27:28 - 1:27:28)
Yeah.

[Speaker 11] (1:27:28 - 1:27:29)
on

[Speaker 10] (1:27:29 - 1:27:29)
Oh, for sure.

[Speaker 11] (1:27:29 - 1:27:33)
all of these questions, based on having someone that's able to be there.

[Speaker 11] (1:27:34 - 1:27:38)
Not just for 15 hours um but in a full-time capacity.

[Speaker 7] (1:27:39 - 1:27:39)
Yep.

[Speaker 11] (1:27:40 - 1:27:49)
So yes, we will be reposting with a new salary, that was part of why it was raised there a couple weeks ago, I met with the assessors as a board and Paul was that last week?

[Speaker 7] (1:27:49 - 1:27:50)
Yep.

[Speaker 11] (1:27:50 - 1:28:00)
Um I'm sorry, one week becomes the next. Um anyway they had raised it, I had heard it from you all, but we wanted to complete the survey so that it was not simply

[Speaker 11] (1:28:02 - 1:28:07)
four or five of us or six of us saying it should be more and not knowing what that's based on or from.

[Speaker 11] (1:28:10 - 1:28:12)
Is that the last slide that you have?

[Speaker 2] (1:28:12 - 1:28:12)
It

[Speaker 1] (1:28:12 - 1:28:12)
Yes.

[Speaker 2] (1:28:12 - 1:28:13)
is.

[Speaker 11] (1:28:13 - 1:28:19)
So could we walk through what the steps are as things are finalised so that the board is aware of what the next steps are in there?

[Speaker 1] (1:28:19 - 1:28:25)
So the next step would be for the values of what we call the LA-4,

[Speaker 1] (1:28:25 - 1:28:27)
which has to be submitted to the Department of Revenue.

[Speaker 1] (1:28:29 - 1:28:33)
That'll be done once the board makes that decision and votes on it then

[Speaker 11] (1:28:33 - 1:28:33)
The

[Speaker 1] (1:28:33 - 1:28:33)
I will

[Speaker 11] (1:28:33 - 1:28:33)
Board

[Speaker 1] (1:28:33 - 1:28:33)
submit

[Speaker 11] (1:28:33 - 1:28:34)
of Assessors,

[Speaker 1] (1:28:34 - 1:28:34)
it.

[Speaker 11] (1:28:34 - 1:28:37)
the Board of Assessors you're talking about, not the Select Board.

[Speaker 1] (1:28:37 - 1:28:56)
Oh select board yeah so I mean at this point select board really can't move further until the Board of Assessors gets their signatures on there and submits with the LA for which is our value report and the LA 13 which is our growth report and once those things get approved then

[Speaker 1] (1:28:58 - 1:29:03)
From the board of assessor's perspective, we've kind of done, they've done their part.

[Speaker 1] (1:29:03 - 1:29:16)
At that point, you know, then classification, yes, would be you know you'd be having classification to vote on the final numbers, but that won't happen until special town meeting to wrap up all financial pieces.

[Speaker 1] (1:29:17 - 1:29:19)
So once that's done and the recap's completed

[Speaker 2] (1:29:28 - 1:29:30)
What is the date that we have to get our rate in by?

[Speaker 3] (1:29:35 - 1:29:44)
Well, the bills must be sent out by December 31st. So I think last year we submitted around December 12th or so, and it takes a couple days to get.

[Speaker 3] (1:29:45 - 1:29:47)
Approval for on the entire tax rate recap

[Speaker 2] (1:29:47 - 1:29:49)
So you're saying we need to bring this...

[Speaker 4] (1:29:50 - 1:29:50)
To the next

[Speaker 2] (1:29:50 - 1:29:50)
Oh,

[Speaker 4] (1:29:50 - 1:29:50)
meeting.

[Speaker 2] (1:29:50 - 1:29:55)
so then how do we do it? What's the timing looking like because we need town meeting first?

[Speaker 4] (1:29:56 - 1:29:57)
Well, we have a meeting on the third.

[Speaker 1] (1:29:58 - 1:29:58)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (1:29:58 - 1:29:58)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (1:29:59 - 1:30:06)
So town meeting is the first, maybe the second. We meet again the third. I don't want to put that out there either,

[Speaker 4] (1:30:06 - 1:30:07)
but I'm being practical.

[Speaker 4] (1:30:08 - 1:30:09)
And then we would meet the third.

[Speaker 4] (1:30:10 - 1:30:11)
we could tackle this.

[Speaker 4] (1:30:12 - 1:30:15)
Then so long as the assessor's piece is

[Speaker 1] (1:30:15 - 1:30:23)
Yeah, once everything gets submitted from from our end, I mean I would hope that within a week everything would get approved.

[Speaker 5] (1:30:25 - 1:30:26)
So we have to if I if

[Speaker 2] (1:30:26 - 1:30:28)
don't even know what I've already done on the board.

[Speaker 5] (1:30:28 - 1:30:35)
so uh that's what I was going to address if we have the assessor's work complete, we anticipate

[Speaker 5] (1:30:35 - 1:30:48)
that the I'm just trying to think how we can get back in front of you with more complete information, even if it means we need to do like a that complete information review give you time and then meet remotely perhaps

[Speaker 1] (1:30:48 - 1:30:49)
On the 10th.

[Speaker 5] (1:30:49 - 1:30:51)
or hybrid, so

[Speaker 4] (1:30:51 - 1:30:51)
We're

[Speaker 5] (1:30:51 - 1:30:55)
we don't have to wait until the seventeenth is all I'm saying. We could also wait i i you know.

[Speaker 1] (1:30:57 - 1:30:59)
Yeah, I could probably get them all both done

[Speaker 5] (1:30:59 - 1:31:00)
So

[Speaker 1] (1:31:00 - 1:31:00)
tomorrow.

[Speaker 5] (1:31:00 - 1:31:02)
if you'd like I can work with Paul

[Speaker 5] (1:31:02 - 1:31:02)
In advance

[Speaker 6] (1:31:02 - 1:31:03)
Here we go.

[Speaker 5] (1:31:03 - 1:31:23)
of town meeting, we have a select board meeting at eve I can make this part of the agenda for the night one to give you an update on where we are and that way we can make sure that we are setting up a timeline that is doable from your standpoint that works in what has been completed by the assessor and it turns it around as quickly as possible to get everything into DOR.

[Speaker 5] (1:31:24 - 1:31:33)
But if if I am if we can decide that the agenda for the first so that I I have the ability to speak to you all about it in the right before town meeting just so it's

[Speaker 4] (1:31:33 - 1:31:33)
Oh

[Speaker 5] (1:31:33 - 1:31:33)
an open

[Speaker 4] (1:31:33 - 1:31:34)
because

[Speaker 5] (1:31:34 - 1:31:34)
meeting.

[Speaker 4] (1:31:34 - 1:31:35)
we have a posted meeting right before the town.

[Speaker 2] (1:31:35 - 1:31:36)
Right.

[Speaker 5] (1:31:36 - 1:31:36)
Correct.

[Speaker 4] (1:31:36 - 1:31:37)
Got it. Okay.

[Speaker 4] (1:31:37 - 1:31:39)
It's going to be sick of each other that week.

[Speaker 5] (1:31:41 - 1:31:49)
And perhaps put a placeholder on the third that we can just push if we're not ready for it so that that also can be posted in advance of Thanksgiving,

[Speaker 2] (1:31:49 - 1:31:49)
Yep.

[Speaker 5] (1:31:49 - 1:31:50)
just so we all know.

[Speaker 5] (1:31:50 - 1:31:51)
Does that work for the board?

[Speaker 1] (1:31:51 - 1:31:52)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 5] (1:31:52 - 1:31:57)
And Paul, you and I can work on details of what works when and timing as we get closer to it.

[Speaker 1] (1:31:57 - 1:32:00)
The sooner we can get things submitted,

[Speaker 1] (1:32:00 - 1:32:04)
and then again I have no control of the department of revenue,

[Speaker 1] (1:32:04 - 1:32:09)
but I would certainly hope within a week that we would hear something.

[Speaker 5] (1:32:09 - 1:32:10)
So you and I can talk.

[Speaker 5] (1:32:11 - 1:32:14)
You know tomorrow and this week and then also the beginning of next week.

[Speaker 1] (1:32:14 - 1:32:14)
Yeah,

[Speaker 5] (1:32:14 - 1:32:15)
So that's

[Speaker 1] (1:32:15 - 1:32:15)
we

[Speaker 5] (1:32:15 - 1:32:15)
that's it.

[Speaker 1] (1:32:15 - 1:32:17)
do have a board meeting tomorrow.

[Speaker 1] (1:32:17 - 1:32:21)
So I until tomorrow happens, I don't know what's going to happen.

[Speaker 5] (1:32:21 - 1:32:39)
Of course, I just me I want to be in touch with you throughout the next ten days So that when we sit down on the first day of as full a picture as possible we have a placeholder for the third in case we have the opportunity to do something and To the idea that we want to share the information and then have time to digest it we can decide if we want to do a remote meeting or how we want to proceed

[Speaker 5] (1:32:39 - 1:32:46)
But I'm going to have it posted for the first, for me to give you all an update, and a place-holder on the third so you can act on it assuming everything goes

[Speaker 5] (1:32:48 - 1:32:52)
as quickly as possible with every one I everything that's outside of the control of the board, if that works for you all.

[Speaker 2] (1:32:53 - 1:32:54)
Yes please.

[Speaker 5] (1:32:54 - 1:32:55)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (1:32:55 - 1:32:56)
That's great. Okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:32:56 - 1:32:57)
Yeah, I'll keep you in the loop, I mean

[Speaker 5] (1:32:57 - 1:32:57)
Perfect.

[Speaker 1] (1:32:57 - 1:32:59)
as we things progress.

[Speaker 5] (1:33:00 - 1:33:00)
Perfect.

[Speaker 4] (1:33:01 - 1:33:04)
Okay, anything else for Paul or the board of assessors?

[Speaker 2] (1:33:06 - 1:33:15)
The only question I would have is if we wanted to get this community up to speed in less than the three to five years that you're forecasting out,

[Speaker 2] (1:33:15 - 1:33:22)
because within that three to five years there's an overall town evaluation.

[Speaker 2] (1:33:23 - 1:33:25)
When we do our town evaluations,

[Speaker 2] (1:33:25 - 1:33:26)
do we do them every five?

[Speaker 1] (1:33:27 - 1:33:28)
They're done annually.

[Speaker 5] (1:33:29 - 1:33:30)
We

[Speaker 2] (1:33:30 - 1:33:31)
No, no, the whole the big town

[Speaker 1] (1:33:31 - 1:33:31)
A recertification

[Speaker 2] (1:33:31 - 1:33:32)
the whole big town

[Speaker 1] (1:33:32 - 1:33:34)
is done every five years now.

[Speaker 2] (1:33:34 - 1:33:36)
Okay, so that's coming

[Speaker 1] (1:33:36 - 1:33:36)
And I

[Speaker 2] (1:33:36 - 1:33:36)
up

[Speaker 1] (1:33:36 - 1:33:40)
haven't checked, but I think FY27 might be a recert year.

[Speaker 2] (1:33:40 - 1:33:48)
I think what I'm trying to get to is what really is the return on investment if we were to get,

[Speaker 2] (1:33:48 - 1:33:50)
if the whole town were to be balanced out,

[Speaker 2] (1:33:50 - 1:33:52)
such as those two neighborhoods.

[Speaker 2] (1:33:55 - 1:34:00)
Like what if if we were to spend X amount of dollars, what would we get back in return?

[Speaker 1] (1:34:01 - 1:34:05)
I don't know if I can answer that. I mean, what what I would hope is that there'd be

[Speaker 2] (1:34:05 - 1:34:06)
Like,

[Speaker 1] (1:34:06 - 1:34:11)
uh more control within the assessor's office, that there'd be um

[Speaker 5] (1:34:11 - 1:34:11)
Mm.

[Speaker 1] (1:34:12 - 1:34:40)
better accounting, you know, looking at building permits so that we're not um, you know, missing things. You know, sometimes that happens. Um, you know getting more done in-house is something I I believe in and I always have, even when I was working full-time, um because then I can control or the assessor can control what's happening, not just in the office, but when you're also have more control about valuations and how you're moving forward.

[Speaker 1] (1:34:40 - 1:34:48)
forward, as an assessor, I c always could explain to any taxpayer what occurred, what happened, and why, because I'm the guy that did it.

[Speaker 1] (1:34:49 - 1:34:51)
But when you have lots of moving

[Speaker 1] (1:34:52 - 1:35:15)
pieces around, it's kind of difficult to t to g get a hold of of everything. Um I I think from my perspective that it'd be in the town's best interest to to be able to have that, you know, so that you can continue, you know, having consistency and uniformity in that, you know, looking through there. Um new growth is a big factor I mean especially I think

[Speaker 1] (1:35:16 - 1:35:31)
Assessor's office I think town is kind of live and die by having that new growth and of course the more new growth you can capture then I think that you know the town is better off in the long run and again it's just you want to make sure that

[Speaker 1] (1:35:32 - 1:35:35)
If you talk about equity in assessing or taxation,

[Speaker 1] (1:35:36 - 1:35:50)
then it has to be really applied across the board in making sure that, yeah, you know, like you've got a permit for a new kitchen that I got you for that new kitchen that it didn't kind of slide behind. Slide behind.

[Speaker 1] (1:35:50 - 1:35:56)
If you have permits for $300,000 for a new kitchen and I say, oh, I went from average to good.

[Speaker 1] (1:35:57 - 1:35:58)
Well, you know,

[Speaker 1] (1:35:58 - 1:35:59)
you're c you're making out um

[Speaker 2] (1:35:59 - 1:36:00)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (1:36:00 - 1:36:04)
on this because that means you have a much nicer upgraded

[Speaker 2] (1:36:04 - 1:36:04)
Kitchen

[Speaker 1] (1:36:04 - 1:36:05)
right

[Speaker 2] (1:36:05 - 1:36:05)
and paying for

[Speaker 1] (1:36:05 - 1:36:05)
custom

[Speaker 2] (1:36:05 - 1:36:05)
it.

[Speaker 1] (1:36:05 - 1:36:09)
kitchen. And and so the assessment should reflect those things.

[Speaker 1] (1:36:09 - 1:36:12)
So there's a lot there that we could look at.

[Speaker 1] (1:36:13 - 1:36:14)
But again,

[Speaker 1] (1:36:14 - 1:36:15)
it's it's just being

[Speaker 2] (1:36:15 - 1:36:16)
Time.

[Speaker 1] (1:36:16 - 1:36:19)
able to have some of that manpower to do that.

[Speaker 1] (1:36:19 - 1:36:26)
When I was working full-time I had I was myself, a full-time assistant assessor and three admin staff.

[Speaker 1] (1:36:27 - 1:36:33)
So, you know, can we do a lot more with that? Sure, you know, I'm not proposing you go to that extreme,

[Speaker 1] (1:36:34 - 1:36:36)
but having enough

[Speaker 1] (1:36:37 - 1:36:38)
um

[Speaker 2] (1:36:38 - 1:36:38)
Manpower.

[Speaker 1] (1:36:38 - 1:36:43)
enough help in in the office you know, it it is it isn't a big deal,

[Speaker 7] (1:36:43 - 1:36:43)
So,

[Speaker 1] (1:36:43 - 1:36:43)
I guess.

[Speaker 7] (1:36:43 - 1:36:45)
there's two sides to the benefit,

[Speaker 7] (1:36:45 - 1:36:47)
the one side is the tax rate.

[Speaker 4] (1:36:47 - 1:36:49)
Yeah, would you mind passing the mic

[Speaker 1] (1:36:49 - 1:36:49)
Oh,

[Speaker 4] (1:36:49 - 1:36:49)
just so

[Speaker 1] (1:36:49 - 1:36:49)
sorry.

[Speaker 4] (1:36:49 - 1:36:50)
folks at home can hear?

[Speaker 7] (1:36:50 - 1:36:51)
Thank you.

[Speaker 7] (1:36:51 - 1:36:53)
There's two sides of the benefit to

[Speaker 7] (1:36:53 - 1:36:54)
to Marianne's question,

[Speaker 7] (1:36:55 - 1:37:03)
when is the tax rate that the town collects to be able to operate and fund our expenses? But the other side that no one's spoken about is the tax payer,

[Speaker 7] (1:37:04 - 1:37:05)
the residents of the town.

[Speaker 7] (1:37:06 - 1:37:10)
And so when you take a look at a property that's properly valued,

[Speaker 7] (1:37:10 - 1:37:18)
you see a tax rate that is adjusted to the needs of the town with a fully market-valued appraised property.

[Speaker 7] (1:37:19 - 1:37:21)
There's no such thing as equity in taxes,

[Speaker 7] (1:37:21 - 1:37:23)
but there's equity in ownership.

[Speaker 7] (1:37:23 - 1:37:31)
And so when your house is properly valued at full market value and your tax rate is a little lower because your rate of value is higher,

[Speaker 7] (1:37:31 - 1:37:38)
in the end, the benefit to the town is you still collect what you needed to because you'll adjust your tax rate to get there.

[Speaker 7] (1:37:38 - 1:37:40)
But to the homeowner,

[Speaker 7] (1:37:40 - 1:37:43)
my home is worth more. And let me give you a practical example.

[Speaker 7] (1:37:44 - 1:37:48)
When I first moved here in 1990 and I looked at Marblehead and I looked at Swampscot,

[Speaker 7] (1:37:49 - 1:37:55)
my realtor said to me I could buy more house in Swampscot because the value was lower and I could get more house.

[Speaker 7] (1:37:55 - 1:38:05)
But he did not tell me or she did not tell me that my tax rate would be a little higher because my value was a little lower because this town still needs to run its operation.

[Speaker 7] (1:38:06 - 1:38:11)
So if we properly value our homes, you have the opportunity to set a tax rate.

[Speaker 7] (1:38:12 - 1:38:20)
That it meets the needs are not just an unbalanced or not a full valued property.

[Speaker 7] (1:38:20 - 1:38:22)
So now the homeowner gets to say,

[Speaker 7] (1:38:22 - 1:38:26)
I have a problem that's actually a blessing.

[Speaker 7] (1:38:26 - 1:38:29)
My home is worth more, my taxes cost less,

[Speaker 7] (1:38:29 - 1:38:31)
and I have equity in my home.

[Speaker 7] (1:38:31 - 1:38:38)
Would you rather have equity in your home that's worth more with a lower tax rate or home that's worth less with a higher tax rate?

[Speaker 7] (1:38:38 - 1:38:42)
That's the benefit, the full answer to Mary Ellen's question.

[Speaker 4] (1:38:44 - 1:38:56)
I think the other thing that, you know, sort of popped into my mind when Mary Ellen was saying that is like how we go about facilitating that more equitably?

[Speaker 4] (1:38:56 - 1:38:57)
Does it involve,

[Speaker 4] (1:38:58 - 1:39:03)
so yes, we hire a full-time assessor, but even that is going to still take years.

[Speaker 4] (1:39:04 - 1:39:09)
So is there consultants that come in and help us get it up to snuff faster?

[Speaker 4] (1:39:09 - 1:39:12)
And I think the question is what's the return on that happening?

[Speaker 4] (1:39:14 - 1:39:14)
Like that

[Speaker 1] (1:39:14 - 1:39:17)
Like that would be interesting to have more data points on that.

[Speaker 2] (1:39:17 - 1:39:26)
If we can look into that more, the one thing that the board of assessors sent me a letter soon after starting, it's not it's a full time assessor with Paul staying on for a period of time.

[Speaker 1] (1:39:26 - 1:39:26)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 2] (1:39:26 - 1:39:32)
Not only to get this person up to speed on the history as Paul has been able to figure it out here,

[Speaker 2] (1:39:32 - 1:39:36)
but also because of his his experience and expertise.

[Speaker 1] (1:39:36 - 1:39:36)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 2] (1:39:36 - 1:39:40)
So if we if we are able to do both and figure out what that is,

[Speaker 2] (1:39:40 - 1:39:42)
it could be that not only is Paul helping someone.

[Speaker 2] (1:39:43 - 1:40:04)
get on their feet, but it could I'm speaking for you, we have not discussed this, potentially be that it's putting together a plan that says, you know, these are the types of resources you should look in-house, you should you can look outside. My concern not about I think we're all having a really good discussion my concern was sort of the penny-wise approach that was used in the past.

[Speaker 1] (1:40:04 - 1:40:04)
Right.

[Speaker 2] (1:40:04 - 1:40:06)
And so it might be that we come back with something that's

[Speaker 2] (1:40:08 - 1:40:29)
It costs money to get to Equitable more quickly, so that again it's applied as quickly and fairly as possible, um but I'd be happy to work with Paul and whoever from the Assessor's board is interested in figuring out what that could look like, so we do come back with more information for you all to react to, because I think the the point is well raised, but I don't think we have enough information tonight to have a fruitful discussion for the

[Speaker 1] (1:40:29 - 1:40:29)
I agree.

[Speaker 2] (1:40:29 - 1:40:30)
point of view.

[Speaker 3] (1:40:30 - 1:40:34)
Part of getting you know values or assessments more you know

[Speaker 3] (1:40:35 - 1:40:40)
More equalized. It's in the details when you're looking at a property.

[Speaker 3] (1:40:40 - 1:40:51)
It's the little things that you're finding or not finding or that you find after the fact. And those are the little things that, you know, can add value to a property. But again,

[Speaker 3] (1:40:52 - 1:40:54)
when we're analyzing sales...

[Speaker 3] (1:40:54 - 1:41:02)
The first step is, you know, what did we, what is it that we need to find about this property? And fortunately today with, you know, listings,

[Speaker 3] (1:41:02 - 1:41:06)
pictures and great narratives about properties and everything else,

[Speaker 3] (1:41:07 - 1:41:13)
this is where we find that is part of our new growth, but we're reestablishing with that basis to see.

[Speaker 3] (1:41:14 - 1:41:21)
When you sell, eventually looking across town, when more of the details are in this range,

[Speaker 3] (1:41:21 - 1:41:30)
then things do become more equitable because on a level that everyone is closer to where market value should be,

[Speaker 3] (1:41:30 - 1:41:33)
and market value is always changing, you know, whether,

[Speaker 3] (1:41:33 - 1:41:41)
and the values were to come downtown-wide, but you have a high tax levy, it just means you're going to have a higher tax rate and you're still going to have to

[Speaker 3] (1:41:42 - 1:42:03)
pay taxes to meet the levy and so the board of assessors we don't control the levy you know we're just on the back end our job is really is valuation and you know I mean it's simply you know value times tax rate equals the tax of that your portion of that of that very big pie

[Speaker 1] (1:42:06 - 1:42:06)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:07 - 1:42:08)
Thank you very much.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:09 - 1:42:09)
Thank you, guys.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:11 - 1:42:13)
I look forward to the next meeting.

[Speaker 2] (1:42:13 - 1:42:14)
Sounds good.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:14 - 1:42:16)
You guys need to adjourn your meeting.

[Speaker 4] (1:42:16 - 1:42:17)
Thank you, Paul.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:17 - 1:42:18)
Thank you, Paul,

[Speaker 1] (1:42:18 - 1:42:19)
very much.

[Speaker 3] (1:42:19 - 1:42:20)
I'm not the bearer of good news.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:24 - 1:42:25)
Very good.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:26 - 1:42:28)
All right. Thank you both for joining us.

[Speaker 4] (1:42:28 - 1:42:29)
Thank you all.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:31 - 1:42:33)
We are moving on then to

[Speaker 1] (1:42:35 - 1:42:39)
Item number four, presentation and discussion of the Hawthorne Reviews Advisory Committee recommendation.

[Speaker 1] (1:42:58 - 1:43:04)
So with us we have chair of the Hawthorne use committee Brian Watson and I think another member Tara.

[Speaker 5] (1:43:05 - 1:43:05)
I'm

[Speaker 1] (1:43:05 - 1:43:05)
Just

[Speaker 5] (1:43:05 - 1:43:05)
the secretary.

[Speaker 1] (1:43:05 - 1:43:07)
here for a, okay thanks.

[Speaker 1] (1:43:10 - 1:43:12)
So where shall we begin Brian?

[Speaker 6] (1:43:13 - 1:43:19)
Um my name's Brian Watson, I'm chairman of the Hawthorn Advisory Committee.

[Speaker 6] (1:43:19 - 1:43:28)
And I put together a short presentation that I'd like to go through without interruption and then, you know, we can talk and have questions at the end.

[Speaker 6] (1:43:28 - 1:43:39)
This presentation would take maybe 15 minutes and it will be useful in terms of giving you a framework of what we've done and reporting on our recommendations.

[Speaker 1] (1:43:40 - 1:43:40)
Okay,

[Speaker 3] (1:43:40 - 1:43:40)
Um,

[Speaker 1] (1:43:40 - 1:43:40)
I

[Speaker 3] (1:43:40 - 1:43:40)
okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:43:40 - 1:43:49)
will interrupt you even though you asked for no interruption, that there may be questions along the way and it may make sense to stop so we will do our best not to interrupt but in case we need clarity just

[Speaker 6] (1:43:49 - 1:43:50)
It it

[Speaker 1] (1:43:50 - 1:43:50)
say okay.

[Speaker 6] (1:43:50 - 1:44:02)
might be that I've anticipated some questions in putting together the presentation. I mean, I did try to do that, cover the obvious stuff when I left out the other stuff. So the Hawthorne Reuse Advisory Committee consists of

[Speaker 6] (1:44:03 - 1:44:04)
12 appointed members.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:04 - 1:44:07)
We were and are a very diverse group.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:07 - 1:44:15)
I joke to people that the Select Board managed to find 12 people who have more opinions than the full 14,000 in town.

[Speaker 2] (1:44:16 - 1:44:16)
That's true.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:16 - 1:44:22)
In any case, our first meeting was March 18th and we had 16 additional meetings.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:23 - 1:44:26)
We had a clear mission statement that we kept in mind.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:26 - 1:44:30)
One was to conduct a thorough analysis of the site,

[Speaker 6] (1:44:30 - 1:44:32)
identifying all the factors impacting development.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:33 - 1:44:40)
We defined clear goals and established explicit criteria with which to evaluate and compare plans.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:41 - 1:44:48)
We developed and drew a range of site plans and analyzed their strengths and weaknesses and tradeoffs.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:48 - 1:44:53)
And lastly, we kept in mind that we would ultimately need consensus, both the committee,

[Speaker 6] (1:44:53 - 1:44:56)
the select board, and then, of course, eventually the town itself.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:57 - 1:44:59)
around a single comprehensive plan.

[Speaker 6] (1:44:59 - 1:45:07)
So our committee did a ton of work before we started picking plans or rejecting plans or comparing plans.

[Speaker 6] (1:45:07 - 1:45:13)
Our committee really went about educating ourselves and on a wide variety of issues.

[Speaker 6] (1:45:14 - 1:45:22)
You might remember me standing up here a year or so ago saying if I participate in this committee I would do my best to help

[Speaker 6] (1:45:23 - 1:45:29)
contribute to a process that maybe filled in some gaps that didn't get filled in in the HDR process.

[Speaker 6] (1:45:30 - 1:45:41)
And at that time I said HDR left out a step and that step was facilitating the discussion about how does a town select a development plan.

[Speaker 6] (1:45:41 - 1:45:45)
What should be involved in that process? What does that process look like?

[Speaker 6] (1:45:45 - 1:45:46)
Well,

[Speaker 6] (1:45:46 - 1:45:52)
our Committee learned that missing step, and and we executed it, often very roughly,

[Speaker 6] (1:45:53 - 1:46:02)
and I know sometimes some of the Select Board was there and they observed with their own eyes, it was often contentious, but we did execute those steps and we really did educate ourselves.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:03 - 1:46:09)
We looked carefully at the Humphrey Street context and the history of the street and the site prior to 1967.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:09 - 1:46:10)
Prior to '67,

[Speaker 6] (1:46:10 - 1:46:13)
the Hawthorne building didn't exist.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:13 - 1:46:15)
We went as a group to the site.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:15 - 1:46:18)
We tried to grasp the size and scale of the lot.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:19 - 1:46:21)
We tried to picture various site plans on the lot.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:22 - 1:46:34)
A few of us even went out early on and chalk marked the parking lot and laid out some of the site plans just to give ourselves an idea of what size these buildings were and how would they fit on the site.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:35 - 1:46:44)
We drew and discussed about 20 site plans for the single lot and we drew and discussed about 10 plans for the potential double lot.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:44 - 1:46:47)
Depending upon which plan we were examining,

[Speaker 6] (1:46:47 - 1:46:49)
we discussed who,

[Speaker 6] (1:46:49 - 1:46:51)
the public sector or the private sector,

[Speaker 6] (1:46:51 - 1:46:53)
would build certain portions of each plan.

[Speaker 6] (1:46:53 - 1:46:58)
We discussed the possibility of selling or leasing a portion of the lot,

[Speaker 6] (1:46:58 - 1:47:01)
again depending upon the plan being examined.

[Speaker 6] (1:47:02 - 1:47:09)
We have studied the financial pictures in approximate and comparative plans of many of the different plans.

[Speaker 6] (1:47:09 - 1:47:09)
I'm sorry,

[Speaker 6] (1:47:09 - 1:47:11)
in approximate and comparative plans.

[Speaker 6] (1:47:11 - 1:47:13)
comparative terms of the many different plans.

[Speaker 6] (1:47:13 - 1:47:25)
And I will add, in light of the discussion tonight and so forth, our committee was extremely aware of how important the financial aspects of any plan would be. And we kept that in mind at all times.

[Speaker 6] (1:47:26 - 1:47:27)
Lastly and most important,

[Speaker 6] (1:47:27 - 1:47:36)
most important, we developed a list of factors, considerations and criteria for evaluating the pros and cons, the strengths and weaknesses of each plan.

[Speaker 6] (1:47:37 - 1:47:39)
To the extent possible, to the extent possible,

[Speaker 6] (1:47:40 - 1:47:44)
the committee strives to approach the problem with objective deliberation.

[Speaker 6] (1:47:45 - 1:47:49)
Diane, could you put Appendix D on the screen please?

[Speaker 6] (1:48:08 - 1:48:11)
Okay, well, they're a little hard to read, but that's all right.

[Speaker 1] (1:48:12 - 1:48:17)
Doug, can you see the slides through Teams?

[Speaker 6] (1:48:17 - 1:48:18)
They basically

[Speaker 2] (1:48:18 - 1:48:18)
Yeah.

[Speaker 6] (1:48:18 - 1:48:21)
show categories of concern.

[Speaker 6] (1:48:22 - 1:48:26)
You notice economics and financial concerns is first.

[Speaker 6] (1:48:27 - 1:48:30)
They're all very important. They're all to be considered simultaneously.

[Speaker 6] (1:48:30 - 1:48:35)
But with the financial factors, we weighed the revenue a plan would generate,

[Speaker 6] (1:48:35 - 1:48:37)
the cost to the town,

[Speaker 6] (1:48:37 - 1:48:40)
and then we did that for short term and long term.

[Speaker 6] (1:48:40 - 1:48:45)
So we didn't look just at any one period of time. We tried to play it out. We looked at environmental considerations.

[Speaker 6] (1:48:45 - 1:48:48)
Could we make part of the site green space or could we not?

[Speaker 6] (1:48:49 - 1:48:50)
And what goes along with that?

[Speaker 6] (1:48:51 - 1:48:53)
We evaluated building arrangement and park arrangement.

[Speaker 6] (1:48:54 - 1:49:03)
So it wasn't just a matter of a math problem of fitting 20,000 or 30,000 square feet on site. It's can you do that and create something that's beautiful and coherent.

[Speaker 6] (1:49:03 - 1:49:08)
Parking factor is obviously self-explanatory. We needed to have a certain modicum of parking.

[Speaker 6] (1:49:09 - 1:49:09)
Visas.

[Speaker 1] (1:49:09 - 1:49:11)
Visas, I'm sorry, vistas.

[Speaker 1] (1:49:11 - 1:49:15)
Vistas came out as a very important consideration we added.

[Speaker 1] (1:49:16 - 1:49:17)
Can you go to the next slide,

[Speaker 1] (1:49:17 - 1:49:18)
please?

[Speaker 1] (1:49:24 - 1:49:24)
Yep.

[Speaker 1] (1:49:25 - 1:49:26)
So the degree of alignment.

[Speaker 1] (1:49:27 - 1:49:30)
With the goals of the Humphrey Street District,

[Speaker 1] (1:49:30 - 1:49:31)
the Humphrey Street Overlay District,

[Speaker 1] (1:49:32 - 1:49:37)
there is a district that runs from the fish house down to Mission on the Bay,

[Speaker 1] (1:49:37 - 1:49:45)
and it talks about how the town can pursue a sort of vital retail shop economic corridor.

[Speaker 1] (1:49:45 - 1:49:47)
So we tried to factor that in as well.

[Speaker 1] (1:49:47 - 1:49:49)
Social considerations,

[Speaker 1] (1:49:49 - 1:49:51)
are we creating a place that people would enjoy,

[Speaker 1] (1:49:51 - 1:49:56)
that people would come to? Does it create a sense of community or can it create a sense of community?

[Speaker 1] (1:49:55 - 1:49:56)
community.

[Speaker 1] (1:49:56 - 1:49:59)
The existing Hawthorne restaurant building,

[Speaker 1] (1:49:59 - 1:50:02)
we looked hard at that and what it would mean to either leave it or not.

[Speaker 1] (1:50:04 - 1:50:09)
Building uses, we looked at what would be in the buildings that we would propose if we did.

[Speaker 1] (1:50:09 - 1:50:10)
You know, again,

[Speaker 1] (1:50:10 - 1:50:10)
shops,

[Speaker 1] (1:50:10 - 1:50:10)
retail,

[Speaker 1] (1:50:11 - 1:50:12)
residential,

[Speaker 1] (1:50:12 - 1:50:13)
would there be residential?

[Speaker 1] (1:50:14 - 1:50:16)
We also looked at feasibility and timing.

[Speaker 1] (1:50:16 - 1:50:20)
Every one of our plans went through the greater in terms of is this a feasible plan?

[Speaker 1] (1:50:20 - 1:50:22)
Can it be done in a timely manner?

[Speaker 1] (1:50:22 - 1:50:25)
Is it too complex to pursue for a municipality?

[Speaker 1] (1:50:25 - 1:50:27)
And then lastly, permitting and zoning,

[Speaker 1] (1:50:27 - 1:50:28)
that's obvious.

[Speaker 1] (1:50:29 - 1:50:36)
For anybody evaluating plans or expressing an opinion about a plan or a preference,

[Speaker 1] (1:50:36 - 1:50:46)
these criteria are like a test or a filter that each proposal or plan option must really be submitted to.

[Speaker 1] (1:50:47 - 1:50:52)
I used to tell the committee we had an expression in architectural firms,

[Speaker 1] (1:50:52 - 1:50:54)
no plan gets a free pass.

[Speaker 1] (1:50:54 - 1:51:00)
That means every plan goes through the same, is subject to the same sorts of questions.

[Speaker 1] (1:51:00 - 1:51:02)
And that's a fairness issue.

[Speaker 1] (1:51:02 - 1:51:04)
It's a way to keep us all honest.

[Speaker 1] (1:51:04 - 1:51:08)
It means that one plan, when you're comparing one plan to another,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:08 - 1:51:10)
you're asking the same questions of it.

[Speaker 1] (1:51:11 - 1:51:14)
The other thing about these frameworks, these criteria,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:15 - 1:51:16)
they provide,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:16 - 1:51:17)
and this is very important,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:17 - 1:51:24)
they provide a shared grounding or orienting framework and a shared vocabulary for a committee of 12,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:25 - 1:51:27)
a select board of five,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:27 - 1:51:30)
a town meeting of 324,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:30 - 1:51:33)
or a town of 14,000.

[Speaker 1] (1:51:33 - 1:51:38)
to engage with each other, to engage with multiple site plan options,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:38 - 1:51:41)
ultimately to select a wise plan.

[Speaker 1] (1:51:42 - 1:51:44)
After weighing these considerations,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:44 - 1:51:48)
and believe me there was a lot of discussion about all aspects of these,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:48 - 1:51:52)
I've barely even touched on the depth of the discussions we had,

[Speaker 1] (1:51:52 - 1:52:00)
the committee decided that any development of the site, any development of the site, should include a blend of five ingredients to best satisfy these criteria.

[Speaker 1] (1:52:01 - 1:52:03)
We call it a mixed-use plan.

[Speaker 1] (1:52:03 - 1:52:05)
It contains these ingredients.

[Speaker 1] (1:52:06 - 1:52:07)
Some amount of green space,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:07 - 1:52:10)
public access and walk along the shoreline,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:11 - 1:52:12)
some amount of buildings,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:13 - 1:52:14)
some amount of parking,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:14 - 1:52:17)
and some amount of revenue generation.

[Speaker 1] (1:52:17 - 1:52:23)
And all of that blended into a plan that also possessed coherence, logic,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:23 - 1:52:25)
and created a memorable,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:25 - 1:52:29)
attractive sense of place across all parts of the site.

[Speaker 1] (1:52:30 - 1:52:31)
Now,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:31 - 1:52:32)
the committee,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:32 - 1:52:33)
in light of the criteria,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:33 - 1:52:35)
concluded that retaining the Hawthorne building,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:36 - 1:52:38)
whether a single or a double-large site,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:38 - 1:52:42)
did not achieve these goals by and large,

[Speaker 1] (1:52:42 - 1:52:46)
and in fact would be an obstacle to achieving these goals.

[Speaker 1] (1:52:46 - 1:52:51)
So the committee unanimously did recommend demolishing it.

[Speaker 1] (1:52:51 - 1:52:58)
There was one person who was indecisive about it, but the rest of us were unanimous about it. Could you?

[Speaker 1] (1:52:59 - 1:53:01)
Diane put site plan A on the screen.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:05 - 1:53:07)
So that's site plan A.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:07 - 1:53:15)
Those are the existing conditions which show the footprint of the Hawthorne building and roughly 110 or 115 parking spaces.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:15 - 1:53:21)
So this was an important decision and obviously it's one the town is grappling with. It's a tough call.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:21 - 1:53:25)
But the reasons the committee felt confident, and remember,

[Speaker 1] (1:53:25 - 1:53:27)
these are 12 very diverse people.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:27 - 1:53:31)
We all walked in in March with very diverse opinions.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:33 - 1:53:40)
Leaving the Hawthorne, we decided, precluded any substantial green area at all.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:40 - 1:53:45)
It precluded substantially any view or coastline walk access.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:45 - 1:53:49)
Now I'm saying substantial because it's conceivable that, you know, a walk line,

[Speaker 1] (1:53:50 - 1:53:52)
a coastline access could be hung off the back,

[Speaker 1] (1:53:52 - 1:53:56)
but it's not a substantial piece of work.

[Speaker 1] (1:53:57 - 1:53:58)
It is poor town planning,

[Speaker 1] (1:53:59 - 1:54:07)
very poor town planning to have a large parking lot in the most prime, most visible, most significant parcel of land in what should be

[Speaker 1] (1:54:07 - 1:54:09)
really an imageful downtown,

[Speaker 1] (1:54:09 - 1:54:11)
not one we have to apologize for.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:12 - 1:54:13)
Furthermore,

[Speaker 1] (1:54:13 - 1:54:19)
the building is not architecturally noteworthy and it needs substantial costly repair and renovation.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:20 - 1:54:23)
When measured by the Humphrey Street overlay district,

[Speaker 1] (1:54:23 - 1:54:26)
it violates the intentions,

[Speaker 1] (1:54:26 - 1:54:30)
the guidelines and the principles in the Humphrey Street overlay district.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:30 - 1:54:33)
It does not contribute to that district.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:34 - 1:54:35)
It's a flop environmentally.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:35 - 1:54:37)
The parking lot is literally one acre,

[Speaker 1] (1:54:38 - 1:54:40)
so it's a heat island. It's a tremendous heat island.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:41 - 1:54:43)
And here's an important thing.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:43 - 1:54:44)
We can beat whatever the horse,

[Speaker 1] (1:54:45 - 1:54:48)
here's a really important thing, because the idea is to compare plans.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:48 - 1:54:51)
There's no absolutes. But we can beat leaving the restaurant.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:51 - 1:54:53)
We can beat it financially,

[Speaker 1] (1:54:53 - 1:54:54)
environmentally.

[Speaker 1] (1:54:54 - 1:55:00)
We can beat it in attractiveness. We can beat it in downtown placeness in image building.

[Speaker 1] (1:55:01 - 1:55:01)
So it falls,

[Speaker 1] (1:55:02 - 1:55:03)
when measured by the criteria,

[Speaker 1] (1:55:03 - 1:55:06)
it falls way short.

[Speaker 1] (1:55:07 - 1:55:11)
The committee also unanimously opposes leasing it for one,

[Speaker 1] (1:55:11 - 1:55:11)
two,

[Speaker 1] (1:55:11 - 1:55:15)
or three years to another operator. We think...

[Speaker 1] (1:55:16 - 1:55:20)
Bearing in mind that financial issues are very important,

[Speaker 1] (1:55:20 - 1:55:24)
we think it's actually the financially weakest of the plans.

[Speaker 1] (1:55:24 - 1:55:26)
We think we can beat it with our proposal.

[Speaker 1] (1:55:27 - 1:55:29)
We also think that it's an obstacle.

[Speaker 1] (1:55:29 - 1:55:32)
One could say, well, what's the harm? Rent it for a year. Is that an obstacle?

[Speaker 1] (1:55:32 - 1:55:44)
In fact, it is because that would require time and attention and resources that this town has difficulty providing. It would be a managerial burden on our town and it complicates things.

[Speaker 1] (1:55:44 - 1:55:44)
things.

[Speaker 1] (1:55:45 - 1:55:53)
Keeping a restaurant in a one acre parking lot would probably be the site outcome.

[Speaker 1] (1:55:53 - 1:56:07)
least expected by the town's people it's the solution that's least expected and believe me we heard from 550 people you know a relative handful 10 or 12 said keep the restaurant everybody else said do other things

[Speaker 2] (1:56:07 - 1:56:08)
So I want to stop you right there.

[Speaker 2] (1:56:09 - 1:56:12)
What was the mechanism to hear from 550 people?

[Speaker 2] (1:56:12 - 1:56:14)
How did you hear from 550

[Speaker 1] (1:56:14 - 1:56:14)
we

[Speaker 2] (1:56:14 - 1:56:14)
people?

[Speaker 1] (1:56:14 - 1:56:20)
we we had two public forums we also solicited through questionnaires

[Speaker 1] (1:56:22 - 1:56:39)
written responses so we had 450 roughly 450 written responses and then we tallied almost 100 verbal comments at the two town forums and we had about four people taking notes on on comments I personally read about 150 of the written stuff written stuff

[Speaker 2] (1:56:39 - 1:56:42)
So you have 450 written responses.

[Speaker 1] (1:56:42 - 1:56:42)
pardon yes

[Speaker 2] (1:56:42 - 1:56:46)
You have 450 written responses that you're going to submit that we can look at?

[Speaker 1] (1:56:47 - 1:56:48)
If you'd like to, sure.

[Speaker 1] (1:56:48 - 1:56:49)
Yeah, yep.

[Speaker 1] (1:56:49 - 1:56:52)
They were, you know, if you look at the 550,

[Speaker 1] (1:56:53 - 1:56:59)
a slight majority preferred a mixed use plan and it was almost half and half.

[Speaker 1] (1:57:00 - 1:57:05)
almost almost half preferred all park an all park plan

[Speaker 2] (1:57:05 - 1:57:07)
Do you have those numbers in your presentation here?

[Speaker 1] (1:57:07 - 1:57:26)
no I'm fa I'm almost done I don't have them but I can certainly give them to you I mean uh Marzi Marzi's office tallied them all so it's it wouldn't be any problem to give them to you um as I say it was almost half for full green park and and slightly more than half preferred actually we put we showed three plans at the forums we we showed

[Speaker 1] (1:57:27 - 1:57:38)
G1, which is the one we ultimately selected, we showed E3 and E4. But all three of those were essentially conceptually the same. They showed between twenty five and thirty five thousand square feet of building toward the front.

[Speaker 1] (1:57:38 - 1:57:51)
They showed the the whole back half of the site as a park, so roughly fifty percent, always on the ocean side. Because that well, let's just go to G1, I'm almost finished and I'll and I and I just I meant to show you this in a diagram.

[Speaker 1] (1:57:53 - 1:57:56)
Daya can you just put um G_ one on the screen.

[Speaker 2] (1:57:56 - 1:57:56)
Stop there.

[Speaker 3] (1:57:57 - 1:58:00)
Can you take your microphone with you Brian so folks at home can hear you?

[Speaker 1] (1:58:00 - 1:58:00)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (1:58:00 - 1:58:01)
Let me take that out.

[Speaker 3] (1:58:01 - 1:58:01)
Thank you Patrick.

[Speaker 1] (1:58:01 - 1:58:02)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:58:11 - 1:58:12)
Is this is this on right?

[Speaker 3] (1:58:13 - 1:58:14)
We can see here.

[Speaker 4] (1:58:14 - 1:58:15)
Yeah, it's on.

[Speaker 1] (1:58:16 - 1:58:17)
Okay, okay.

[Speaker 1] (1:58:22 - 1:58:29)
All right. So G_ G_ one is a single lot plan, meaning it's it's the plan that uh the committee recommends

[Speaker 1] (1:58:30 - 1:58:43)
If in the event that the town does not buy the church parking lot, so this is the single lot plan, you can see the buildings are arranged to create a courtyard that's open to the street. Uh the buildings shown here, those are the footprints,

[Speaker 1] (1:58:43 - 1:58:59)
and they w and and the committee recommends between uh roughly twenty five thousand square feet and thirty five thousand square feet, just a range. Um and the uh the courtyard is roughly fifty feet wide. It's the right size.

[Speaker 1] (1:58:59 - 1:59:04)
s width for the scale uh for the scale of the buildings uh you can see the the back fifty percent

[Speaker 1] (1:59:26 - 1:59:39)
Uh so that we just that was so that came through so strongly we tried to uh respect it. And then to the right of the buildings here you see is a relatively small parking lot that's about thirty spaces.

[Speaker 1] (1:59:40 - 1:59:53)
Um one of the things, one of the characteristics of every single plan we looked at, say thirty plans, every one of them really fights to achieve the amount of parking that would be

[Speaker 1] (1:59:54 - 2:00:15)
most desirable. So I think it's fair to say that no plan gives you the ideal amount of parking, but we tried to we tried to provide what we thought was at least a modicum respectable amount of parking and it just gets gets difficult to achieve other goals if parking starts to be too too big an item.

[Speaker 1] (2:00:15 - 2:00:36)
Um in this plan you see the dotted lines, the dashed lines across those two buildings, that that could be a second or third floor connection of both buildings across the open courtyard so a person on the sidewalk still sees the view, gets the complete view, those are second and third floors above uh uh

[Speaker 1] (2:00:36 - 2:00:39)
above eye level. And again,

[Speaker 1] (2:00:39 - 2:00:43)
that's to help create some definition on Humphrey Street.

[Speaker 1] (2:00:43 - 2:00:54)
So one of the goals was can we reinforce the Humphrey Street Overlay District and the committee envisions and recommends that the first floors of all these buildings be

[Speaker 1] (2:00:55 - 2:01:23)
uh retail or shops you know cafes restaurants you know the first floor should be business and commercial and and hope to generate uh life in this courtyard um and then what's in the second and third floor or or second floor depending on the heights of the buildings uh you know would would be yet to be determined we don't think the town would be building these buildings you know we envision that uh either uh a developer would either

[Speaker 1] (2:01:24 - 2:01:50)
uh buy a buy the front half of the lot or lease the front half the committee favored leasing it but again that's not our call um but the town wouldn't be the contractor and what I what I mentioned at the last select board meeting but didn't really have a chance to talk about was I know the town is concerned about coming up with you know eight hundred thousand dollars to demolish the restaurant one way to skin the cat and the committee talked about this is that

[Speaker 1] (2:01:50 - 2:02:07)
that sometimes with plants like this a municipality will uh fold demolition of an existing building into the development the development plan of the buildings. So uh if if the town put out an R_F_P_ for this site, uh

[Speaker 1] (2:02:08 - 2:02:12)
tearing down the Hawthorne would be part of the job of the developer,

[Speaker 1] (2:02:12 - 2:02:16)
even though the land itself would be retained by the town.

[Speaker 1] (2:02:16 - 2:02:21)
It's a way for the town not to have to put out money at all.

[Speaker 1] (2:02:21 - 2:02:22)
Now,

[Speaker 1] (2:02:22 - 2:02:25)
it must be said that a developer then,

[Speaker 1] (2:02:25 - 2:02:29)
you know, in whatever arrangement the town makes with the developer,

[Speaker 1] (2:02:29 - 2:02:32)
you're either going to get a little less money from the land sale,

[Speaker 1] (2:02:32 - 2:02:35)
or if it's a leasing situation, obviously.

[Speaker 1] (2:02:35 - 2:02:40)
Actually, the rent will be lower to make up for the fact that that fellow put out $800,000 to take the building out.

[Speaker 1] (2:02:40 - 2:02:46)
So it's not a free lunch, but it is a way not to need money from the town to get this done.

[Speaker 2] (2:02:47 - 2:02:49)
Brian, can I ask a question please?

[Speaker 1] (2:02:49 - 2:02:49)
Yeah.

[Speaker 2] (2:02:49 - 2:03:03)
Just about the second or third floors. I think in some instances residential was used as a way to potentially entice developers right to come because it's not always a

[Speaker 2] (2:03:04 - 2:03:29)
as profitable to have retail and commercial residential is sort of where the developers make their profit but I think when we originally obtained the property it was pretty clear from the public that I mean there was there was almost an immediate cry for us to put a deed restriction on the property that it would never be used for residential so with that in mind what is the likelihood of RFP responses if there is a restriction on residential

[Speaker 1] (2:03:30 - 2:03:38)
I I would say realistically uh there won't be too many thrilled developers if if if

[Speaker 3] (2:03:38 - 2:03:38)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (2:03:38 - 2:03:40)
residential is precluded.

[Speaker 1] (2:03:41 - 2:03:52)
In other words, the R_P_ ac if it's said in black and white there shall be no residential uses, uh I think there's a mistake and I don't think I'm not sure any developers would req would respond or reply.

[Speaker 4] (2:03:52 - 2:03:53)
I agree with you

[Speaker 1] (2:03:53 - 2:03:57)
It's not a real world it's not really a real world option.

[Speaker 1] (2:03:57 - 2:04:08)
Now I wanna say our our committee was divided on this and I was disappointed that we we couldn't get to the place where we said it's not realistic, but we couldn't. Um but I think realistically

[Speaker 1] (2:04:09 - 2:04:35)
uh realistically and and also architecturally and also in terms of what's good for the town um you know my my thought would be that it's they're three-story buildings and the second and third floors are apartments and and and condos perhaps but they can be apartments um i i will say and you know i listened to people for nine months on this you know i listened carefully and talked to as many people as i could part of the

[Speaker 1] (2:04:36 - 2:04:49)
feeling among pounds people front comes from fright that we're gonna they're gonna end up with a Concordia I mean or they're or people talk to me all the time well what about the Westcott I mean these buildings are not the scale of the Concordia they're not the scale of the Westcott and

[Speaker 1] (2:04:50 - 2:04:58)
I know people don't want that sort of thing. I don't want that sort of thing. The committee doesn't. But if the RFP is written very well,

[Speaker 1] (2:04:58 - 2:05:02)
you know, the square footage you get will be controlled.

[Speaker 1] (2:05:02 - 2:05:06)
You might say not more than eight or ten.

[Speaker 1] (2:05:06 - 2:05:15)
you know apartment units or condo units i mean there is a way you know we don't have to be frightened of the concordia the west god that's you know that's not a reason to ban residential but

[Speaker 2] (2:05:15 - 2:05:31)
And I understand that and I get the point that the that might be in the best interest for the town but the response from the town upon purchase was pretty clear that residential should not be considered for that lot and that lot was being purchased for the community at large and not for

[Speaker 2] (2:05:32 - 2:05:37)
in the men individual or wealthy members of the community to purchase apartments or condos there so

[Speaker 1] (2:05:37 - 2:05:37)
Yeah,

[Speaker 2] (2:05:37 - 2:05:37)
just

[Speaker 1] (2:05:37 - 2:05:43)
well that was not reflected in 550 responses. I mean, you know that was you talked about

[Speaker 1] (2:05:43 - 2:05:45)
when the when the land was purchased three years ago

[Speaker 2] (2:05:45 - 2:05:48)
Right, when town meeting authorized the purchase of the land, yeah correct?

[Speaker 1] (2:05:48 - 2:06:12)
right so i mean we our committee talked a lot about that we said what was what was the town meeting telling us what were they doing what did what what impression did they have as to what would be built uh certainly a lot of people were under the impression it would be a pretty pretty full park um but it was interesting you know at the public forum you you probably remember i showed

[Speaker 1] (2:06:12 - 2:06:29)
I showed, you know, the committee showed a full a full park and then it showed three plants that had buildings and mixed uses uh and and in our responses no m well very few people expressed the the idea that they would not like to see residential.

[Speaker 1] (2:06:29 - 2:06:30)
I mean, I think

[Speaker 5] (2:06:30 - 2:06:31)
But did you expel? Sorry, Brian,

[Speaker 5] (2:06:32 - 2:06:34)
but this is done. I think that's because no one, no one,

[Speaker 6] (2:06:34 - 2:06:35)
No one knew about it.

[Speaker 5] (2:06:35 - 2:06:38)
nobody thought there was going to be residential there.

[Speaker 6] (2:06:38 - 2:06:38)
Right.

[Speaker 5] (2:06:38 - 2:06:38)
That wasn't

[Speaker 2] (2:06:38 - 2:06:38)
Right,

[Speaker 5] (2:06:38 - 2:06:39)
even a part

[Speaker 2] (2:06:39 - 2:06:39)
it wasn't an explicit

[Speaker 5] (2:06:39 - 2:06:39)
of it.

[Speaker 2] (2:06:39 - 2:06:40)
question,

[Speaker 6] (2:06:40 - 2:06:40)
No. Wasn't

[Speaker 2] (2:06:40 - 2:06:40)
I

[Speaker 6] (2:06:40 - 2:06:41)
even presented.

[Speaker 2] (2:06:41 - 2:06:42)
guess that's the...

[Speaker 6] (2:06:42 - 2:06:42)
Never.

[Speaker 1] (2:06:42 - 2:06:43)
Okay,

[Speaker 6] (2:06:43 - 2:06:45)
How many how many parking spaces is that?

[Speaker 2] (2:06:45 - 2:06:45)
28.

[Speaker 1] (2:06:45 - 2:06:47)
It's about 28 to 30.

[Speaker 6] (2:06:47 - 2:06:51)
28 to 30 parking spaces and that's 25,000 square feet of retail.

[Speaker 1] (2:06:51 - 2:06:52)
Between,

[Speaker 1] (2:06:52 - 2:06:52)
no,

[Speaker 1] (2:06:52 - 2:06:55)
no, no, 25,000 square feet of total building.

[Speaker 1] (2:06:55 - 2:06:56)
Not not all retail.

[Speaker 6] (2:06:56 - 2:06:59)
It total building of both rows of those buildings

[Speaker 1] (2:07:00 - 2:07:00)
Yes,

[Speaker 1] (2:07:00 - 2:07:06)
if you add the two buildings together and if they're two stories they total 25,000 square feet.

[Speaker 2] (2:07:06 - 2:07:06)
They're

[Speaker 6] (2:07:06 - 2:07:06)
Okay,

[Speaker 2] (2:07:06 - 2:07:06)
just under

[Speaker 6] (2:07:06 - 2:07:07)
and

[Speaker 2] (2:07:07 - 2:07:08)
6,000 it looks like

[Speaker 1] (2:07:08 - 2:07:08)
Think

[Speaker 2] (2:07:08 - 2:07:08)
a floor.

[Speaker 1] (2:07:08 - 2:07:10)
of each footprint as

[Speaker 6] (2:07:10 - 2:07:10)
I'm just

[Speaker 1] (2:07:10 - 2:07:10)
6

[Speaker 6] (2:07:10 - 2:07:10)
I

[Speaker 1] (2:07:10 - 2:07:11)
,000

[Speaker 6] (2:07:11 - 2:07:17)
just want to know how 30 parking spaces is able to support that amount of retail that's and

[Speaker 1] (2:07:17 - 2:07:17)
It won't.

[Speaker 2] (2:07:17 - 2:07:18)
And I believe I mean

[Speaker 1] (2:07:18 - 2:07:18)
Oh,

[Speaker 2] (2:07:18 - 2:07:19)
he Brian

[Speaker 1] (2:07:19 - 2:07:19)
oh,

[Speaker 2] (2:07:19 - 2:07:19)
started

[Speaker 1] (2:07:19 - 2:07:19)
I said

[Speaker 2] (2:07:19 - 2:07:20)
to do

[Speaker 1] (2:07:20 - 2:07:20)
I

[Speaker 2] (2:07:20 - 2:07:20)
well, right?

[Speaker 1] (2:07:20 - 2:07:22)
said at the beginning it's it's

[Speaker 1] (2:07:22 - 2:07:24)
I would I'd like to see a little more parking but it would work

[Speaker 6] (2:07:24 - 2:07:24)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (2:07:24 - 2:07:39)
it's it's no absolutely every plan look at all 30 plans they you could add you really could add 20 30 percent to all the parking solutions you have but but we were trying we were the committee was really sort of committed to trying to achieve

[Speaker 1] (2:07:40 - 2:07:42)
all things at once you know yeah

[Speaker 2] (2:07:42 - 2:07:42)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (2:07:42 - 2:07:43)
it's

[Speaker 7] (2:07:43 - 2:07:44)
And Brian,

[Speaker 6] (2:07:44 - 2:07:44)
Yeah.

[Speaker 7] (2:07:44 - 2:07:48)
what's the split? It looks about half. Is that kind of what if

[Speaker 1] (2:07:48 - 2:07:59)
a yeah very close it's it's it's 52 commercial the front half and 48 green space so and here's an interesting thought we didn't start out

[Speaker 1] (2:08:00 - 2:08:03)
We didn't give that to ourselves as the percentage.

[Speaker 1] (2:08:03 - 2:08:10)
That that was that was by default at the end. So that's really healthy. I mean, in other words, that came that split came about organically.

[Speaker 6] (2:08:10 - 2:08:11)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (2:08:11 - 2:08:21)
So we said, you know, what how could buildings be arranged? What's a reasonable square footage? Can we create another place? And it was only after we did that that we measured everything out and we said, oh, look, look,

[Speaker 1] (2:08:21 - 2:08:22)
by happy accident,

[Speaker 1] (2:08:22 - 2:08:24)
it's 50 50,

[Speaker 1] (2:08:24 - 2:08:24)
you know.

[Speaker 8] (2:08:25 - 2:08:25)
But the

[Speaker 6] (2:08:25 - 2:08:26)
So how many

[Speaker 6] (2:08:26 - 2:08:31)
parking spaces do we have now in that parking lot, and what does

[Speaker 1] (2:08:31 - 2:08:33)
this About about a hundred and ten.

[Speaker 6] (2:08:33 - 2:08:36)
Okay, so from a hundred and ten, this brings it down to about thirty,

[Speaker 1] (2:08:36 - 2:08:37)
Yes.

[Speaker 6] (2:08:37 - 2:08:37)
right.

[Speaker 1] (2:08:37 - 2:08:37)
Yeah.

[Speaker 6] (2:08:37 - 2:08:39)
And that is including

[Speaker 6] (2:08:39 - 2:08:44)
Ten to twelve residential units that would be also be utilizing that parking.

[Speaker 1] (2:08:44 - 2:08:45)
If if if

[Speaker 6] (2:08:45 - 2:08:46)
If if

[Speaker 1] (2:08:46 - 2:08:46)
there were residential

[Speaker 6] (2:08:46 - 2:08:47)
with this

[Speaker 1] (2:08:47 - 2:08:47)
cases,

[Speaker 6] (2:08:47 - 2:08:47)
plan,

[Speaker 1] (2:08:47 - 2:08:47)
yes.

[Speaker 6] (2:08:47 - 2:08:48)
right. Okay.

[Speaker 1] (2:08:48 - 2:08:49)
Yeah, if there were.

[Speaker 1] (2:08:49 - 2:08:56)
Okay. And we did talk about that a bit. The the committee, you know, as I said, the committee was very, very split about this issue.

[Speaker 1] (2:08:56 - 2:08:59)
But the committee did say if if there were.

[Speaker 2] (2:09:04 - 2:09:04)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:04 - 2:09:07)
w would not assign two, because that simply can't We be done.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:07 - 2:09:08)
can't, mathematically. It's

[Speaker 1] (2:09:08 - 2:09:08)
Yeah,

[Speaker 3] (2:09:08 - 2:09:08)
not there.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:08 - 2:09:11)
mathematically it's too much. So we would just

[Speaker 3] (2:09:11 - 2:09:11)
I can

[Speaker 1] (2:09:11 - 2:09:11)
assign appreciate one.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:11 - 2:09:12)
that the

[Speaker 1] (2:09:12 - 2:09:12)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:12 - 2:09:13)
committee was divided

[Speaker 2] (2:09:13 - 2:09:13)
Oh.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:13 - 2:09:15)
on this topic,

[Speaker 2] (2:09:15 - 2:09:15)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:15 - 2:09:15)
but

[Speaker 1] (2:09:16 - 2:09:16)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:16 - 2:09:17)
But if

[Speaker 4] (2:09:17 - 2:09:17)
But if it's not,

[Speaker 3] (2:09:17 - 2:09:21)
one is not feasible without residential, you've already said that, right?

[Speaker 1] (2:09:22 - 2:09:23)
Well, it's

[Speaker 4] (2:09:23 - 2:09:23)
what else is feasible?

[Speaker 3] (2:09:23 - 2:09:25)
It's less likely feasible than not.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:25 - 2:09:30)
I think it's less likely, but it's conceivable that somebody would put office space up there.

[Speaker 4] (2:09:30 - 2:09:31)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:31 - 2:09:32)
But then that needs parking also,

[Speaker 3] (2:09:32 - 2:09:33)
right?

[Speaker 1] (2:09:33 - 2:09:33)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:33 - 2:09:34)
So yeah,

[Speaker 1] (2:09:34 - 2:09:34)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:34 - 2:09:35)
okay.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:35 - 2:09:35)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:09:35 - 2:09:36)
Let's keep going.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:36 - 2:09:38)
Let's just go to the next slide.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:40 - 2:09:43)
Okay, so this shows a double lot option.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:43 - 2:09:47)
The committee recommended K-1.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:49 - 2:09:56)
can't see the one. But um this would be, you can it looked familiar because it's essentially the same principles, the same concepts,

[Speaker 5] (2:09:56 - 2:09:57)
The sliders.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:57 - 2:09:59)
just just bloomed out a little bit.

[Speaker 6] (2:09:59 - 2:09:59)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 5] (2:09:59 - 2:09:59)
Yep.

[Speaker 1] (2:09:59 - 2:10:15)
Um and so I I don't really probably need to belabor it. The courtyard again is the the central space and it's a community space. The parking here is about fifty spaces in total, but still it's a little light for the buildings. Now the p either of these plans could be adjusted. I mean

[Speaker 1] (2:10:15 - 2:10:37)
The town could cut back the square footage of the building. Let you know leave leave 30 parking spaces and cut back I mean the town could for example leave off that last 40 foot segment on both sides and thereby bring bring the building square footage into a better relationship with the amount of parking I mean so these these plants can be modified They aren't meant to be set in stone.

[Speaker 1] (2:10:37 - 2:10:37)
It's

[Speaker 3] (2:10:37 - 2:10:37)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (2:10:37 - 2:10:41)
it's to show a direction and a concept I don't

[Speaker 3] (2:10:41 - 2:10:44)
I just, Brian, I just, I'm sorry to interrupt you again, but I just want to note that

[Speaker 3] (2:10:44 - 2:10:45)
That the town is not currently

[Speaker 3] (2:10:47 - 2:11:02)
pursuing purchase of the full lot so just just or the folks at home Yep. in case they missed our meeting last week we are pursuing a LOI with the church to purchase a portion of the lot which would be approximately half so just to say it

[Speaker 1] (2:11:02 - 2:11:03)
Yep.

[Speaker 1] (2:11:03 - 2:11:03)
Yep.

[Speaker 1] (2:11:03 - 2:11:08)
The committee didn't did not take a position or whether,

[Speaker 1] (2:11:08 - 2:11:15)
you know, we just didn't make a recommendation should the town purchase a portion or or any or any part of the lot.

[Speaker 1] (2:11:15 - 2:11:16)
Um,

[Speaker 1] (2:11:16 - 2:11:25)
it would be like, it would be logical for us to take a position on it because these plans, you know, obviously depend or not on whether the town pursues that second lot,

[Speaker 1] (2:11:25 - 2:11:29)
but we just didn't simply didn't have time to do it. Uh,

[Speaker 1] (2:11:29 - 2:11:32)
so we, so therefore we didn't make a recommendation.

[Speaker 1] (2:11:32 - 2:11:33)
Um,

[Speaker 1] (2:11:33 - 2:11:33)
yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:11:33 - 2:11:38)
And I think what you've just said numerous times is, you know, any,

[Speaker 3] (2:11:38 - 2:11:40)
you basically recommended a recipe,

[Speaker 3] (2:11:40 - 2:11:41)
right?

[Speaker 3] (2:11:41 - 2:11:42)
The ingredients to the recipe.

[Speaker 1] (2:11:43 - 2:11:44)
Yep.

[Speaker 3] (2:11:44 - 2:11:48)
Some you can add more, you can add less. They're meant to be a little bit more fluid than they are.

[Speaker 3] (2:11:48 - 2:11:51)
This is exactly what, this is the special number,

[Speaker 3] (2:11:51 - 2:11:51)
right?

[Speaker 3] (2:11:51 - 2:11:52)
The committee decided Right, 57

[Speaker 1] (2:11:52 - 2:11:53)
right.

[Speaker 3] (2:11:53 - 2:11:55)
% should be park and I

[Speaker 1] (2:11:55 - 2:11:56)
Well,

[Speaker 1] (2:11:56 - 2:11:56)
no, no,

[Speaker 1] (2:11:56 - 2:11:56)
no.

[Speaker 1] (2:11:56 - 2:11:58)
I want to correct you there.

[Speaker 1] (2:11:58 - 2:11:59)
We did not do that.

[Speaker 3] (2:11:59 - 2:12:00)
know that is what I'm saying.

[Speaker 1] (2:12:00 - 2:12:00)
That

[Speaker 3] (2:12:00 - 2:12:00)
I'm

[Speaker 1] (2:12:00 - 2:12:01)
would,

[Speaker 3] (2:12:01 - 2:12:01)
saying

[Speaker 1] (2:12:01 - 2:12:01)
yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:12:01 - 2:12:01)
this,

[Speaker 3] (2:12:01 - 2:12:01)
that

[Speaker 1] (2:12:01 - 2:12:01)
Oh, okay,

[Speaker 3] (2:12:01 - 2:12:02)
you recommended

[Speaker 1] (2:12:02 - 2:12:02)
I'm sorry.

[Speaker 3] (2:12:02 - 2:12:04)
ingredients to the process and

[Speaker 1] (2:12:04 - 2:12:05)
Yeah, I'm sorry.

[Speaker 3] (2:12:05 - 2:12:09)
now we are able to sort of move around and slide to figure out how those ingredients work.

[Speaker 7] (2:12:09 - 2:12:10)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:12:10 - 2:12:17)
whether it is one and a half lots, whether it is two lots, whether it is one lot. But the concepts, the philosophies are there for us to consider.

[Speaker 8] (2:12:17 - 2:12:18)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (2:12:18 - 2:12:24)
Yes, yes. The the the the thing that's that is fixed, you're right absolutely right what you said.

[Speaker 1] (2:12:25 - 2:12:37)
The thing that is fixed though is that we group the buildings, that c all the committee felt strongly that the buildings are grouped toward Humphrey Street and that the green space is sort of at the coastline side of the site.

[Speaker 1] (2:12:37 - 2:12:52)
So that was that was important to every member of the committee, because the idea is to bunch bunch the activity along Humphrey Street, um take advantage of the retail synergy um and then leave th whatever green space is is there.

[Speaker 1] (2:12:52 - 2:13:09)
let that be naturally be along the coastline it it also works very well with the coastline access it just makes sense for the organization of the plan and the the only I guess the only other thing I'd add is that

[Speaker 1] (2:13:10 - 2:13:25)
We only had two committee meetings in the last month where we could really talk about what the select board has been doing in terms of pursuing a sale or talking about leasing the restaurant.

[Speaker 1] (2:13:25 - 2:13:33)
We heard when everyone else heard that the Athanas family was leaving the restaurant and we talked long and hard about whether it made sense to lease it.

[Speaker 1] (2:13:33 - 2:13:35)
And we feel like

[Speaker 1] (2:13:35 - 2:13:42)
if the select board wanted to make a decision at some point in the next few months,

[Speaker 1] (2:13:42 - 2:13:43)
we don't have,

[Speaker 1] (2:13:43 - 2:13:49)
we don't need to wait two years or three years to get started on a plan.

[Speaker 1] (2:13:50 - 2:13:55)
Obviously if at some point, if it's some point, and the committee talked a lot about this because,

[Speaker 1] (2:13:55 - 2:13:56)
you know, we're for the town.

[Speaker 1] (2:13:56 - 2:13:59)
We were, you know, we're for the town and we want to help the town do the right thing.

[Speaker 1] (2:13:59 - 2:14:01)
If, if the, if, and these are select board decisions,

[Speaker 1] (2:14:02 - 2:14:04)
but we all thought if the select board decided to.

[Speaker 1] (2:14:05 - 2:14:32)
say look we'll give we'll give pursuing this second lot you know some period of time four months five months and then we if we can't get it done by then we take we take g1 we can start on g1 so so this isn't a situation where the town may want a tenant in the building because there simply wouldn't you wouldn't even need a tenant for a year we we as a town we could get an RFP out the door and start

[Speaker 1] (2:14:32 - 2:14:40)
start soliciting developers to build you one and you know it's not more than it's not more than a year to get that that thing going yeah

[Speaker 9] (2:14:40 - 2:14:46)
You know, I'd just like to say that I thank you so much for your hard work.

[Speaker 9] (2:14:46 - 2:14:50)
I've attended almost every single one of these meetings.

[Speaker 9] (2:14:53 - 2:15:00)
I historically attend a lot of public meetings, especially as a selectboard member.

[Speaker 9] (2:15:00 - 2:15:05)
So when I say that these meetings were really hard,

[Speaker 9] (2:15:05 - 2:15:07)
that's close to an understatement.

[Speaker 9] (2:15:07 - 2:15:13)
You had multiple very powerful personalities,

[Speaker 9] (2:15:14 - 2:15:18)
you know, there was a lot of contention.

[Speaker 9] (2:15:20 - 2:15:45)
consistently meeting after meeting after meeting yet you were able to get through a lot of this work and come up with exactly what Katie is referring to a recipe ingredients on how to put everything together and I just want to say thank you very much you know for me for all your hard work and I'm sure you're going to be very happy that now your committee's work is finished

[Speaker 9] (2:15:46 - 2:16:00)
And you can enjoy the fruits of your labour, and we can now move on and start to think as a committee, as a selectboard, on the right way to move forward and to continue

[Speaker 10] (2:16:00 - 2:16:00)
Yeah.

[Speaker 9] (2:16:00 - 2:16:02)
to gather some more information.

[Speaker 10] (2:16:03 - 2:16:06)
I would second all that. Uh the entire committee's done a uh

[Speaker 10] (2:16:11 - 2:16:14)
launching pad for uh bringing this to a conclusion.

[Speaker 3] (2:16:16 - 2:16:18)
Sorry Doug, you were choppy there for a minute. Would you mind repeating yourself?

[Speaker 10] (2:16:19 - 2:16:21)
Oh, it wasn't worth repeating,

[Speaker 10] (2:16:21 - 2:16:26)
but I just said I think, no, no, I just, I think I second what Mary Ellen said.

[Speaker 10] (2:16:26 - 2:16:33)
I think the committee's done an incredible amount of work and provided us with a great launching pad to bring this to a conclusion now.

[Speaker 3] (2:16:33 - 2:16:34)
Okay,

[Speaker 3] (2:16:34 - 2:16:34)
great.

[Speaker 1] (2:16:35 - 2:16:35)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (2:16:35 - 2:16:39)
And so just so folks at home are aware,

[Speaker 3] (2:16:39 - 2:16:46)
if you aren't familiar with the schedule, as Brian mentioned, they met last night to approve the report,

[Speaker 3] (2:16:47 - 2:16:49)
which is now before the board. We were provided that this morning.

[Speaker 3] (2:16:50 - 2:16:56)
So we haven't really, you know, had too much of a chance to digest it.

[Speaker 3] (2:16:56 - 2:16:58)
We all have not been to every meeting like Mary Ellen,

[Speaker 3] (2:16:59 - 2:17:00)
although I have watched many.

[Speaker 9] (2:17:00 - 2:17:01)
David.

[Speaker 9] (2:17:01 - 2:17:02)
David was David up.

[Speaker 3] (2:17:02 - 2:17:13)
anybody else basically I haven't attended all of them is what I'm saying uh watching from home and trying to stay in the loop uh but um I think there needs to be some time for us to go over the um

[Speaker 1] (2:17:13 - 2:17:13)
Absolutely.

[Speaker 3] (2:17:13 - 2:17:26)
the report to then come back together reflect on what we feel like the report is saying to us and the you know the how you've put forth the ingredients and how we go forward

[Speaker 1] (2:17:26 - 2:17:27)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (2:17:27 - 2:17:28)
Yeah, yeah. Sorry,

[Speaker 1] (2:17:28 - 2:17:30)
we only voted last night.

[Speaker 1] (2:17:30 - 2:17:33)
We wanted to get the report to you much sooner.

[Speaker 1] (2:17:34 - 2:17:34)
But,

[Speaker 1] (2:17:34 - 2:17:41)
you know, with 12 people, it's just really hard. We revised the report, I think, six times. Everybody had to get a whack at it.

[Speaker 3] (2:17:41 - 2:17:42)
Mm

[Speaker 1] (2:17:42 - 2:17:42)
So it

[Speaker 3] (2:17:42 - 2:17:42)
-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (2:17:42 - 2:17:45)
just was, you know, it was a hard work thing,

[Speaker 3] (2:17:45 - 2:17:45)
Yeah,

[Speaker 1] (2:17:45 - 2:17:45)
you know.

[Speaker 3] (2:17:45 - 2:17:46)
absolutely.

[Speaker 1] (2:17:46 - 2:17:49)
And but in the end, I want to say this, you know, it

[Speaker 1] (2:17:50 - 2:18:16)
It the first two or three meetings I was in despair I didn't see how this group of 12 people you know we're ever gonna agree on anything but we we slowly and painfully and with lots of argument did get closer to each other and by the end we had quite a coalition around the principles and the ideas and people were excited in the end the report was accepted last night nine to one nine to one two people couldn't come one of them

[Speaker 1] (2:18:16 - 2:18:41)
sent a note to me and said that person was in favor of it the other one I never got in touch with so you could think of it as ten to one with one not you know incommunicado and the thing I guess the last thing I would say is I do think it's notable that this diverse group of people we were 12 chairman on this committee this was a committee of 12 chairman

[Speaker 1] (2:18:43 - 2:18:53)
That this group who have strong opinions that differ wildly on many of the aspects of this project unanimously and feelingly felt that

[Speaker 1] (2:18:54 - 2:19:19)
leaving the Hawthorne restaurant loses when you when you submit it to the filters that we know are important including and most of all the financial end result of whatever goes there so so that's a that's a significant factor and and of the 550 responses that people sent us maybe 10 maybe 10 said leave the restaurant

[Speaker 1] (2:19:20 - 2:19:22)
You know, so that's really interesting.

[Speaker 2] (2:19:23 - 2:19:23)
Thank you

[Speaker 1] (2:19:23 - 2:19:24)
You can,

[Speaker 3] (2:19:24 - 2:19:34)
So Brian, can you share the detailed financial calculations that the committee did to come to that incredibly precise decision?

[Speaker 1] (2:19:34 - 2:19:35)
well,

[Speaker 1] (2:19:35 - 2:19:35)
no,

[Speaker 1] (2:19:35 - 2:19:37)
yes I can.

[Speaker 1] (2:19:37 - 2:19:41)
Our numbers are not precise. Our conclusion is firm.

[Speaker 1] (2:19:41 - 2:19:42)
But we...

[Speaker 3] (2:19:42 - 2:19:46)
Well, it's pretty hard to have a pretty firm conclusion without precise numbers,

[Speaker 3] (2:19:46 - 2:19:46)
huh?

[Speaker 1] (2:19:46 - 2:19:49)
We think that G1, for example,

[Speaker 1] (2:19:49 - 2:19:56)
if G1 is two stories and if it does include a residential component,

[Speaker 1] (2:19:56 - 2:19:58)
you've got to say that in fairness.

[Speaker 1] (2:19:58 - 2:19:59)
But if the second floor is residential,

[Speaker 4] (2:19:59 - 2:20:02)
And your committee was totally split on residential.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:02 - 2:20:03)
absolutely down the middle.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:04 - 2:20:06)
So it's a tough call,

[Speaker 1] (2:20:06 - 2:20:07)
absolutely.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:10 - 2:20:13)
But if it includes a residential component on the second floor,

[Speaker 1] (2:20:14 - 2:20:21)
then we estimated it was in the neighborhood of $230,000 per year property tax,

[Speaker 1] (2:20:21 - 2:20:26)
approximately $230,000. And we went through the numbers a number of times.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:26 - 2:20:28)
And if you do three stories,

[Speaker 1] (2:20:28 - 2:20:29)
obviously it's higher.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:29 - 2:20:38)
Maybe it's $350,000 in property tax from a 35,000 square foot.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:38 - 2:20:39)
Development, again,

[Speaker 4] (2:20:39 - 2:20:40)
Is

[Speaker 1] (2:20:40 - 2:20:40)
has

[Speaker 4] (2:20:40 - 2:20:40)
that zoned

[Speaker 1] (2:20:40 - 2:20:40)
an

[Speaker 4] (2:20:40 - 2:20:40)
for

[Speaker 1] (2:20:40 - 2:20:40)
impact.

[Speaker 5] (2:20:40 - 2:20:40)
I'm

[Speaker 4] (2:20:40 - 2:20:40)
three

[Speaker 5] (2:20:40 - 2:20:41)
trying

[Speaker 4] (2:20:41 - 2:20:41)
stories?

[Speaker 5] (2:20:41 - 2:20:46)
to picture a three-story building on the front of Humphrey Street,

[Speaker 1] (2:20:46 - 2:20:48)
Well, think of Popo's hot dogs.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:48 - 2:20:48)
That's three

[Speaker 5] (2:20:48 - 2:20:48)
right,

[Speaker 1] (2:20:48 - 2:20:48)
stories.

[Speaker 5] (2:20:48 - 2:20:52)
with the bottom of it being retail and then two floors of residential.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:52 - 2:20:53)
That's right.

[Speaker 4] (2:20:53 - 2:20:55)
And the 30 spots for parking.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:55 - 2:20:56)
Yep. Yep.

[Speaker 4] (2:20:56 - 2:20:57)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (2:20:57 - 2:20:59)
But the thing to remember is,

[Speaker 1] (2:20:59 - 2:21:02)
the thing to remember is

[Speaker 1] (2:21:05 - 2:21:06)
If the committee,

[Speaker 1] (2:21:06 - 2:21:10)
if the select board feels that that ratio of parking is too weak,

[Speaker 1] (2:21:10 - 2:21:10)
then

[Speaker 5] (2:21:10 - 2:21:11)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (2:21:11 - 2:21:14)
we cut back the square footage of the building.

[Speaker 5] (2:21:15 - 2:21:17)
The square footage of the building or the square footage of the park?

[Speaker 1] (2:21:19 - 2:21:23)
No, you'd have to cut back the square footage of the building a little bit.

[Speaker 5] (2:21:23 - 2:21:26)
So then that reduces the commercial space and the residential space.

[Speaker 6] (2:21:26 - 2:21:28)
That reduces the need for parking,

[Speaker 14] (2:21:28 - 2:21:28)
too.

[Speaker 1] (2:21:28 - 2:21:30)
It's bringing the right,

[Speaker 1] (2:21:30 - 2:21:34)
it's bringing the square footage of the buildings into a better ratio with the parking you can provide.

[Speaker 5] (2:21:35 - 2:21:35)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (2:21:35 - 2:21:38)
Now, it is a municipal downtown site.

[Speaker 1] (2:21:38 - 2:21:44)
Most, I mean, the trend in town planning is to recognize that in a municipal downtown site,

[Speaker 1] (2:21:44 - 2:21:51)
you're never going to really provide the parking that, you know, that you can provide elsewhere. It's a downtown site,

[Speaker 1] (2:21:51 - 2:21:52)
you know, and people,

[Speaker 5] (2:21:52 - 2:21:52)
Like

[Speaker 1] (2:21:52 - 2:21:53)
you know, in some sense,

[Speaker 1] (2:21:53 - 2:21:58)
people are asked to figure out a way. They have to park four blocks away.

[Speaker 1] (2:21:58 - 2:22:03)
They have to cope with it, but that's the nature of a downtown site.

[Speaker 5] (2:22:03 - 2:22:03)
Right

[Speaker 1] (2:22:04 - 2:22:07)
Now, we wouldn't ask residential units to do that. We would.

[Speaker 1] (2:22:07 - 2:22:13)
give each one one space so it's not realistic to say to an apartment you know or a condo you can't park anywhere

[Speaker 4] (2:22:13 - 2:22:13)
Right,

[Speaker 1] (2:22:13 - 2:22:17)
near here so yeah but back to Doug's question

[Speaker 1] (2:22:19 - 2:22:43)
Our number – when you guys have a chance to read the report, you'll see that we give ranges of numbers because who who can tell you the exact property tax value. But we we based it on realistic assessments. I mean, we're very familiar with the with the eleven dollars per thousand and the f commercial tax rate of twenty two per thousand. I mean, we we used all the real numbers and and used them for the square footage of the building. So we w I mean, we weren't interested in kidding the players.

[Speaker 1] (2:22:45 - 2:22:49)
You know, we're serving the town. We want to try and be accurate to the extent that we can.

[Speaker 1] (2:22:51 - 2:23:01)
But we looked at, you know, we looked at what a full park, for example, would cost. That would be all town money. It would cost eight or nine million dollars to do a full park.

[Speaker 1] (2:23:01 - 2:23:03)
With the entire,

[Speaker 1] (2:23:03 - 2:23:06)
with the exception of one person, the entire committee just laughed at that.

[Speaker 1] (2:23:06 - 2:23:13)
I mean, look at the duress we're under financially. We're just in a great spot to spend eight million bucks.

[Speaker 1] (2:23:14 - 2:23:14)
So.

[Speaker 1] (2:23:15 - 2:23:20)
It didn't take a lot of convincing for the committee to say we need to generate some revenue.

[Speaker 1] (2:23:20 - 2:23:21)
And the idea was to,

[Speaker 1] (2:23:21 - 2:23:33)
in our mind, we needed to compare it to one of the comparisons we needed to make was, you know, does it beat a potential restaurant occupant, you know, whatever a new restaurant could generate.

[Speaker 1] (2:23:33 - 2:23:42)
That was certainly something we had in our minds. So I think the beauty of it is you could beat the revenue from a restaurant.

[Speaker 1] (2:23:43 - 2:23:49)
and achieve many other things. I mean, think about it, if the restaurant were to stay.

[Speaker 1] (2:23:50 - 2:24:19)
you got a hundred car parking lot you could cut it back a little I'm sure, but it's still a giant parking lot in downtown on the street. Uh and then the big the other big thing our committee talked a lot about was realistically it some some operator i it is any operator going to come into a restaurant for a one two three year lease and put put in two three four million whatever it is uh and then and then he and then he's going to leave in three years there's nobody who's going to do that.

[Speaker 1] (2:24:18 - 2:24:22)
that it's that's not real world thinking um and and uh well

[Speaker 4] (2:24:22 - 2:24:25)
Is anybody asking somebody to come in or contribute?

[Speaker 1] (2:24:25 - 2:24:26)
i mean

[Speaker 4] (2:24:26 - 2:24:26)
I mean, we had,

[Speaker 4] (2:24:26 - 2:24:31)
at resident comment, we had a gentleman come in asking for the RFP right away.

[Speaker 4] (2:24:31 - 2:24:34)
I mean, there's still a lot of things hanging out there,

[Speaker 4] (2:24:34 - 2:24:35)
and those

[Speaker 1] (2:24:35 - 2:24:36)
yep the

[Speaker 4] (2:24:36 - 2:24:38)
variables have to be, you know, put

[Speaker 1] (2:24:38 - 2:24:39)
committee

[Speaker 4] (2:24:39 - 2:24:39)
into the equation.

[Speaker 1] (2:24:39 - 2:24:40)
yep absolutely

[Speaker 4] (2:24:41 - 2:24:41)
It

[Speaker 1] (2:24:41 - 2:24:41)
The committee

[Speaker 4] (2:24:41 - 2:24:42)
is five

[Speaker 1] (2:24:42 - 2:24:42)
looked at,

[Speaker 4] (2:24:42 - 2:24:42)
minutes

[Speaker 1] (2:24:42 - 2:24:43)
you

[Speaker 4] (2:24:43 - 2:24:43)
to know, millions.

[Speaker 1] (2:24:43 - 2:24:58)
we looked at the possible options. You know, if somebody came, if somebody came, I mean, conceptually, if somebody came in and said, I'll do that, you know, is that a person who's going to pay a property tax and a rent and so forth and so on and then still have money?

[Speaker 4] (2:24:58 - 2:25:02)
Well, I think we'd have to find out through an RFP. I have to be honest with you, I've been at...

[Speaker 7] (2:25:02 - 2:25:02)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (2:25:02 - 2:25:05)
Ninety percent of your meetings, and I don't remember any

[Speaker 1] (2:25:05 - 2:25:05)
Yeah.

[Speaker 4] (2:25:05 - 2:25:07)
extensive conversations about that and

[Speaker 1] (2:25:07 - 2:25:10)
Well, we did this the last two meetings and you were not at the last two meetings.

[Speaker 4] (2:25:10 - 2:25:11)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (2:25:11 - 2:25:13)
Okay? We only did this the last two meetings

[Speaker 4] (2:25:13 - 2:25:13)
Oh,

[Speaker 1] (2:25:13 - 2:25:13)
because

[Speaker 4] (2:25:13 - 2:25:14)
just the last two meetings,

[Speaker 1] (2:25:14 - 2:25:14)
because

[Speaker 4] (2:25:14 - 2:25:14)
okay.

[Speaker 1] (2:25:14 - 2:25:16)
it became an issue.

[Speaker 4] (2:25:16 - 2:25:16)
I I

[Speaker 1] (2:25:16 - 2:25:16)
mean, you

[Speaker 4] (2:25:16 - 2:25:16)
didn't

[Speaker 1] (2:25:16 - 2:25:16)
know I was

[Speaker 4] (2:25:16 - 2:25:17)
realise

[Speaker 1] (2:25:17 - 2:25:17)
here and

[Speaker 6] (2:25:17 - 2:25:17)
that. Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 1] (2:25:17 - 2:25:17)
spoke

[Speaker 4] (2:25:17 - 2:25:17)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (2:25:17 - 2:25:19)
about the warrant article.

[Speaker 4] (2:25:19 - 2:25:19)
Right.

[Speaker 5] (2:25:19 - 2:25:19)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (2:25:19 - 2:25:25)
So we really hurried. I have to tell you, we held two meetings under duress because we wanted to be relevant.

[Speaker 1] (2:25:25 - 2:25:28)
We wanted to be, we saw what would come up at town meeting.

[Speaker 1] (2:25:28 - 2:25:56)
and we wanted to be able to offer the town some thoughts that would be relevant and we we are alarmed I mean we really are alarmed at the idea that this town would would think it has the the managerial horsepower to pull off some of these more complex you know arrangements you know by buying another lot needing to go to negotiate and do it and then and then what is the plan if another portion of the lot is

[Speaker 1] (2:25:56 - 2:25:57)
is purchased.

[Speaker 1] (2:25:57 - 2:26:04)
I mean, this is not conservative behavior for a town to do this.

[Speaker 1] (2:26:04 - 2:26:05)
We're not property managers.

[Speaker 1] (2:26:05 - 2:26:06)
We're not developers.

[Speaker 1] (2:26:06 - 2:26:07)
You know, we can't build things.

[Speaker 1] (2:26:08 - 2:26:18)
I mean, we really put ourselves in a, I think, you know, it's a dangerous and risky proposition to go forward too ambitiously because we're a municipality.

[Speaker 1] (2:26:19 - 2:26:20)
And this

[Speaker 3] (2:26:20 - 2:26:20)
Well, Brian,

[Speaker 1] (2:26:20 - 2:26:20)
is...

[Speaker 3] (2:26:20 - 2:26:22)
Brian, sorry to interrupt you there,

[Speaker 3] (2:26:22 - 2:26:23)
but I mean...

[Speaker 3] (2:26:25 - 2:26:41)
Isn't that even accentuated? I mean, now you're asking us to go forward with tearing down the restaurant and then, and you guys want to do it right away.

[Speaker 1] (2:26:41 - 2:26:42)
No, that's incorrect.

[Speaker 3] (2:26:42 - 2:26:43)
Sarah,

[Speaker 3] (2:26:43 - 2:26:43)
what

[Speaker 1] (2:26:43 - 2:26:44)
That's incorrect,

[Speaker 3] (2:26:44 - 2:26:44)
you,

[Speaker 1] (2:26:44 - 2:26:44)
Doug.

[Speaker 1] (2:26:44 - 2:26:45)
Not right away.

[Speaker 3] (2:26:45 - 2:26:46)
okay,

[Speaker 3] (2:26:46 - 2:26:46)
so

[Speaker 1] (2:26:46 - 2:26:47)
Not right away,

[Speaker 3] (2:26:47 - 2:26:48)
so you no. don't want us to run out.

[Speaker 3] (2:26:49 - 2:26:49)
So you

[Speaker 4] (2:26:49 - 2:26:50)
I just want to

[Speaker 3] (2:26:50 - 2:26:50)
want

[Speaker 4] (2:26:50 - 2:26:51)
leave an empty building.

[Speaker 1] (2:26:52 - 2:26:52)
No,

[Speaker 3] (2:26:52 - 2:26:52)
Do we

[Speaker 1] (2:26:52 - 2:26:53)
here's

[Speaker 3] (2:26:53 - 2:26:53)
bring the building

[Speaker 1] (2:26:53 - 2:26:53)
what

[Speaker 3] (2:26:53 - 2:26:54)
or but Ryan

[Speaker 1] (2:26:54 - 2:26:55)
our committee

[Speaker 5] (2:26:55 - 2:26:56)
Wait,

[Speaker 1] (2:26:56 - 2:26:56)
okay,

[Speaker 5] (2:26:56 - 2:26:56)
let me finish.

[Speaker 3] (2:26:56 - 2:26:56)
right

[Speaker 5] (2:26:56 - 2:26:57)
Let that finish.

[Speaker 3] (2:26:57 - 2:26:58)
talk for a while let's just please

[Speaker 1] (2:26:58 - 2:26:59)
I'm sorry go ahead.

[Speaker 3] (2:26:59 - 2:27:16)
finish but then you want us to take the leap of faith that we're going to be able to you're just saying that we're not developers but you want us to find somebody to and this whole thing is predicated on

[Speaker 3] (2:27:19 - 2:27:27)
be able to develop something that has retail three-fourths of which isn't even on the street it's running back towards the park and

[Speaker 6] (2:27:27 - 2:27:28)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 3] (2:27:28 - 2:27:46)
then it requires office or residential on top it's like it's we know from public comment tonight we're swirling around that there are people interested in really revitalizing

[Speaker 3] (2:27:47 - 2:27:48)
The restaurant,

[Speaker 3] (2:27:48 - 2:28:00)
as far as I'm aware, I have no idea of anybody that wants to create a brand new little commercial slash office slash residential complex there.

[Speaker 3] (2:28:00 - 2:28:00)
So,

[Speaker 3] (2:28:00 - 2:28:06)
I mean, that just feels like an even bigger swing at the fences of not knowing how that's really going to happen.

[Speaker 1] (2:28:08 - 2:28:13)
The let me just be clear on one thing that the gentleman was wrong who spoke earlier we

[Speaker 5] (2:28:13 - 2:28:13)
Oh.

[Speaker 1] (2:28:13 - 2:28:34)
we we are not we are not give me a chance we are not asking that restaurant be taken out immediately and the the opposite I stood up there and I said I don't want the town to put out a million bucks to prepare a site as Doug says it on conjecture the way it's done is in and towns have done this our committee looked at a Shrewsbury

[Speaker 1] (2:28:34 - 2:28:36)
RFP that was very similar.

[Speaker 1] (2:28:36 - 2:28:45)
There's a municipal building and the demolition of that building doesn't occur until the plan is decided and an RFP is put out.

[Speaker 1] (2:28:46 - 2:28:49)
The select board is talking about putting out an RFP to get a rest.

[Speaker 1] (2:28:51 - 2:28:54)
You put out an RFP to solicit developer responses,

[Speaker 1] (2:28:54 - 2:28:56)
to create a plan.

[Speaker 1] (2:28:57 - 2:29:00)
Nancy, can you put E4 and E3 on the board?

[Speaker 1] (2:29:00 - 2:29:02)
It's, no,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:02 - 2:29:03)
okay,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:03 - 2:29:07)
there are plans, we show,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:07 - 2:29:17)
you know, we didn't write it into the report, but we show plans that have the same effect and impact that where the buildings are along the street, parallel to the street.

[Speaker 1] (2:29:17 - 2:29:23)
The point is there is no risk to G1 or E3 or E4,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:23 - 2:29:24)
which show similar.

[Speaker 1] (2:29:24 - 2:29:39)
square footages because we won't start until a developer is on board. It's an RFP process. The town the town carefully writes the RFP. I'll help write the RFP. But I mean the select board carefully writes the RFP.

[Speaker 1] (2:29:39 - 2:29:42)
to give the necessary parameters,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:42 - 2:29:42)
ground rules,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:42 - 2:29:43)
you know, and so forth.

[Speaker 1] (2:29:44 - 2:29:48)
Then the town sits with suppose three or four developers respond,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:48 - 2:29:49)
you pick the one,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:50 - 2:29:51)
the town picks the one it thinks is closest,

[Speaker 1] (2:29:52 - 2:29:54)
and then it sits down and there's a conversation.

[Speaker 1] (2:29:54 - 2:30:04)
It might be three conversations and the town will not proceed, will not sign on a dotted line with a developer until the developer's happy and then town's happy.

[Speaker 1] (2:30:04 - 2:30:05)
And...

[Speaker 1] (2:30:05 - 2:30:09)
And the building doesn't come down until that process occurs.

[Speaker 1] (2:30:10 - 2:30:21)
And the and the Horthon would be demolished by the developer, which is done typically by a minute by uh a developer that a minutes municipality. Can you find E_ three or E_ four?

[Speaker 2] (2:30:21 - 2:30:21)
I

[Speaker 3] (2:30:21 - 2:30:21)
Katie,

[Speaker 2] (2:30:21 - 2:30:21)
don't know.

[Speaker 3] (2:30:21 - 2:30:23)
Katie, we I Oh, have to get

[Speaker 1] (2:30:23 - 2:30:23)
okay.

[Speaker 3] (2:30:23 - 2:30:23)
out All

[Speaker 2] (2:30:23 - 2:30:23)
I have

[Speaker 1] (2:30:23 - 2:30:23)
to Okay.

[Speaker 2] (2:30:23 - 2:30:23)
go.

[Speaker 3] (2:30:23 - 2:30:23)
right,

[Speaker 2] (2:30:23 - 2:30:23)
a meeting.

[Speaker 3] (2:30:23 - 2:30:24)
so so we're

[Speaker 4] (2:30:24 - 2:30:24)
Yeah,

[Speaker 3] (2:30:24 - 2:30:24)
supposed

[Speaker 4] (2:30:24 - 2:30:24)
it looks

[Speaker 3] (2:30:24 - 2:30:25)
to have a

[Speaker 4] (2:30:25 - 2:30:27)
hand like raise. there's a um I'm I'm sorry to interrupt you Daniel,

[Speaker 3] (2:30:27 - 2:30:27)
No,

[Speaker 4] (2:30:27 - 2:30:27)
but um

[Speaker 3] (2:30:27 - 2:30:27)
no,

[Speaker 4] (2:30:27 - 2:30:27)
there's

[Speaker 3] (2:30:27 - 2:30:28)
no.

[Speaker 4] (2:30:28 - 2:30:29)
a hand raised online and I was

[Speaker 3] (2:30:29 - 2:30:29)
Yeah,

[Speaker 4] (2:30:29 - 2:30:29)
thinking we

[Speaker 3] (2:30:29 - 2:30:29)
of course,

[Speaker 4] (2:30:29 - 2:30:30)
might let

[Speaker 3] (2:30:30 - 2:30:30)
yeah.

[Speaker 4] (2:30:30 - 2:30:32)
him speak. Mr Kelley I believe it is.

[Speaker 5] (2:30:36 - 2:30:37)
Is this Mr.

[Speaker 6] (2:30:37 - 2:30:37)
Uh,

[Speaker 5] (2:30:37 - 2:30:37)
Keller who is who

[Speaker 4] (2:30:37 - 2:30:38)
Yes, go ahead.

[Speaker 5] (2:30:38 - 2:30:39)
stood up and was wrong?

[Speaker 4] (2:30:39 - 2:30:40)
Go ahead, Mr. Keller.

[Speaker 6] (2:30:40 - 2:30:48)
Yeah. I spoke earlier, sorry I had to cut out. Um I just I wanted to thank the committee.

[Speaker 6] (2:30:48 - 2:30:49)
I think the drawings look great.

[Speaker 6] (2:30:49 - 2:31:01)
Uh but I you know the I still think that realistically that's it none of that can happen in the short term and I just want you know and I apologize if I said they wanted to raise it.

[Speaker 6] (2:31:02 - 2:31:05)
Immediately, I didn't mean any offense by that, so I'm sorry you brought that up.

[Speaker 6] (2:31:05 - 2:31:07)
I just wanted to correct that.

[Speaker 6] (2:31:07 - 2:31:08)
I mean, again,

[Speaker 6] (2:31:08 - 2:31:13)
I appreciate all the work, but I just think that you're right in one regard that, yeah,

[Speaker 6] (2:31:13 - 2:31:27)
I don't think a traditional restaurant operator is going to go in there and invest a ton of money. But I do think there's a possibility where possibly someone could operate a restaurant business and make a more community focused space.

[Speaker 6] (2:31:28 - 2:31:53)
in the meantime that was something that you know the town maybe gets behind and that helps further along the future process because as we saw the present a few agenda items before the numbers weren't great on the forecast so I can't foresee I think you'd want to get something that the town can use and maybe try out and yeah I agree we shouldn't be in the real estate business as a town but we are so

[Speaker 6] (2:31:54 - 2:31:55)
I just, again,

[Speaker 6] (2:31:55 - 2:32:05)
I'm excited to try and present something that would be beneficial and, you know, a way for the town to kind of try out what the town could do there.

[Speaker 4] (2:32:06 - 2:32:06)
Thank you.

[Speaker 4] (2:32:06 - 2:32:07)
Go ahead, Daniel.

[Speaker 7] (2:32:09 - 2:32:22)
God knows he said but thank you so I'm trying to wrap my head around this whole thing and I think that where I see it getting off track is this you guys did so much work

[Speaker 7] (2:32:23 - 2:32:24)
I mean, I'm reading,

[Speaker 7] (2:32:24 - 2:32:25)
I've read through the pages,

[Speaker 7] (2:32:26 - 2:32:32)
and this committee was tasked with giving the select board options for that parcel,

[Speaker 7] (2:32:32 - 2:32:32)
right?

[Speaker 7] (2:32:33 - 2:32:34)
And that's kind of where it ended.

[Speaker 7] (2:32:35 - 2:32:36)
That was the scope.

[Speaker 7] (2:32:36 - 2:32:39)
We needed to see what it could look like, what it could potentially be,

[Speaker 7] (2:32:40 - 2:32:43)
pluses and minuses, and you've done that, you've done that and more,

[Speaker 7] (2:32:43 - 2:32:43)
right?

[Speaker 7] (2:32:43 - 2:32:46)
But I think that after that part of it.

[Speaker 7] (2:32:47 - 2:32:53)
The the questions about RFPs and renting and leasing and the the pros versus cons,

[Speaker 7] (2:32:53 - 2:32:57)
that's kind of that's for this board to decide and evaluate and figure out,

[Speaker 7] (2:32:57 - 2:33:00)
right? It comes back to us no matter what.

[Speaker 7] (2:33:01 - 2:33:05)
So, you know, I know one thing.

[Speaker 7] (2:33:05 - 2:33:27)
and I haven't had 550 or 450 people contact me but the people that have and there have been a lot have categorically said they do not want residential development in that parcel right so if I take that piece out of your equation I don't know how viable it is I don't know what else I'm left with for stories two and three if

[Speaker 1] (2:33:27 - 2:33:28)
Yeah.

[Speaker 7] (2:33:28 - 2:33:33)
I have to depend on it being flexed office space when 90% of the world works from home

[Speaker 1] (2:33:34 - 2:33:34)
Yep,

[Speaker 7] (2:33:34 - 2:33:36)
That's not a sure bet for me.

[Speaker 7] (2:33:36 - 2:33:40)
That's not, you know, I'd be, that's a risky proposition in my head,

[Speaker 1] (2:33:40 - 2:33:40)
I

[Speaker 7] (2:33:40 - 2:33:40)
right?

[Speaker 1] (2:33:40 - 2:33:40)
agree.

[Speaker 7] (2:33:40 - 2:33:49)
The other piece for me is everybody and their mother in this town complains about parking and not having enough of it.

[Speaker 7] (2:33:49 - 2:33:57)
So looking at this with reducing the parking to create this fabulous looking little community environment,

[Speaker 7] (2:33:57 - 2:34:03)
I just don't know where people are going to park and how they're going to get there. And if people complain about it now and we put this.

[Speaker 7] (2:34:04 - 2:34:05)
you know, courtyard there,

[Speaker 7] (2:34:05 - 2:34:18)
we're only going to hear more complaints about it, right? And if we can't financially make it viable plus that, I think people will be up in arms. So I'm trying to really understand that those pieces,

[Speaker 8] (2:34:18 - 2:34:18)
Yeah.

[Speaker 7] (2:34:18 - 2:34:19)
that's where I am.

[Speaker 4] (2:34:19 - 2:34:23)
I think, Danielle, there are some solutions for parking that are not contemplated on,

[Speaker 4] (2:34:23 - 2:34:28)
and they were not in the scope of what the Hawthorne News Committee was meant to be contemplating, right?

[Speaker 7] (2:34:28 - 2:34:28)
Right,

[Speaker 4] (2:34:28 - 2:34:28)
So,

[Speaker 7] (2:34:28 - 2:34:28)
right.

[Speaker 4] (2:34:28 - 2:34:33)
like, there's been discussion about the same

[Speaker 4] (2:34:33 - 2:34:33)
St.

[Speaker 4] (2:34:33 - 2:34:37)
John's, you know, back lot potentially coming

[Speaker 7] (2:34:37 - 2:34:37)
Right,

[Speaker 4] (2:34:37 - 2:34:37)
back online.

[Speaker 7] (2:34:37 - 2:34:38)
which I don't even consider,

[Speaker 7] (2:34:38 - 2:34:39)
honestly.

[Speaker 7] (2:34:39 - 2:34:42)
I'm not even conceptually putting that in my head There until it's,

[Speaker 4] (2:34:42 - 2:34:42)
are just other,

[Speaker 7] (2:34:42 - 2:34:42)
you

[Speaker 4] (2:34:42 - 2:34:42)
there

[Speaker 7] (2:34:42 - 2:34:43)
know.

[Speaker 4] (2:34:43 - 2:34:47)
are other things on the table outside of the Hawthorne property and the church property,

[Speaker 4] (2:34:47 - 2:34:54)
which may or may not become parking in some form of another that could be up for consideration for any of these concepts.

[Speaker 4] (2:34:54 - 2:34:55)
So I,

[Speaker 4] (2:34:55 - 2:35:00)
and that's not within the purview. We didn't ask them to look at that and it would be unfair to put that on you to answer because

[Speaker 7] (2:35:00 - 2:35:01)
Right.

[Speaker 7] (2:35:01 - 2:35:02)
Right. Oh, absolutely not.

[Speaker 4] (2:35:02 - 2:35:10)
The only reason we're even, I'm thinking about it, or we have thought about it as a board is related to the Hadley Hotel reuse and how,

[Speaker 4] (2:35:10 - 2:35:13)
you know, what happens there and how that parking works out.

[Speaker 4] (2:35:13 - 2:35:20)
And, you know, so I think there are some solutions out there and we'll see what comes to fruition with,

[Speaker 4] (2:35:20 - 2:35:22)
and nothing will solve it 100%.

[Speaker 7] (2:35:22 - 2:35:22)
No.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:23 - 2:35:27)
And, but right now as a, you know, as the public.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:28 - 2:35:30)
We don't have use of the Hawthorne parking anyway.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:31 - 2:35:31)
There

[Speaker 4] (2:35:31 - 2:35:31)
Right.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:31 - 2:35:32)
was a until a few days ago there

[Speaker 4] (2:35:32 - 2:35:32)
Right.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:32 - 2:35:33)
was

[Speaker 4] (2:35:33 - 2:35:33)
We've

[Speaker 9] (2:35:33 - 2:35:33)
an been attendant

[Speaker 4] (2:35:33 - 2:35:34)
living without it for.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:34 - 2:35:46)
there was an attendant that pre precluded and prevented residents and and folks from the region who were visiting Humphrey Street from using this at all unless you were dining or or at the Hawthorne restaurant.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:48 - 2:35:52)
Mr. Town Administrator, are we now allowed to park at a residence

[Speaker 6] (2:35:52 - 2:35:52)
Yes.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:52 - 2:35:54)
of the swamps uh of Swampscott

[Speaker 6] (2:35:54 - 2:35:54)
It is.

[Speaker 9] (2:35:54 - 2:35:55)
in the reg and the The region?

[Speaker 7] (2:35:55 - 2:35:56)
they they own

[Speaker 6] (2:35:56 - 2:35:57)
They it. still have a lease for

[Speaker 4] (2:35:57 - 2:35:58)
They don't own it.

[Speaker 6] (2:35:58 - 2:35:58)
the assembly

[Speaker 4] (2:35:58 - 2:35:58)
They lease it.

[Speaker 7] (2:35:58 - 2:35:59)
and lease

[Speaker 6] (2:35:59 - 2:35:59)
that.

[Speaker 7] (2:35:59 - 2:35:59)
it.

[Speaker 4] (2:35:59 - 2:36:00)
They lease it until December 9th.

[Speaker 7] (2:36:00 - 2:36:02)
They still own the parking lot under their lease.

[Speaker 10] (2:36:04 - 2:36:04)
So

[Speaker 9] (2:36:04 - 2:36:04)
So

[Speaker 10] (2:36:04 - 2:36:05)
own the

[Speaker 7] (2:36:05 - 2:36:05)
That

[Speaker 4] (2:36:05 - 2:36:05)
So

[Speaker 7] (2:36:05 - 2:36:06)
we still have use

[Speaker 4] (2:36:06 - 2:36:06)
you have a leasehold.

[Speaker 9] (2:36:06 - 2:36:08)
and can I just answer David's question?

[Speaker 9] (2:36:09 - 2:36:15)
We will, I'm more than happy to talk to both people on the operations side of town and the legal side.

[Speaker 9] (2:36:15 - 2:36:20)
Right now they still have a lease. Just because they're not operating does not mean that they do not still have

[Speaker 4] (2:36:20 - 2:36:20)
Right.

[Speaker 9] (2:36:20 - 2:36:21)
care,

[Speaker 10] (2:36:21 - 2:36:21)
Yep.

[Speaker 9] (2:36:21 - 2:36:21)
custody,

[Speaker 9] (2:36:21 - 2:36:22)
and control of that property.

[Speaker 10] (2:36:22 - 2:36:22)
Yep.

[Speaker 9] (2:36:23 - 2:36:27)
That the lease expires, our authorization to do anything with them expires, you know, two,

[Speaker 9] (2:36:27 - 2:36:32)
three weeks after that. So more than happy between now and the 9th, which will give me two meetings,

[Speaker 9] (2:36:32 - 2:36:33)
I think, with you all.

[Speaker 11] (2:36:32 - 2:36:46)
Well uh to put together a plan of what could be possible, what makes sense, and also the other thing that I keep repeating I did with quotes making sure that our insurance appropriately covers that use so that we're all i in in

[Speaker 1] (2:36:46 - 2:36:46)
Right.

[Speaker 11] (2:36:46 - 2:36:46)
as

[Speaker 7] (2:36:46 - 2:36:47)
best Right.

[Speaker 11] (2:36:47 - 2:36:52)
of position possible should we decide to go down that road, it means me bringing information to you so you all can direct us.

[Speaker 1] (2:36:53 - 2:37:03)
Hey, I would have one thing about the residential and height issue. If you look at Humphrey Street now between the fish house and Mission,

[Speaker 1] (2:37:03 - 2:37:07)
you know, that's the Humphrey Street corridor. If you look at that and you walk up and down it,

[Speaker 1] (2:37:07 - 2:37:08)
as our committee did,

[Speaker 1] (2:37:10 - 2:37:21)
at least half the buildings are now three stories and it's a formula that many of them have sort of the retail commercial on the first floor and second and third floor apartments. So that's...

[Speaker 1] (2:37:22 - 2:37:27)
That exists now in the majority of the buildings do the walk,

[Speaker 1] (2:37:27 - 2:37:29)
go from the fish house to the mission.

[Speaker 1] (2:37:29 - 2:37:40)
So what our committee is recommending is not an aberration from what's on Humphrey Street. It's really more of a continuation of what's on Humphrey Street.

[Speaker 1] (2:37:40 - 2:37:41)
And as I said, the buildings,

[Speaker 1] (2:37:41 - 2:37:42)
as Doug made a good point.

[Speaker 1] (2:37:42 - 2:37:52)
point when he said the buildings are turned perpendicular to the street. It's not ideal for retail commercial and shops. They they're much happier if there's their turn parallel

[Speaker 7] (2:37:52 - 2:37:52)
They're

[Speaker 1] (2:37:52 - 2:37:53)
to the street.

[Speaker 7] (2:37:53 - 2:37:53)
sensitive.

[Speaker 1] (2:37:53 - 2:38:01)
Those plants that could happen, but but the bigger point to I think keep keep an eye on is what does what's the character of Humphrey Street now?

[Speaker 1] (2:38:01 - 2:38:05)
I mean you said yourself that you're hearing from people who don't want departments

[Speaker 7] (2:38:05 - 2:38:06)
More residential.

[Speaker 1] (2:38:06 - 2:38:07)
above the stores

[Speaker 1] (2:38:07 - 2:38:08)
That's interesting,

[Speaker 1] (2:38:08 - 2:38:08)
but

[Speaker 1] (2:38:08 - 2:38:09)
But

[Speaker 7] (2:38:09 - 2:38:09)
No,

[Speaker 1] (2:38:09 - 2:38:09)
they

[Speaker 7] (2:38:09 - 2:38:10)
no, they don't want more residential.

[Speaker 1] (2:38:10 - 2:38:26)
don't want more residential. But I mean w we're in a sense the committee's embracing probably the most traditional town planning formula that exists across the country. I mean shops above you know rest apartments above the stores is very traditional town planning.

[Speaker 7] (2:38:26 - 2:38:26)
Actually,

[Speaker 1] (2:38:26 - 2:38:27)
It's hard

[Speaker 7] (2:38:27 - 2:38:27)
your to committee's

[Speaker 1] (2:38:27 - 2:38:28)
hard to go wrong.

[Speaker 7] (2:38:28 - 2:38:29)
not embracing that.

[Speaker 1] (2:38:30 - 2:38:31)
Pardon

[Speaker 7] (2:38:31 - 2:38:31)
Your

[Speaker 1] (2:38:31 - 2:38:31)
me?

[Speaker 7] (2:38:31 - 2:38:32)
committee's split on that,

[Speaker 1] (2:38:32 - 2:38:33)
Yes,

[Speaker 7] (2:38:33 - 2:38:33)
right?

[Speaker 1] (2:38:33 - 2:38:34)
that's correct.

[Speaker 1] (2:38:34 - 2:38:36)
All I'm saying is that's right, that we are.

[Speaker 7] (2:38:36 - 2:38:36)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (2:38:36 - 2:38:37)
And I'm saying, okay,

[Speaker 1] (2:38:38 - 2:38:43)
but the select board can think independently of us,

[Speaker 1] (2:38:43 - 2:38:44)
right?

[Speaker 1] (2:38:44 - 2:38:44)
They probably will.

[Speaker 1] (2:38:43 - 2:38:44)
right?

[Speaker 1] (2:38:44 - 2:38:44)
They probably will.

[Speaker 2] (2:38:44 - 2:38:44)
Probably.

[Speaker 1] (2:38:44 - 2:38:51)
So all I'm suggesting is that the select board be really familiar with what's on Humphrey Street now so that,

[Speaker 1] (2:38:51 - 2:38:54)
you know, I want you guys to make the right decision. The town, I mean,

[Speaker 1] (2:38:54 - 2:38:57)
the town wants you guys to make the right decision. So that's

[Speaker 3] (2:38:57 - 2:38:57)
Well, I

[Speaker 1] (2:38:57 - 2:38:57)
a really useful

[Speaker 3] (2:38:57 - 2:39:07)
think if thing. we think back to a year ago, as you said, we were a lot of us were in this room with a lot of other people saying a lot of things about the HDR plan.

[Speaker 3] (2:39:08 - 2:39:09)
is HCR

[Speaker 1] (2:39:09 - 2:39:09)
HDR,

[Speaker 1] (2:39:10 - 2:39:10)
yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:39:10 - 2:39:10)
HCR

[Speaker 4] (2:39:10 - 2:39:10)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 3] (2:39:10 - 2:39:11)
plan right

[Speaker 1] (2:39:11 - 2:39:11)
Yes, yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:39:11 - 2:39:20)
and and some of the missteps on Humphrey Street in retrospect right hindsight's 2020

[Speaker 1] (2:39:20 - 2:39:21)
Yes, yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:39:21 - 2:39:34)
and how frustrating it can be to go down that street and to see three-story buildings that are only residential right and to see that that blocks the view of the ocean and to see that it you know that it really

[Speaker 3] (2:39:36 - 2:39:49)
maybe if we had the opportunity to do again we wouldn't do it that way so I think when from that conversation and from the conversation right post purchase it really felt to me like there was a resounding like

[Speaker 3] (2:39:50 - 2:39:53)
So let's get as far away from residential as possible.

[Speaker 3] (2:39:53 - 2:39:59)
I think that is one of the reasons why the highlight of open space was so strong in the Warren article,

[Speaker 3] (2:40:00 - 2:40:05)
because it was to say this is not the thing that has been happening on that street for

[Speaker 1] (2:40:05 - 2:40:05)
Yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:40:05 - 2:40:07)
the past X amount of years.

[Speaker 3] (2:40:07 - 2:40:13)
And so I understand the fair and balanced approach that your committee takes, and I appreciate that.

[Speaker 3] (2:40:14 - 2:40:18)
But I'm just saying like from what I heard from a public position up until.

[Speaker 3] (2:40:19 - 2:40:45)
You know tonight when we're talking about it it's like well maybe taking what is isn't necessarily the approach for this particular space as the open or mouth of Swampscott and you know that meant to be the gem the entrance into our town we don't want it to look like the rest of the street we actually wish the rest of the street maybe didn't look that way and we actually wish in hindsight we would have done smaller buildings with maybe retail on the bottom floor but we can't do all that over we can

[Speaker 3] (2:40:46 - 2:40:50)
focus on this and do this the way that maybe is going to work better for us going forward.

[Speaker 3] (2:40:50 - 2:40:51)
So that's just an

[Speaker 1] (2:40:51 - 2:40:51)
No,

[Speaker 3] (2:40:51 - 2:40:51)
observation.

[Speaker 1] (2:40:51 - 2:41:02)
I hear you. But I think the town's traumatized by the Concordia. I mean, we heard people say we don't want the Concordia. The town is reacting strongly against the Concordia, which is four and a half stories.

[Speaker 1] (2:41:02 - 2:41:08)
So I understand exactly what you said. But my response to people who were saying that would be,

[Speaker 1] (2:41:08 - 2:41:09)
OK,

[Speaker 1] (2:41:09 - 2:41:10)
but do you like?

[Speaker 1] (2:41:10 - 2:41:19)
You know, do you like the Cassidy Insurance building with pitched roofs and the third floor is in a pitched roof and and it's a human scale and so what's on their apartments everyone goes oh I like that building so

[Speaker 5] (2:41:19 - 2:41:20)
Sure.

[Speaker 1] (2:41:22 - 2:41:25)
It's a tough job to figure out what people are saying.

[Speaker 3] (2:41:26 - 2:41:26)
Yeah,

[Speaker 1] (2:41:26 - 2:41:27)
Don't

[Speaker 3] (2:41:27 - 2:41:27)
I agree

[Speaker 1] (2:41:27 - 2:41:27)
want the concordance.

[Speaker 3] (2:41:27 - 2:41:28)
with you,

[Speaker 3] (2:41:28 - 2:41:28)
Brian,

[Speaker 3] (2:41:28 - 2:41:31)
but I'm here to listen to residents.

[Speaker 3] (2:41:31 - 2:41:34)
I'm not here to convince them of something else. So if they say to me, I don't want residential,

[Speaker 3] (2:41:35 - 2:41:41)
I am responsible to figure out what the definition of what that looks like and how that means so that we're all using same definition basis.

[Speaker 3] (2:41:41 - 2:41:47)
But I'm not here to talk them into it because that's how the plan has to go forward financially.

[Speaker 6] (2:41:47 - 2:41:47)
Right.

[Speaker 7] (2:41:48 - 2:41:48)
Yeah.

[Speaker 1] (2:41:48 - 2:41:50)
I hear you. It's a select,

[Speaker 1] (2:41:51 - 2:41:56)
you guys have a tough job, but I think you owe the town not just representation.

[Speaker 1] (2:41:57 - 2:41:59)
It isn't just count the votes and that's how you vote.

[Speaker 1] (2:41:59 - 2:42:00)
And you know this.

[Speaker 3] (2:42:00 - 2:42:01)
I wish you were that easy,

[Speaker 1] (2:42:01 - 2:42:01)
Yeah,

[Speaker 3] (2:42:01 - 2:42:02)
right?

[Speaker 1] (2:42:02 - 2:42:05)
I know. I know you know this, so I don't mean to preach to you, but it's...

[Speaker 1] (2:42:06 - 2:42:10)
you you you may the select board may have to say why don't why don't our judgment works and

[Speaker 3] (2:42:10 - 2:42:11)
Right. Correct.

[Speaker 1] (2:42:11 - 2:42:34)
and can we make things work and and democracy is part of it for sure i mean we had people come to our meetings we listen we try to try to understand what they're saying um but but people say a lot of things i mean at one of our public meetings some somebody stood up and said humphrey street is dark you know and it's like you know it's not dark i mean whatever plan you're for humphrey street is not dark

[Speaker 1] (2:42:34 - 2:42:49)
it's an East West Street it gets sunlight all the whole day and it's just an amazing you know amazingly light street but in any case the the the West we heard from people we don't want a Westcott we don't want a Concordia and yeah

[Speaker 3] (2:42:49 - 2:42:52)
Well, the Westcott wasn't even built when we started talking about the evolution of the site.

[Speaker 1] (2:42:52 - 2:42:53)
but people

[Speaker 3] (2:42:53 - 2:42:53)
So

[Speaker 1] (2:42:53 - 2:42:53)
well

[Speaker 3] (2:42:53 - 2:42:53)
but

[Speaker 1] (2:42:53 - 2:42:53)
people came

[Speaker 3] (2:42:53 - 2:42:54)
in

[Speaker 1] (2:42:54 - 2:42:54)
people

[Speaker 3] (2:42:54 - 2:42:54)
retrospect,

[Speaker 3] (2:42:54 - 2:42:55)
yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:42:55 - 2:42:55)
OK,

[Speaker 3] (2:42:55 - 2:42:55)
but what

[Speaker 1] (2:42:55 - 2:42:56)
came

[Speaker 3] (2:42:56 - 2:42:56)
I want

[Speaker 1] (2:42:56 - 2:42:56)
to our

[Speaker 3] (2:42:56 - 2:42:56)
to.

[Speaker 1] (2:42:56 - 2:42:57)
committee meetings and said that you

[Speaker 3] (2:42:57 - 2:42:58)
Listen,

[Speaker 1] (2:42:58 - 2:42:58)
know

[Speaker 3] (2:42:58 - 2:43:03)
I think that we you've heard from all of us say we appreciate your committee's work gratefully. We.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:03 - 2:43:05)
We didn't envy the position you were in.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:05 - 2:43:06)
We saw the struggles and

[Speaker 8] (2:43:06 - 2:43:06)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:06 - 2:43:11)
you guys pushed through it. That's something to be commended. I think we all agree on that front.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:11 - 2:43:13)
And, you know, we've just got the

[Speaker 1] (2:43:13 - 2:43:13)
Yeah

[Speaker 3] (2:43:13 - 2:43:14)
report,

[Speaker 3] (2:43:14 - 2:43:16)
appreciate the presentation.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:17 - 2:43:27)
And I think we have to digest this, get it back on a agenda in the near future to have conversations about what this report looks like for all of us and where we go from here.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:28 - 2:43:30)
So we really appreciate both

[Speaker 1] (2:43:30 - 2:43:30)
Thank

[Speaker 3] (2:43:30 - 2:43:30)
of you

[Speaker 1] (2:43:30 - 2:43:30)
you.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:30 - 2:43:30)
coming

[Speaker 1] (2:43:30 - 2:43:31)
Thank you very and much.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:31 - 2:43:31)
all the hard work.

[Speaker 9] (2:43:31 - 2:43:32)
Thank you, Brian.

[Speaker 3] (2:43:33 - 2:43:34)
Is it brief?

[Speaker 3] (2:43:34 - 2:43:35)
Appreciate it.

[Speaker 10] (2:43:35 - 2:43:37)
You spend the nine months waiting.

[Speaker 10] (2:43:39 - 2:44:06)
I would strongly suggest that you go with an RFI or an RFQ to the business community and ask them in a short period of time, I think you could probably get it in 60 to 90 days, real presentations from um developers and users, um that would give you financials, that would give you uses, would give you renderings, and give you a complete presentation in much l less time.

[Speaker 10] (2:44:06 - 2:44:11)
And their purpose is a selfish one. It's to get the highest and best use of the site.

[Speaker 10] (2:44:11 - 2:44:13)
In order for you to reach a decision,

[Speaker 10] (2:44:13 - 2:44:15)
you need as much of that information.

[Speaker 10] (2:44:15 - 2:44:19)
Even if you don't want to hear it or you don't want to consider it,

[Speaker 10] (2:44:19 - 2:44:23)
you should at least have it in front of you to be able to make an informed decision.

[Speaker 10] (2:44:23 - 2:44:28)
And that doesn't happen unless you go out to the business community and ask them to respond RFI or RFQ.

[Speaker 10] (2:44:28 - 2:44:30)
No cost to the town.

[Speaker 3] (2:44:31 - 2:44:31)
Thank you, Charlie.

[Speaker 11] (2:44:33 - 2:44:34)
Thank you, Brian.

[Speaker 3] (2:44:34 - 2:44:34)
Thank

[Speaker 11] (2:44:34 - 2:44:35)
Thank you,

[Speaker 3] (2:44:35 - 2:44:35)
you.

[Speaker 11] (2:44:35 - 2:44:35)
Tara.

[Speaker 3] (2:44:35 - 2:44:37)
Appreciate it. Um okay, moving

[Speaker 11] (2:44:37 - 2:44:40)
Are you guys having did you guys have a party after your last meeting?

[Speaker 12] (2:44:41 - 2:44:41)
Did you have

[Speaker 13] (2:44:41 - 2:44:41)
Last

[Speaker 12] (2:44:41 - 2:44:42)
board members

[Speaker 13] (2:44:42 - 2:44:42)
night?

[Speaker 12] (2:44:42 - 2:44:42)
at the hospital?

[Speaker 1] (2:44:42 - 2:44:48)
We're hoping to continue to participate, you know, in s in in some fashion. I mean, that w what I

[Speaker 11] (2:44:48 - 2:44:48)
Well,

[Speaker 1] (2:44:48 - 2:44:55)
what I presented here was just touching the tops of our you know, of what we uh it's Kara's not I'm not

[Speaker 11] (2:44:55 - 2:44:56)
volunteering no, I I just

[Speaker 13] (2:44:56 - 2:44:56)
I

[Speaker 1] (2:44:56 - 2:44:56)
I'm not

[Speaker 13] (2:44:56 - 2:44:56)
w I

[Speaker 11] (2:44:56 - 2:44:56)
I

[Speaker 1] (2:44:56 - 2:44:56)
I volunteering

[Speaker 13] (2:44:56 - 2:44:57)
want to be really clear

[Speaker 1] (2:44:57 - 2:44:57)
Kara.

[Speaker 13] (2:44:57 - 2:44:58)
very clear from

[Speaker 11] (2:44:58 - 2:44:58)
I I

[Speaker 13] (2:44:58 - 2:45:01)
many of your members that they're they're pretty much all set

[Speaker 1] (2:45:01 - 2:45:01)
Yeah.

[Speaker 13] (2:45:01 - 2:45:01)
with the process,

[Speaker 11] (2:45:01 - 2:45:01)
I think

[Speaker 13] (2:45:01 - 2:45:02)
so.

[Speaker 11] (2:45:02 - 2:45:08)
I just think we should be really clear that your committee's work is complete and this select board is very appreciative of it, but

[Speaker 11] (2:45:09 - 2:45:11)
Tara, you guys are now retired.

[Speaker 11] (2:45:11 - 2:45:14)
If you want to arrange your going away party,

[Speaker 11] (2:45:14 - 2:45:15)
thank

[Speaker 3] (2:45:16 - 2:45:17)
Okay, moving

[Speaker 11] (2:45:17 - 2:45:17)
you.

[Speaker 3] (2:45:17 - 2:45:22)
on to item number five, review of special town meeting warrant.

[Speaker 10] (2:45:23 - 2:45:24)
I'm a father.

[Speaker 11] (2:45:24 - 2:45:24)
Discuss.

[Speaker 3] (2:45:24 - 2:45:30)
discussion and votes on articles for inclusion in the warrant. Thank you again Brian and Tara.

[Speaker 11] (2:45:30 - 2:45:31)
Thank you, Charlie.

[Speaker 3] (2:45:31 - 2:45:32)
Um let's

[Speaker 11] (2:45:32 - 2:45:32)
Charlie,

[Speaker 3] (2:45:32 - 2:45:34)
and Charlie and Neil

[Speaker 11] (2:45:34 - 2:45:34)
Neil.

[Speaker 3] (2:45:34 - 2:45:35)
and everybody's leaving now.

[Speaker 10] (2:45:35 - 2:45:36)
Well, thank you for your time.

[Speaker 11] (2:45:36 - 2:45:38)
Neil, don't lose that envelope.

[Speaker 1] (2:45:38 - 2:45:39)
No, I got it.

[Speaker 3] (2:45:39 - 2:45:39)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (2:45:39 - 2:45:41)
I don't know what I'd like it for.

[Speaker 3] (2:45:41 - 2:45:41)
Nick, you

[Speaker 15] (2:45:41 - 2:45:41)
So,

[Speaker 3] (2:45:41 - 2:45:41)
ready?

[Speaker 15] (2:45:41 - 2:45:49)
I mean, yes, this is for us to go through to vote on your recommendation as long as you all are comfortable on doing that tonight.

[Speaker 15] (2:45:50 - 2:45:50)
Um

[Speaker 11] (2:45:50 - 2:45:51)
We will call the authority.

[Speaker 15] (2:45:51 - 2:45:58)
nothing has changed the one question that is outstanding in this is the adjustment to tax rates. Um we can

[Speaker 3] (2:45:58 - 2:46:01)
Hold on one second. Brian, your microphone Brian,

[Speaker 11] (2:46:01 - 2:46:01)
Brian.

[Speaker 3] (2:46:01 - 2:46:06)
your microphone is still live. So although we can't hear you, people at home might. So I just want to caution you.

[Speaker 10] (2:46:06 - 2:46:06)
Thank you.

[Speaker 3] (2:46:06 - 2:46:07)
Thank you.

[Speaker 3] (2:46:07 - 2:46:08)
Yeah yeah.

[Speaker 11] (2:46:08 - 2:46:09)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 3] (2:46:09 - 2:46:09)
Go ahead. Sorry.

[Speaker 15] (2:46:09 - 2:46:19)
That's fine. Um so we can go through an order when we get the adjustment to tax rates, there's a determination that I would love to get from you all on where you would like that to be.

[Speaker 15] (2:46:20 - 2:46:31)
Um and this in terms of preparation I know I mentioned it, tomorrow we're getting together with the moderator, uh town council and others just to make sure we have things lined up, so

[Speaker 3] (2:46:31 - 2:46:31)
Okay.

[Speaker 15] (2:46:31 - 2:46:37)
you know I wanted to give you that background, but this is for you all to have discussion on individual topics if you'd like or to make recommendations.

[Speaker 3] (2:46:37 - 2:46:38)
Okay.

[Speaker 11] (2:46:38 - 2:46:41)
Are we looking at voting before FinCom?

[Speaker 3] (2:46:42 - 2:46:42)
I feel like we

[Speaker 15] (2:46:42 - 2:46:43)
They are they are

[Speaker 3] (2:46:43 - 2:46:43)
were before.

[Speaker 15] (2:46:43 - 2:46:49)
meeting tomorrow, so if you would like we could have discussions and hold the vote till that that evening.

[Speaker 15] (2:46:50 - 2:46:54)
Um, I don't necessarily think that's the best from a planning standpoint,

[Speaker 16] (2:46:54 - 2:46:54)
Right.

[Speaker 15] (2:46:54 - 2:46:56)
so I'm already gonna try to give you an update on assessors right then, but

[Speaker 3] (2:46:57 - 2:47:05)
Um we ha yes, we have in the past because of we traditionally wait till thing come, we have in the past voted the evening of

[Speaker 3] (2:47:06 - 2:47:14)
EAB, I recall in the past has gotten that information to the moderator so that we could then present the f, you know, favourable action five to O_ and then up.

[Speaker 15] (2:47:14 - 2:47:15)
And

[Speaker 3] (2:47:15 - 2:47:15)
We could

[Speaker 15] (2:47:15 - 2:47:15)
we

[Speaker 3] (2:47:15 - 2:47:15)
do that.

[Speaker 15] (2:47:15 - 2:47:17)
can we can do that and if

[Speaker 3] (2:47:17 - 2:47:17)
I we mean

[Speaker 15] (2:47:17 - 2:47:18)
want

[Speaker 3] (2:47:18 - 2:47:20)
I think for the financial articles it probably

[Speaker 15] (2:47:20 - 2:47:20)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (2:47:20 - 2:47:23)
makes sense. I don't know how do others feel?

[Speaker 11] (2:47:27 - 2:47:27)
Yes.

[Speaker 15] (2:47:27 - 2:47:29)
I mean, they're they're they all have a financial impact.

[Speaker 1] (2:47:29 - 2:47:30)
They all have

[Speaker 3] (2:47:30 - 2:47:30)
They

[Speaker 1] (2:47:30 - 2:47:30)
financial.

[Speaker 3] (2:47:30 - 2:47:30)
all have financial

[Speaker 15] (2:47:30 - 2:47:31)
So

[Speaker 3] (2:47:31 - 2:47:31)
impacts.

[Speaker 15] (2:47:31 - 2:47:36)
in fairness, if we're gonna do that, we can we could use tonight for any discussion or request

[Speaker 3] (2:47:36 - 2:47:37)
Okay.

[Speaker 15] (2:47:37 - 2:47:45)
for additional information you may need and I think you know the one I would defer to you now that I know this and I apologise, but on the tax rate adjustment,

[Speaker 15] (2:47:45 - 2:47:49)
is that one that you normally leave to FinCom first or that you would set a number and they would recommend?

[Speaker 11] (2:47:50 - 2:47:52)
Um, I think we've set the number we've set the number and

[Speaker 15] (2:47:52 - 2:47:52)
Okay.

[Speaker 11] (2:47:52 - 2:47:54)
then they recommend then they've

[Speaker 11] (2:47:54 - 2:47:55)
Put on board or not.

[Speaker 11] (2:47:57 - 2:47:57)
I don't know how

[Speaker 15] (2:47:57 - 2:48:01)
So, I mean, are we really going to hold off on approving bills of prior fiscal

[Speaker 11] (2:48:01 - 2:48:01)
Yeah.

[Speaker 15] (2:48:01 - 2:48:01)
years? I

[Speaker 3] (2:48:01 - 2:48:01)
No,

[Speaker 15] (2:48:01 - 2:48:02)
mean, let's

[Speaker 3] (2:48:02 - 2:48:02)
I don't think so.

[Speaker 15] (2:48:02 - 2:48:03)
just,

[Speaker 15] (2:48:03 - 2:48:03)
let's

[Speaker 3] (2:48:03 - 2:48:03)
Okay.

[Speaker 15] (2:48:03 - 2:48:05)
take a vote and move forward.

[Speaker 11] (2:48:05 - 2:48:05)
Right.

[Speaker 15] (2:48:06 - 2:48:07)
So Article 1 is,

[Speaker 15] (2:48:07 - 2:48:09)
as David just mentioned,

[Speaker 15] (2:48:09 - 2:48:15)
the approval of prior year's fiscal bills, prior fiscal year's bills. Um, they're listed.

[Speaker 15] (2:48:16 - 2:48:21)
We can speak to them each individually or, if you have any questions, uh Patrick and I are here to answer them.

[Speaker 17] (2:48:21 - 2:48:23)
Wait, do these continue to grow? I mean, it seems

[Speaker 11] (2:48:23 - 2:48:23)
Yeah.

[Speaker 17] (2:48:23 - 2:48:28)
like the first time we saw the warrant there were three or four items and now there's, you know,

[Speaker 17] (2:48:28 - 2:48:29)
fifteen or so.

[Speaker 13] (2:48:29 - 2:48:32)
Looks like the same list as last meeting, is it?

[Speaker 15] (2:48:32 - 2:48:35)
Yeah, I don't believe anything's been added since we were together two weeks ago.

[Speaker 1] (2:48:35 - 2:48:35)
together two weeks ago?

[Speaker 2] (2:48:36 - 2:48:38)
since we last looked at the warrant?

[Speaker 2] (2:48:40 - 2:48:43)
From when we first looked at the warrant and last time we met.

[Speaker 2] (2:48:45 - 2:48:51)
A couple items were added that we added to the table that were presented to you last time, but nothing's changed since then.

[Speaker 3] (2:48:51 - 2:48:54)
But nothing's changed since okay, since we I wasn't at the last meeting, but

[Speaker 2] (2:48:54 - 2:48:54)
Nothing

[Speaker 3] (2:48:54 - 2:48:54)
so that

[Speaker 2] (2:48:54 - 2:48:54)
new

[Speaker 3] (2:48:54 - 2:48:54)
that

[Speaker 2] (2:48:54 - 2:48:55)
on makes the table

[Speaker 3] (2:48:55 - 2:48:55)
sense

[Speaker 2] (2:48:55 - 2:48:55)
since then.

[Speaker 3] (2:48:55 - 2:48:56)
that it has changed

[Speaker 2] (2:48:56 - 2:48:56)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (2:48:56 - 2:48:57)
since I've last seen

[Speaker 4] (2:48:57 - 2:48:57)
David

[Speaker 2] (2:48:57 - 2:48:57)
Yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:48:57 - 2:48:57)
it.

[Speaker 4] (2:48:57 - 2:48:58)
suggested it but it's

[Speaker 5] (2:48:58 - 2:49:03)
So it's yes to both, you and Danielle. It has not changed since Danielle's seen it, it has changed since you've

[Speaker 3] (2:49:03 - 2:49:03)
Okay,

[Speaker 5] (2:49:03 - 2:49:03)
last

[Speaker 4] (2:49:03 - 2:49:03)
Right.

[Speaker 5] (2:49:03 - 2:49:03)
seen it.

[Speaker 3] (2:49:03 - 2:49:03)
fair,

[Speaker 4] (2:49:03 - 2:49:03)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (2:49:03 - 2:49:04)
fair.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:04 - 2:49:04)
Right.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:04 - 2:49:08)
All right so I'll entertain a vote then.

[Speaker 2] (2:49:10 - 2:49:10)
Just

[Speaker 4] (2:49:10 - 2:49:15)
of action to support the article number one approving the bills.

[Speaker 3] (2:49:15 - 2:49:15)
So moved.

[Speaker 6] (2:49:15 - 2:49:16)
Second.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:16 - 2:49:18)
And we will take a roll call,

[Speaker 4] (2:49:18 - 2:49:18)
Doug?

[Speaker 5] (2:49:19 - 2:49:19)
Aye.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:19 - 2:49:20)
Mary Ellen?

[Speaker 6] (2:49:20 - 2:49:20)
Aye.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:20 - 2:49:21)
David?

[Speaker 3] (2:49:21 - 2:49:21)
Aye.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:22 - 2:49:22)
And Danielle?

[Speaker 6] (2:49:22 - 2:49:23)
Aye.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:23 - 2:49:28)
Aye and aye and aye. So five to oh, we vote favorable action on that.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:29 - 2:49:29)
Article two.

[Speaker 5] (2:49:30 - 2:49:36)
Article two, to give it a thumbnail that I'm sure Patrick may cringe at,

[Speaker 5] (2:49:36 - 2:49:39)
we're doing the shuffle for things that we know need to be shuffled.

[Speaker 5] (2:49:40 - 2:49:49)
So rather than waiting until the end of the year, we want to make these adjustments right now so that what's appropriate reflects what we anticipate actually spending.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:49 - 2:49:50)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (2:49:51 - 2:49:52)
So I make a motion second

[Speaker 4] (2:49:52 - 2:49:53)
Oh.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:55 - 2:49:56)
Uh, Mary Allen. Doug.

[Speaker 5] (2:49:57 - 2:49:57)
Hi.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:58 - 2:49:59)
Danielle.

[Speaker 7] (2:49:59 - 2:49:59)
Aye.

[Speaker 4] (2:49:59 - 2:50:00)
David.

[Speaker 2] (2:50:00 - 2:50:00)
Hi.

[Speaker 4] (2:50:00 - 2:50:02)
And I'm an aye. So we're five oh there.

[Speaker 4] (2:50:03 - 2:50:05)
Uh and that was favorable, right?

[Speaker 7] (2:50:05 - 2:50:05)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 4] (2:50:06 - 2:50:07)
Okay. Just to make sure.

[Speaker 5] (2:50:08 - 2:50:15)
Article three had been related to my overly optimistic hope that we might be able to have at least one come before us.

[Speaker 5] (2:50:15 - 2:50:21)
Uh I do not anticipate that, so this is one that when we get to town meeting will be moving through regardless.

[Speaker 7] (2:50:21 - 2:50:21)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 5] (2:50:21 - 2:50:29)
Um so I was gonna talk to them tomorrow about what whether it's withdraw, indefinitely postpone, I don't know exactly what language

[Speaker 4] (2:50:29 - 2:50:29)
Okay.

[Speaker 5] (2:50:29 - 2:50:31)
the moderator would prefer, and

[Speaker 4] (2:50:31 - 2:50:31)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 5] (2:50:31 - 2:50:35)
we'll figure that out tomorrow with council so we can s we can leave that to Monday n

[Speaker 4] (2:50:35 - 2:50:36)
Okay. And so we can table that.

[Speaker 3] (2:50:36 - 2:50:36)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (2:50:37 - 2:50:37)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (2:50:38 - 2:50:39)
Uh article four.

[Speaker 5] (2:50:39 - 2:50:44)
I recall four is an annual transfer that we do for the homeless and foster care transportation

[Speaker 4] (2:50:44 - 2:50:44)
Yeah.

[Speaker 5] (2:50:44 - 2:50:45)
costs.

[Speaker 7] (2:50:45 - 2:50:47)
So I just want to comment on this.

[Speaker 7] (2:50:49 - 2:51:01)
What we did was this actually we just started doing this a few years ago in making sure that when this money came back in it didn't sit in our town account,

[Speaker 7] (2:51:01 - 2:51:03)
that it was moved over to the schools.

[Speaker 7] (2:51:04 - 2:51:07)
That was an agreement we made I think it was two and a half years ago.

[Speaker 7] (2:51:11 - 2:51:30)
But, which it it should go to schools, however, there is a new situation that's involved. The schools now have, in the revolving account, they have five hundred and seventy four thousand dollars um that they have retained in this in this revolving account which

[Speaker 4] (2:51:30 - 2:51:30)
You're

[Speaker 7] (2:51:30 - 2:51:30)
mean

[Speaker 4] (2:51:30 - 2:51:31)
talking about the Nahat revolving account?

[Speaker 7] (2:51:31 - 2:51:37)
it's called yup the Nahant revolving account. Um and I think we I think we should move this to

[Speaker 7] (2:51:38 - 2:51:43)
the later town meeting until we resolve what's happening with that revolving account.

[Speaker 3] (2:51:43 - 2:51:46)
But what does this have to do with foster care

[Speaker 2] (2:51:46 - 2:51:46)
transportation It doesn't.

[Speaker 3] (2:51:46 - 2:51:47)
reimbursement?

[Speaker 7] (2:51:47 - 2:51:57)
So this, there would be no reason to put this, this money could still sit in the operating, in the town operating account versus moving it over into the schools.

[Speaker 7] (2:51:59 - 2:52:09)
If the schools are already sitting on five, I think the question that I have here, the schools are sitting on $574,000 in their revolving account.

[Speaker 7] (2:52:09 - 2:52:13)
The money was never spent on any budgeted items last year.

[Speaker 7] (2:52:13 - 2:52:18)
So until we really figure out what has happened there,

[Speaker 7] (2:52:18 - 2:52:22)
why was that never disclosed prior to the budget?

[Speaker 7] (2:52:22 - 2:52:32)
Even when we're looking to approve the budget, I think this money should still remain in the town account and get everything worked out and then figure out what to do from there.

[Speaker 8] (2:52:33 - 2:52:34)
Have you, has,

[Speaker 8] (2:52:34 - 2:52:39)
I think Nick has had conversations about that revolving account with the schools, correct?

[Speaker 5] (2:52:39 - 2:52:39)
I have they

[Speaker 8] (2:52:39 - 2:52:46)
Right, so there is resolution or is there not, or we're at least clearer on the process of what happened.

[Speaker 5] (2:52:46 - 2:52:49)
they provided in a meeting with it was Patrick and I said

[Speaker 5] (2:52:50 - 2:52:56)
sat down with Jason um and Cheryl to talk about how in

[Speaker 8] (2:52:56 - 2:52:56)
And why and

[Speaker 5] (2:52:56 - 2:52:56)
how

[Speaker 8] (2:52:56 - 2:52:57)
when or

[Speaker 5] (2:52:57 - 2:53:05)
and why the the discussion of that um I don't know you know with this um obviously I defer to how you all would like to move forward.

[Speaker 8] (2:53:05 - 2:53:06)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 7] (2:53:08 - 2:53:11)
I, before any money is

[Speaker 5] (2:53:11 - 2:53:11)
Well

[Speaker 7] (2:53:11 - 2:53:11)
moved

[Speaker 5] (2:53:11 - 2:53:11)
I

[Speaker 7] (2:53:11 - 2:53:11)
around,

[Speaker 5] (2:53:11 - 2:53:12)
think

[Speaker 7] (2:53:12 - 2:53:15)
I want to know what's going on here and

[Speaker 7] (2:53:16 - 2:53:25)
You know, there's a lot of money. This is almost $600,000 is sitting in an account that the school committee is calling their c their cushion.

[Speaker 8] (2:53:26 - 2:53:31)
But I think we should be really careful before we start calling things that way, right?

[Speaker 7] (2:53:31 - 2:53:34)
I'm only repeating the school committee. I'm not, I'm

[Speaker 8] (2:53:34 - 2:53:34)
Right,

[Speaker 7] (2:53:34 - 2:53:34)
repeating

[Speaker 8] (2:53:34 - 2:53:35)
but our

[Speaker 7] (2:53:35 - 2:53:35)
the school committee.

[Speaker 8] (2:53:35 - 2:53:38)
town administrator has had conversations with the school department.

[Speaker 8] (2:53:38 - 2:53:41)
that are that are explanations

[Speaker 9] (2:53:41 - 2:53:43)
about what you're talking about. So I don't wanna

[Speaker 8] (2:53:43 - 2:53:51)
go and say that they're doing X or they're padding or that i without really knowing the full picture, right? And I think we need more information to know

[Speaker 3] (2:53:51 - 2:53:51)
I

[Speaker 8] (2:53:51 - 2:53:51)
what's

[Speaker 3] (2:53:51 - 2:53:52)
yeah, I have no idea.

[Speaker 8] (2:53:52 - 2:53:52)
happening.

[Speaker 3] (2:53:52 - 2:53:53)
I have no idea.

[Speaker 8] (2:53:53 - 2:53:53)
Right?

[Speaker 8] (2:53:53 - 2:53:53)
Right exactly.

[Speaker 7] (2:53:53 - 2:53:58)
Just to be clear, I'm uh I am only repeating exactly what was said at school committee meetings.

[Speaker 4] (2:53:59 - 2:54:01)
You're saying at the school committee meeting they used the word cushion?

[Speaker 7] (2:54:02 - 2:54:02)
Yes.

[Speaker 4] (2:54:02 - 2:54:03)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (2:54:03 - 2:54:03)
Yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:54:04 - 2:54:08)
Mr. County Administrator, can we get a memo or some kind of written

[Speaker 8] (2:54:10 - 2:54:10)
Understandability.

[Speaker 3] (2:54:10 - 2:54:11)
notifications so

[Speaker 4] (2:54:11 - 2:54:11)
Yeah,

[Speaker 9] (2:54:11 - 2:54:11)
Yeah,

[Speaker 8] (2:54:11 - 2:54:11)
how

[Speaker 3] (2:54:11 - 2:54:11)
we

[Speaker 4] (2:54:11 - 2:54:12)
I think

[Speaker 3] (2:54:12 - 2:54:12)
can it so

[Speaker 4] (2:54:12 - 2:54:12)
it would come

[Speaker 3] (2:54:12 - 2:54:12)
we can

[Speaker 9] (2:54:12 - 2:54:12)
how

[Speaker 3] (2:54:12 - 2:54:13)
all be brought

[Speaker 9] (2:54:13 - 2:54:13)
they

[Speaker 3] (2:54:13 - 2:54:13)
up to

[Speaker 9] (2:54:13 - 2:54:13)
define

[Speaker 3] (2:54:13 - 2:54:13)
speed on

[Speaker 9] (2:54:13 - 2:54:13)
it

[Speaker 3] (2:54:13 - 2:54:13)
this?

[Speaker 9] (2:54:13 - 2:54:14)
too or

[Speaker 5] (2:54:14 - 2:54:14)
Yes.

[Speaker 9] (2:54:14 - 2:54:14)
what the conversation

[Speaker 4] (2:54:14 - 2:54:15)
Yeah, I mean, it's

[Speaker 5] (2:54:15 - 2:54:17)
And I there's a memo that I believe was drafted.

[Speaker 5] (2:54:18 - 2:54:22)
May I maybe I actually think I am not confusing things with it.

[Speaker 5] (2:54:22 - 2:54:24)
But yes, we can put something together,

[Speaker 5] (2:54:24 - 2:54:32)
we can share it before town meeting, we can share it in advance of that but deliberate on it as a group in person at at that meeting prior to town meeting.

[Speaker 5] (2:54:34 - 2:54:35)
You know, right,

[Speaker 4] (2:54:35 - 2:54:38)
I would assume that memo would come from Cheryl, for

[Speaker 5] (2:54:38 - 2:54:38)
and that's

[Speaker 4] (2:54:38 - 2:54:47)
her to give an explanation on how that account got to its level and what the plan is

[Speaker 5] (2:54:47 - 2:54:48)
Exactly. And I would

[Speaker 4] (2:54:48 - 2:54:48)
about.

[Speaker 5] (2:54:48 - 2:54:50)
uh I would coordinate with Jason and Cheryl

[Speaker 4] (2:54:50 - 2:54:50)
Okay, great.

[Speaker 5] (2:54:50 - 2:54:53)
along with our finance sta staff absolutely.

[Speaker 4] (2:54:53 - 2:54:54)
Yeah. So

[Speaker 4] (2:54:54 - 2:55:04)
I mean basically you're saying let's withhold $26,000 that we're under MOU to give them because you feel like we haven't resolved this other issue which is much greater.

[Speaker 7] (2:55:04 - 2:55:06)
Yeah, I'm that is what I'm saying.

[Speaker 7] (2:55:06 - 2:55:12)
I'm saying I don't want to I don't want to do anything financially until we have real clarity on what's happening

[Speaker 4] (2:55:18 - 2:55:18)
I mean,

[Speaker 9] (2:55:18 - 2:55:19)
I'm going it to say that I disagree with that.

[Speaker 4] (2:55:19 - 2:55:23)
feels a little bit like punishing when we don't know the full picture.

[Speaker 9] (2:55:23 - 2:55:23)
Yeah,

[Speaker 4] (2:55:23 - 2:55:23)
And I know

[Speaker 9] (2:55:23 - 2:55:23)
because

[Speaker 4] (2:55:23 - 2:55:23)
you're I saying,

[Speaker 9] (2:55:23 - 2:55:24)
believe the picture

[Speaker 4] (2:55:24 - 2:55:24)
like,

[Speaker 9] (2:55:24 - 2:55:24)
is

[Speaker 4] (2:55:24 - 2:55:25)
you

[Speaker 9] (2:55:25 - 2:55:25)
there

[Speaker 4] (2:55:25 - 2:55:25)
don't know the full picture,

[Speaker 9] (2:55:25 - 2:55:26)
and we and

[Speaker 4] (2:55:26 - 2:55:28)
so you don't want to give it to them. And I'm saying, well, I don't know the full picture,

[Speaker 4] (2:55:28 - 2:55:31)
so I'd rather give it to them. So it's...

[Speaker 9] (2:55:31 - 2:55:32)
It's not like

[Speaker 5] (2:55:32 - 2:55:36)
I don't want to speak for anyone that works for the schools or the school committee,

[Speaker 5] (2:55:36 - 2:55:43)
but I think that we would have an opportunity to ask for greater explanation and more detail as a part of the budget process that we're engaging in.

[Speaker 5] (2:55:44 - 2:55:52)
My sense so far is that there would there would be an openness to having a discussion around how and why they came to the conclusions and made the decisions that they did.

[Speaker 5] (2:55:53 - 2:56:03)
The leverage is certainly different as we get into a full budget discussion as opposed to a reimbursement that's under MOU. That would be my only feedback.

[Speaker 9] (2:56:04 - 2:56:11)
I don't want to fault them in advance when there is a very logical reason and explanation for what they did what they did.

[Speaker 9] (2:56:12 - 2:56:12)
personally.

[Speaker 10] (2:56:13 - 2:56:16)
And it seems a little bit like I get the idea,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:17 - 2:56:19)
but it seems...

[Speaker 10] (2:56:20 - 2:56:20)
Uh,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:21 - 2:56:21)
I

[Speaker 9] (2:56:21 - 2:56:22)
Punitive.

[Speaker 10] (2:56:22 - 2:56:24)
know it's all school committee,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:24 - 2:56:25)
you know, school money,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:25 - 2:56:25)
um,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:26 - 2:56:28)
but it seems to be kind of mixing a couple of things up,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:28 - 2:56:28)
um,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:28 - 2:56:32)
and I think if I'm reading, understanding,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:32 - 2:56:34)
I'm not sure why we're not directly talking about what's happening,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:34 - 2:56:37)
except for the fact that the schools aren't here to talk about it for themselves,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:37 - 2:56:37)
um,

[Speaker 4] (2:56:37 - 2:56:38)
Right.

[Speaker 10] (2:56:38 - 2:56:39)
but,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:39 - 2:56:39)
um,

[Speaker 5] (2:56:39 - 2:56:41)
I'll answer that

[Speaker 10] (2:56:41 - 2:56:41)
you

[Speaker 5] (2:56:41 - 2:56:41)
directly.

[Speaker 10] (2:56:41 - 2:56:41)
know, well,

[Speaker 5] (2:56:41 - 2:56:42)
Yes,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:42 - 2:56:42)
when

[Speaker 5] (2:56:42 - 2:56:46)
I would like them to be here to discuss the decision-making process rather than me paraphrasing.

[Speaker 5] (2:56:46 - 2:56:46)
Raising a conversation.

[Speaker 10] (2:56:46 - 2:56:48)
Yeah, great.

[Speaker 10] (2:56:48 - 2:56:53)
I just wanted to make that explicit just in case people were trying to understand what was going on here.

[Speaker 10] (2:56:54 - 2:56:58)
But I do think that if I understood what you were saying, Nick,

[Speaker 10] (2:56:58 - 2:57:02)
that that $600,000 is still going to be there.

[Speaker 10] (2:57:03 - 2:57:13)
Either it's going to be, I don't know what the flexibility is for the schools to spend that money on, you know, whatever they want or there are restrictions on it.

[Speaker 10] (2:57:13 - 2:57:22)
Um, but they'll either spend it on, you know, so I guess, first of all, do we know the answer to that question? Is it totally flexible what they spend it on or not?

[Speaker 9] (2:57:22 - 2:57:27)
My understanding is that they could have spent it completely down to zero if they

[Speaker 4] (2:57:27 - 2:57:28)
So long as

[Speaker 9] (2:57:28 - 2:57:28)
chose

[Speaker 4] (2:57:28 - 2:57:28)
it was

[Speaker 9] (2:57:28 - 2:57:28)
not.

[Speaker 4] (2:57:28 - 2:57:31)
in pursuit of the education of not students,

[Speaker 7] (2:57:31 - 2:57:31)
It

[Speaker 4] (2:57:31 - 2:57:31)
right?

[Speaker 7] (2:57:31 - 2:57:33)
has to be used for for

[Speaker 9] (2:57:33 - 2:57:34)
Educational purposes.

[Speaker 7] (2:57:34 - 2:57:38)
an operational purpose for educational purpose, which means the middle school in the high school.

[Speaker 5] (2:57:40 - 2:57:42)
And it can be spent on general education,

[Speaker 4] (2:57:42 - 2:57:42)
And

[Speaker 5] (2:57:42 - 2:57:42)
special

[Speaker 4] (2:57:42 - 2:57:43)
that there

[Speaker 5] (2:57:43 - 2:57:43)
education.

[Speaker 4] (2:57:43 - 2:57:43)
were,

[Speaker 5] (2:57:43 - 2:57:53)
There is flexibility to it, but I honestly I would much prefer that this discussion includes members of the school staff, uh school leadership,

[Speaker 4] (2:57:53 - 2:57:54)
so that we're not misrepresenting

[Speaker 5] (2:57:54 - 2:57:55)
as opposed to,

[Speaker 4] (2:57:55 - 2:57:55)
anything.

[Speaker 5] (2:57:55 - 2:57:55)
correct.

[Speaker 4] (2:57:56 - 2:57:57)
Yeah.

[Speaker 10] (2:57:57 - 2:58:04)
Okay, so maybe this is a very clear one that we should wait to vote on until we at least until before town meeting,

[Speaker 10] (2:58:05 - 2:58:08)
right before town meeting to see if there's more information we could get.

[Speaker 4] (2:58:09 - 2:58:09)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (2:58:11 - 2:58:12)
Does any everybody agree with Doug?

[Speaker 9] (2:58:13 - 2:58:13)
Yep.

[Speaker 4] (2:58:13 - 2:58:14)
Table it till then.

[Speaker 9] (2:58:14 - 2:58:17)
What I don't really what what did Doug so what does Doug

[Speaker 4] (2:58:17 - 2:58:17)
I

[Speaker 9] (2:58:17 - 2:58:17)
have to think say?

[Speaker 4] (2:58:17 - 2:58:18)
you're saying to table it till

[Speaker 9] (2:58:18 - 2:58:20)
To table it Doug is that your

[Speaker 4] (2:58:20 - 2:58:20)
the

[Speaker 9] (2:58:20 - 2:58:20)
suggestion?

[Speaker 4] (2:58:20 - 2:58:20)
first.

[Speaker 3] (2:58:20 - 2:58:20)
Table article

[Speaker 10] (2:58:20 - 2:58:23)
Yeah, just just for the next week until we

[Speaker 4] (2:58:23 - 2:58:23)
Table

[Speaker 10] (2:58:23 - 2:58:26)
have it are. you know our final final vote on things right before town meeting

[Speaker 4] (2:58:27 - 2:58:29)
Table the discussion of the vote not the warrant article.

[Speaker 10] (2:58:30 - 2:58:31)
right

[Speaker 1] (2:58:30 - 2:58:31)
Right.

[Speaker 2] (2:58:36 - 2:58:38)
I think it's apples and oranges,

[Speaker 2] (2:58:38 - 2:58:41)
but I mean, I'm certainly happy to go with what.

[Speaker 3] (2:58:43 - 2:58:43)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (2:58:44 - 2:58:47)
We can always circle back. Let's move on to Article 5.

[Speaker 3] (2:58:48 - 2:58:53)
And this is to rescind a vote under Article 6 of the May 25 annual town meeting,

[Speaker 3] (2:58:53 - 2:58:55)
transfer a free cash or special education reserve fund.

[Speaker 3] (2:58:57 - 2:58:58)
You want to, sorry,

[Speaker 4] (2:58:58 - 2:58:59)
Are we on six? Is that, I'm sorry.

[Speaker 3] (2:58:59 - 2:59:03)
yep, article five, which is to rescind article six.

[Speaker 4] (2:59:03 - 2:59:03)
Okay,

[Speaker 4] (2:59:04 - 2:59:05)
that's where I get confused.

[Speaker 3] (2:59:05 - 2:59:05)
Yeah, sorry.

[Speaker 4] (2:59:05 - 2:59:07)
My eyes moved between the two.

[Speaker 4] (2:59:08 - 2:59:13)
This is, it was an identified exceedance of the,

[Speaker 4] (2:59:14 - 2:59:17)
I believe it's 2% cap that is supposed to be in the reserve fund.

[Speaker 2] (2:59:17 - 2:59:18)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 4] (2:59:18 - 2:59:20)
that Cheryl identified,

[Speaker 4] (2:59:20 - 2:59:28)
alerted other staff and they worked through sort of what the best way to do it. The state requires that you do not exceed 2%, I believe the number is.

[Speaker 4] (2:59:29 - 2:59:29)
Again,

[Speaker 4] (2:59:29 - 2:59:31)
I apologize if I'm misspeaking, but I don't think I am.

[Speaker 4] (2:59:31 - 2:59:38)
And this would get them back under that threshold so as not to have violated the special acts of 2016,

[Speaker 4] (2:59:39 - 2:59:39)
I believe.

[Speaker 2] (2:59:39 - 2:59:39)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 5] (2:59:39 - 2:59:45)
And can you remind us what the transfer of free cash under Article 6 at the May 2025 annual town meeting?

[Speaker 5] (2:59:45 - 2:59:49)
meeting was was that 200 was that 200,000 or four or four hundred thousand?

[Speaker 2] (2:59:49 - 2:59:49)
Yes.

[Speaker 3] (2:59:49 - 2:59:52)
Four hundred and twenty five thousand. Four hundred thousand?

[Speaker 5] (2:59:52 - 2:59:52)
I don't remember.

[Speaker 2] (2:59:52 - 2:59:53)
Patrick.

[Speaker 4] (2:59:53 - 2:59:54)
It was four hundred thousand.

[Speaker 3] (2:59:54 - 2:59:55)
Oh, Thank good

[Speaker 5] (2:59:55 - 2:59:55)
you.

[Speaker 3] (2:59:55 - 2:59:56)
memory, David.

[Speaker 3] (3:00:00 - 3:00:01)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (3:00:02 - 3:00:11)
So basically just say in layman's terms, we authorised the movement of this money, moving that money would have put them over their threshold that the state requires they stay under.

[Speaker 3] (3:00:11 - 3:00:12)
The money never was moved.

[Speaker 4] (3:00:13 - 3:00:15)
Correct. It's

[Speaker 3] (3:00:15 - 3:00:15)
So they

[Speaker 4] (3:00:15 - 3:00:15)
a

[Speaker 3] (3:00:15 - 3:00:24)
never they never hit their threshold because the money money was never moved but now we're rescinding the authorization so that the money does not get moved and put them over their threshold okay

[Speaker 4] (3:00:24 - 3:00:24)
Correct. And

[Speaker 6] (3:00:24 - 3:00:25)
I think

[Speaker 4] (3:00:25 - 3:00:31)
it and the money just if I can just finish that thought it closes out to free cash because it's not appropriate it to anything if this were to pass.

[Speaker 3] (3:00:31 - 3:00:31)
Okay,

[Speaker 4] (3:00:31 - 3:00:31)
So

[Speaker 3] (3:00:31 - 3:00:32)
but it right

[Speaker 4] (3:00:32 - 3:00:36)
doesn't go directly back into the general fund to be spent this year it closes out to free cash at the end of the fiscal

[Speaker 3] (3:00:36 - 3:00:36)
which

[Speaker 4] (3:00:36 - 3:00:37)
year.

[Speaker 3] (3:00:37 - 3:00:37)
Patrick

[Speaker 4] (3:00:37 - 3:00:37)
I'm

[Speaker 3] (3:00:37 - 3:00:38)
is correct

[Speaker 4] (3:00:38 - 3:00:38)
sorry to interrupt you.

[Speaker 6] (3:00:38 - 3:00:42)
That's okay. The reason we moved 400 over was because they were going to have to deplete.

[Speaker 6] (3:00:42 - 3:01:00)
the entire special education fund Patrick that's what my notes show from last year but they didn't have to deplete the special education fund they actually I think finished it at 450 and then the state also sent out another 150 is

[Speaker 3] (3:01:03 - 3:01:04)
Question or comments,

[Speaker 2] (3:01:04 - 3:01:04)
I think.

[Speaker 3] (3:01:04 - 3:01:04)
Mario?

[Speaker 6] (3:01:04 - 3:01:06)
that your recollection

[Speaker 7] (3:01:07 - 3:01:14)
I would say maybe less specifically, more generally, I think there was anticipated cost,

[Speaker 7] (3:01:14 - 3:01:15)
you know, forecasted

[Speaker 2] (3:01:15 - 3:01:16)
Yeah.

[Speaker 7] (3:01:16 - 3:01:17)
need for that fund.

[Speaker 3] (3:01:17 - 3:01:17)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 7] (3:01:17 - 3:01:23)
The need is under and obviously the vote would have put this account over some statutory limit.

[Speaker 3] (3:01:24 - 3:01:24)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (3:01:24 - 3:01:24)
So

[Speaker 6] (3:01:25 - 3:01:26)
Right.

[Speaker 7] (3:01:26 - 3:01:48)
operationally it was not you know raised to us that it would be a concern to not have these funds because between Medicaid receipts which go directly into the special education reserve fund and the transfer contemplated in the next article and the balance that's already accrued in there it's within limits and also meets you know the needs as far as I was you

[Speaker 4] (3:01:48 - 3:01:48)
Yeah.

[Speaker 6] (3:01:48 - 3:01:51)
All right, but currently their funds should be, I think, because if...

[Speaker 6] (3:01:51 - 3:02:17)
If when I first heard this I thought well what if they're not going to have they won't have 400,000 they won't have the 400,000 but when I did a little bit of research they do have they do there that was an anticipated need but they didn't need it at the end they still have they still finished out the year at I think 450 or close to it and then the state also advanced another

[Speaker 6] (3:02:18 - 3:02:26)
another one fifty or one fifty three to multiple municipalities. So they should be up to probably close to six hundred now,

[Speaker 6] (3:02:28 - 3:02:28)
which

[Speaker 7] (3:02:28 - 3:02:28)
Yeah.

[Speaker 6] (3:02:28 - 3:02:34)
is where they where the agreement actually is that there should be a six hundred thousand dollar

[Speaker 2] (3:02:36 - 3:02:36)
Level

[Speaker 7] (3:02:36 - 3:02:36)
I

[Speaker 2] (3:02:36 - 3:02:36)
it.

[Speaker 7] (3:02:36 - 3:02:40)
can I can confirm they ended the fiscal year with 438 980

[Speaker 6] (3:02:40 - 3:02:41)
Oh,

[Speaker 7] (3:02:41 - 3:02:41)
not

[Speaker 6] (3:02:41 - 3:02:41)
right.

[Speaker 7] (3:02:41 - 3:02:45)
including the $400,000 that was anticipated to be transferred so yes

[Speaker 3] (3:02:45 - 3:02:45)
Okay.

[Speaker 6] (3:02:46 - 3:02:46)
Right.

[Speaker 4] (3:02:46 - 3:02:51)
All right, so I I'll move to have the select board support this argument

[Speaker 6] (3:02:51 - 3:02:51)
Yep.

[Speaker 5] (3:02:51 - 3:02:52)
I'll second.

[Speaker 3] (3:02:52 - 3:02:53)
Danielle

[Speaker 6] (3:02:53 - 3:02:53)
Aye.

[Speaker 3] (3:02:53 - 3:02:57)
Doug Danielle David

[Speaker 6] (3:02:57 - 3:02:57)
Aye.

[Speaker 3] (3:02:57 - 3:03:05)
and I am an I okay similar similarly but different is to none of

[Speaker 3] (3:03:05 - 3:03:08)
to then appropriate

[Speaker 4] (3:03:08 - 3:03:21)
Correct. And this is the MOU that we have with them at the end of the fiscal year based on turnbacks and other savings and this is what we would be transferring to them as part of that agreement.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:21 - 3:03:22)
And this is under the two percent threshold.

[Speaker 4] (3:03:22 - 3:03:23)
Correct.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:23 - 3:03:26)
Great. And when does...

[Speaker 5] (3:03:26 - 3:03:26)
Removed.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:26 - 3:03:27)
Oh, okay.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:27 - 3:03:28)
Second,

[Speaker 3] (3:03:28 - 3:03:29)
you said David?

[Speaker 3] (3:03:29 - 3:03:31)
Uh, did you say second?

[Speaker 2] (3:03:31 - 3:03:31)
Danielle.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:31 - 3:03:33)
Oh, Danielle, sorry. Uh, David?

[Speaker 6] (3:03:33 - 3:03:33)
Hi.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:34 - 3:03:34)
Danielle?

[Speaker 2] (3:03:35 - 3:03:35)
Hi.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:35 - 3:03:35)
Doug?

[Speaker 4] (3:03:36 - 3:03:36)
Hi.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:36 - 3:03:37)
Mary Ellen?

[Speaker 6] (3:03:37 - 3:03:43)
I'm a no until we really understand the whole financial situation here.

[Speaker 3] (3:03:43 - 3:03:51)
Okay, I am an aye. Um, so I just want to maybe it doesn't have to be now,

[Speaker 3] (3:03:51 - 3:03:51)
just be great,

[Speaker 3] (3:03:51 - 3:03:57)
maybe you could just explain when these funds get moved because part of the, uh...

[Speaker 3] (3:03:58 - 3:04:02)
Like if we had moved that 400,000 earlier,

[Speaker 3] (3:04:02 - 3:04:09)
then what would have happened? Or like why didn't it get moved? When should it have gotten moved?

[Speaker 3] (3:04:10 - 3:04:11)
When does this get moved?

[Speaker 3] (3:04:12 - 3:04:13)
You don't have to answer now. We

[Speaker 4] (3:04:13 - 3:04:13)
Yeah,

[Speaker 3] (3:04:13 - 3:04:13)
can move

[Speaker 4] (3:04:13 - 3:04:14)
no,

[Speaker 3] (3:04:14 - 3:04:14)
on.

[Speaker 4] (3:04:14 - 3:04:18)
I cannot answer that, as you're well aware, turning and looking at me with that smile.

[Speaker 6] (3:04:18 - 3:04:18)
It's

[Speaker 4] (3:04:18 - 3:04:24)
As to why it did not happen at the time, that is a timing issue that I would defer.

[Speaker 6] (3:04:24 - 3:04:26)
It can't happen until we vote.

[Speaker 4] (3:04:26 - 3:04:27)
No, no, no. We

[Speaker 3] (3:04:27 - 3:04:27)
No,

[Speaker 6] (3:04:27 - 3:04:27)
No,

[Speaker 4] (3:04:27 - 3:04:27)
voted

[Speaker 3] (3:04:27 - 3:04:27)
no,

[Speaker 6] (3:04:27 - 3:04:28)
no, no, no.

[Speaker 4] (3:04:28 - 3:04:28)
on in voted it.

[Speaker 6] (3:04:28 - 3:04:28)
No.

[Speaker 3] (3:04:28 - 3:04:28)
We

[Speaker 4] (3:04:28 - 3:04:28)
it in

[Speaker 6] (3:04:28 - 3:04:28)
We

[Speaker 4] (3:04:28 - 3:04:28)
December.

[Speaker 3] (3:04:28 - 3:04:28)
voted

[Speaker 6] (3:04:28 - 3:04:29)
vote in from

[Speaker 3] (3:04:29 - 3:04:32)
2025 to appropriate those $400,000.

[Speaker 2] (3:04:32 - 3:04:33)
Was it

[Speaker 3] (3:04:33 - 3:04:33)
They

[Speaker 6] (3:04:33 - 3:04:33)
from

[Speaker 2] (3:04:33 - 3:04:33)
May?

[Speaker 3] (3:04:33 - 3:04:34)
never got moved.

[Speaker 6] (3:04:34 - 3:04:34)
from

[Speaker 2] (3:04:34 - 3:04:34)
Our finance

[Speaker 6] (3:04:34 - 3:04:34)
from

[Speaker 2] (3:04:34 - 3:04:37)
department didn't move it, if that was what it is.

[Speaker 6] (3:04:37 - 3:04:37)
No,

[Speaker 4] (3:04:37 - 3:04:37)
Was it

[Speaker 6] (3:04:37 - 3:04:39)
it would have to come from free cash and it can't get moved.

[Speaker 4] (3:04:39 - 3:04:40)
It was from last year's, wasn't

[Speaker 7] (3:04:40 - 3:04:41)
I it? can articulate,

[Speaker 2] (3:04:41 - 3:04:42)
Please.

[Speaker 7] (3:04:42 - 3:04:45)
I talked to the accounting firm a little bit about this.

[Speaker 2] (3:04:45 - 3:04:45)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 7] (3:04:45 - 3:04:52)
So the $400,000 was voted in May and votes are either...

[Speaker 7] (3:04:52 - 3:04:55)
counted towards FY25 or FY26.

[Speaker 7] (3:04:55 - 3:04:57)
This was a transfer into an account, not the operating budget,

[Speaker 7] (3:04:58 - 3:05:07)
so it was interpreted FY26. So our free cash is already reduced by this vote because it was voted prior to year-end.

[Speaker 3] (3:05:07 - 3:05:07)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (3:05:07 - 3:05:13)
So free cash accounts for this $400,000, so it's less knowing that this money is intended to be.

[Speaker 7] (3:05:14 - 3:05:19)
transferred into this fund in FY26. So by rescinding the vote,

[Speaker 7] (3:05:19 - 3:05:25)
those funds will then be available when we close out this fiscal year and it'll flow back into certification.

[Speaker 6] (3:05:26 - 3:05:31)
But it means we can't count $400,000 in our free cash evaluation

[Speaker 7] (3:05:31 - 3:05:31)
It's not.

[Speaker 6] (3:05:31 - 3:05:31)
for

[Speaker 7] (3:05:31 - 3:05:34)
It wouldn't be available to appropriate for other purposes during

[Speaker 6] (3:05:34 - 3:05:34)
next

[Speaker 7] (3:05:34 - 3:05:34)
this

[Speaker 6] (3:05:34 - 3:05:35)
year.

[Speaker 7] (3:05:35 - 3:05:35)
year.

[Speaker 7] (3:05:35 - 3:05:35)
Correct.

[Speaker 3] (3:05:36 - 3:05:39)
So just to put a finer point on it,

[Speaker 3] (3:05:39 - 3:05:39)
Patrick.

[Speaker 3] (3:05:40 - 3:05:42)
It is not that we didn't move it.

[Speaker 3] (3:05:42 - 3:05:46)
It is that we should not have moved it yet, or should we have moved That's it?

[Speaker 7] (3:05:46 - 3:05:46)
my understanding.

[Speaker 3] (3:05:47 - 3:05:47)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (3:05:47 - 3:05:47)
Yes.

[Speaker 3] (3:05:47 - 3:05:59)
So then for Article 6, then when on the timeline do they receive those funds if this gets voted on in favorable action by town meeting in December?

[Speaker 3] (3:06:02 - 3:06:04)
You don't have to answer now either. We can...

[Speaker 7] (3:06:05 - 3:06:05)
I

[Speaker 3] (3:06:05 - 3:06:05)
You've

[Speaker 7] (3:06:05 - 3:06:05)
will defer

[Speaker 3] (3:06:05 - 3:06:05)
done that.

[Speaker 7] (3:06:05 - 3:06:06)
to the accounting firm because

[Speaker 3] (3:06:06 - 3:06:07)
Okay.

[Speaker 7] (3:06:07 - 3:06:08)
they are the experts on the timing

[Speaker 4] (3:06:08 - 3:06:08)
I'll

[Speaker 7] (3:06:08 - 3:06:08)
of that.

[Speaker 4] (3:06:08 - 3:06:09)
ask Bill and Eric.

[Speaker 3] (3:06:09 - 3:06:09)
Thank you.

[Speaker 5] (3:06:09 - 3:06:14)
Yeah, and is that a is that a net number or is that an additional 94?

[Speaker 3] (3:06:14 - 3:06:22)
This is an additional, so this is we're taking back the $400 and then we're giving them $94,894.

[Speaker 4] (3:06:22 - 3:06:22)
They're separate.

[Speaker 4] (3:06:22 - 3:06:23)
They're two separate entries.

[Speaker 3] (3:06:23 - 3:06:24)
Two separate things.

[Speaker 3] (3:06:24 - 3:06:28)
I just want to understand the operation of events and you're going to get back to me. Thank you.

[Speaker 4] (3:06:28 - 3:06:29)
Well, I'll learn from it.

[Speaker 3] (3:06:29 - 3:06:30)
Great.

[Speaker 4] (3:06:31 - 3:06:53)
Um, article seven is the adjustment to the tax rate which we have not set a number for. Um and I know sh tonight we talked about where we anticipate the tax rate being so rough estimate. It's um you know approximately fifteen dollars of impact for every hundred thousand dollars in the buy down.

[Speaker 4] (3:06:55 - 3:06:55)
So

[Speaker 4] (3:06:56 - 3:07:00)
It's a decision that is obviously left to the board and FinCom and others.

[Speaker 4] (3:07:00 - 3:07:13)
I will say it is outside of sort of good financial practice to be spending free cash on things that are not one time, and we've sort of made this an annual event.

[Speaker 3] (3:07:14 - 3:07:14)
We have.

[Speaker 4] (3:07:14 - 3:07:22)
So it's just I want to acknowledge that before we will obviously take whatever direction and vote is decided.

[Speaker 4] (3:07:24 - 3:07:28)
Um but ideally s free cash will be spent on a one-time expense

[Speaker 2] (3:07:28 - 3:07:28)
Mm.

[Speaker 4] (3:07:28 - 3:07:44)
in many communities that's something like capital expense that may not have been anticipated or something like that as opposed to this. But as you think about what number you may want, I just wanted to give you that sort of approximately fifteen dollars. And it's something that we can also wait to act on in case we have better information come the first.

[Speaker 3] (3:07:44 - 3:07:45)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 4] (3:07:45 - 3:07:50)
Um but in terms of thinking about it for every hundred thousand dollars we spend on this it's approximately fifteen dollar

[Speaker 4] (3:07:50 - 3:07:51)
impact on the average home.

[Speaker 6] (3:07:52 - 3:07:52)
Yep.

[Speaker 5] (3:07:52 - 3:07:53)
Okay.

[Speaker 8] (3:07:53 - 3:07:59)
Right, but this is the context about the school though, right, in terms of the promise that was made?

[Speaker 2] (3:07:59 - 3:08:00)
Right.

[Speaker 8] (3:08:00 - 3:08:04)
Is that that's the reason why we do this, Nick? It is kind of a capital expense.

[Speaker 8] (3:08:05 - 3:08:06)
Do you know that history?

[Speaker 4] (3:08:07 - 3:08:08)
A bit.

[Speaker 4] (3:08:08 - 3:08:13)
It's still something that I just wanted to know was not said being my first time through the cycle with you all.

[Speaker 8] (3:08:14 - 3:08:15)
Yeah.

[Speaker 8] (3:08:15 - 3:08:16)
So right,

[Speaker 8] (3:08:16 - 3:08:19)
I mean, I don't know if someone else wants to try to explain it,

[Speaker 8] (3:08:19 - 3:08:26)
but there was a, you know, a goal of trying to keep the impact to, to correct me if I'm wrong.

[Speaker 8] (3:08:26 - 3:08:27)
Go ahead.

[Speaker 4] (3:08:27 - 3:08:29)
I understand what you're saying. It's a...

[Speaker 2] (3:08:34 - 3:08:35)
This was part of the discussion.

[Speaker 3] (3:08:35 - 3:08:36)
Right.

[Speaker 3] (3:08:36 - 3:08:43)
But I don't think, I think what we've said multiple years now is, was the intention first year,

[Speaker 3] (3:08:43 - 3:08:44)
the second year,

[Speaker 3] (3:08:44 - 3:08:49)
how long were we going to maintain the reduction of impact?

[Speaker 3] (3:08:50 - 3:08:52)
for the entirety of

[Speaker 3] (3:08:54 - 3:08:54)
the debt.

[Speaker 4] (3:08:54 - 3:08:55)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (3:08:56 - 3:08:56)
That was

[Speaker 1] (3:08:56 - 3:08:56)
Yeah.

[Speaker 3] (3:08:56 - 3:08:56)
the problem.

[Speaker 5] (3:08:56 - 3:08:57)
As long as as long as we had

[Speaker 3] (3:08:57 - 3:08:57)
As

[Speaker 5] (3:08:57 - 3:08:58)
sufficient

[Speaker 3] (3:08:58 - 3:08:58)
long as we had that

[Speaker 5] (3:08:58 - 3:08:58)
repassion

[Speaker 3] (3:08:58 - 3:08:59)
it was broken.

[Speaker 5] (3:08:59 - 3:08:59)
you

[Speaker 3] (3:08:59 - 3:08:59)
Well

[Speaker 5] (3:08:59 - 3:08:59)
said

[Speaker 3] (3:08:59 - 3:09:00)
yeah, I mean we made a promise

[Speaker 4] (3:09:00 - 3:09:08)
Oh, vote for the school. It's not going to cost you more than the average homeowner more than $350.

[Speaker 1] (3:09:13 - 3:09:15)
And so what is our status with free cash?

[Speaker 1] (3:09:16 - 3:09:17)
Right, that's the relevant

[Speaker 5] (3:09:17 - 3:09:18)
That keeps

[Speaker 1] (3:09:18 - 3:09:19)
question here,

[Speaker 1] (3:09:19 - 3:09:19)
right?

[Speaker 5] (3:09:21 - 3:09:23)
us within our financial guidelines,

[Speaker 5] (3:09:24 - 3:09:24)
Patrick.

[Speaker 6] (3:09:24 - 3:09:29)
I can recap the free cash position for everyone compared to the policies.

[Speaker 6] (3:09:29 - 3:09:34)
Our policy is to maintain 3-5% of free cash compared to our budget.

[Speaker 6] (3:09:35 - 3:09:49)
So this year we came in at 4.4%, which means we have $1,070,000 to appropriate throughout the fiscal year for the various purposes that may come before a town meeting to do so.

[Speaker 6] (3:09:50 - 3:09:52)
So that would be within...

[Speaker 6] (3:09:53 - 3:09:59)
Policy, the maximum that could be used between, you know, considering reducing the tax rate,

[Speaker 6] (3:09:59 - 3:10:06)
voting for, you know, any increases to the budget that come after we set the tax rate and, you know, first year collective bargaining.

[Speaker 6] (3:10:06 - 3:10:17)
Historically, we've sometimes used free cash to fund all those different things. So that's the context that we're in as far as, you know, available resources.

[Speaker 1] (3:10:21 - 3:10:28)
And what we just heard is that tax rate is going to be going up significantly,

[Speaker 1] (3:10:28 - 3:10:30)
right?

[Speaker 5] (3:10:30 - 3:10:31)
Ten and a half percent.

[Speaker 4] (3:10:31 - 3:10:32)
Record high.

[Speaker 1] (3:10:35 - 3:10:42)
And our traditional amount that we've been contributing this way has been somewhere between $850,000 and $1.2 million,

[Speaker 1] (3:10:42 - 3:10:42)
I believe.

[Speaker 2] (3:10:43 - 3:10:45)
So I would just like to make a distinction.

[Speaker 2] (3:10:45 - 3:10:49)
The tax rate is not going to be record high. The tax bills will

[Speaker 4] (3:10:49 - 3:10:49)
It's a tax

[Speaker 2] (3:10:49 - 3:10:49)
be higher.

[Speaker 4] (3:10:49 - 3:10:49)
bill.

[Speaker 2] (3:10:50 - 3:10:57)
I think it's an important distinction because the community has made a concerted effort over more than a decade to make sure the tax rate has lowered.

[Speaker 2] (3:10:58 - 3:10:59)
So that's just

[Speaker 4] (3:10:59 - 3:10:59)
No,

[Speaker 2] (3:10:59 - 3:11:00)
a distinction

[Speaker 4] (3:11:00 - 3:11:00)
we've

[Speaker 2] (3:11:00 - 3:11:01)
I wanted to make.

[Speaker 4] (3:11:01 - 3:11:03)
made an effort to make sure the tax bill.

[Speaker 2] (3:11:05 - 3:11:11)
I'm just saying there's a distinction and something needs to be distinguished between the rate and the ballot I wanted to highlight.

[Speaker 1] (3:11:12 - 3:11:13)
Yes, that's true.

[Speaker 1] (3:11:13 - 3:11:16)
The rate itself is also going up quite a bit, almost 10% too.

[Speaker 3] (3:11:19 - 3:11:21)
Yeah, but Doug, sorry,

[Speaker 3] (3:11:25 - 3:11:26)
it's late.

[Speaker 3] (3:11:28 - 3:11:35)
You were saying 850K to 1.1 million is what we've traditionally spent in the past to smooth that hit

[Speaker 4] (3:11:35 - 3:11:36)
You're right.

[Speaker 3] (3:11:36 - 3:11:38)
to the average tax bill.

[Speaker 3] (3:11:38 - 3:11:42)
But with the CBAs and the other things sort of lingering out there,

[Speaker 3] (3:11:42 - 3:11:44)
I don't think

[Speaker 4] (3:11:44 - 3:11:45)
You really don't have that much.

[Speaker 3] (3:11:45 - 3:11:49)
we have that much, quite frankly. So we have to be thoughtful,

[Speaker 4] (3:11:49 - 3:11:50)
Maybe.

[Speaker 3] (3:11:51 - 3:11:52)
is all.

[Speaker 2] (3:11:53 - 3:11:59)
Is there information that we could provide between now and or provide to you that evening so that you could have a number?

[Speaker 2] (3:12:00 - 3:12:03)
I just want to make sure that you guys are making

[Speaker 3] (3:12:03 - 3:12:03)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 2] (3:12:03 - 3:12:03)
the

[Speaker 4] (3:12:03 - 3:12:04)
If there's

[Speaker 2] (3:12:04 - 3:12:04)
right decision.

[Speaker 4] (3:12:04 - 3:12:08)
any headway that we make with any collective bargaining agreements, I think that would be pertinent, right?

[Speaker 4] (3:12:09 - 3:12:11)
If, I'm just saying, hopeful, wishful thinking.

[Speaker 2] (3:12:11 - 3:12:13)
Between now and December 1st?

[Speaker 4] (3:12:13 - 3:12:13)
Yeah.

[Speaker 4] (3:12:15 - 3:12:16)
Wishful thinking.

[Speaker 1] (3:12:16 - 3:12:19)
But we've also put money away for CVA agreements too.

[Speaker 2] (3:12:21 - 3:12:21)
So

[Speaker 1] (3:12:21 - 3:12:21)
So,

[Speaker 2] (3:12:21 - 3:12:22)
we

[Speaker 3] (3:12:22 - 3:12:24)
Yeah, there's money in the salary reserve, but okay.

[Speaker 2] (3:12:24 - 3:12:25)
have a salary reserve.

[Speaker 2] (3:12:25 - 3:12:29)
The contract is subject to the negotiation,

[Speaker 2] (3:12:29 - 3:12:33)
and it may or may not fall within the reserve that we currently have.

[Speaker 2] (3:12:33 - 3:12:37)
That is, we're not at a settled position to be able to say

[Speaker 3] (3:12:37 - 3:12:37)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 6] (3:12:37 - 3:12:38)
Estimate.

[Speaker 3] (3:12:38 - 3:12:39)
That's estimating.

[Speaker 2] (3:12:39 - 3:12:41)
finally that the salary reserves will cover it.

[Speaker 5] (3:12:44 - 3:12:45)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (3:12:45 - 3:12:45)
Okay,

[Speaker 3] (3:12:46 - 3:12:46)
is there...

[Speaker 4] (3:12:46 - 3:12:48)
I don't see how we can, I don't see how we can.

[Speaker 4] (3:12:51 - 3:12:53)
I don't see how we can put anything towards it, but

[Speaker 3] (3:12:54 - 3:12:55)
Towards what, sorry? Be specific.

[Speaker 4] (3:12:56 - 3:12:58)
I don't see how we can put any money towards it.

[Speaker 4] (3:12:58 - 3:12:58)
So there's

[Speaker 3] (3:12:58 - 3:12:58)
Towards what?

[Speaker 5] (3:12:58 - 3:12:58)
It's

[Speaker 4] (3:12:58 - 3:12:59)
a, it's

[Speaker 2] (3:12:59 - 3:12:59)
I don't

[Speaker 4] (3:12:59 - 3:12:59)
a

[Speaker 5] (3:12:59 - 3:12:59)
tax

[Speaker 4] (3:12:59 - 3:12:59)
a towards

[Speaker 3] (3:12:59 - 3:12:59)
Reducer

[Speaker 4] (3:12:59 - 3:12:59)
the

[Speaker 2] (3:12:59 - 3:12:59)
idea.

[Speaker 4] (3:12:59 - 3:13:00)
if I down.

[Speaker 3] (3:13:00 - 3:13:01)
tax buy down of reducing the tax.

[Speaker 4] (3:13:01 - 3:13:02)
Right, what we're talking about.

[Speaker 3] (3:13:02 - 3:13:03)
Yeah, okay, sorry.

[Speaker 4] (3:13:03 - 3:13:03)
But

[Speaker 5] (3:13:03 - 3:13:03)
It's

[Speaker 4] (3:13:03 - 3:13:04)
we were t

[Speaker 5] (3:13:04 - 3:13:05)
too many unknowns.

[Speaker 4] (3:13:09 - 3:13:09)
Uh

[Speaker 1] (3:13:09 - 3:13:11)
Can we um, okay,

[Speaker 4] (3:13:11 - 3:13:14)
There's a there's a way I um I just don't know how to figure it out.

[Speaker 3] (3:13:16 - 3:13:17)
Doug, what were you gonna say?

[Speaker 1] (3:13:18 - 3:13:22)
I guess what I was going to say is I'm surprised to hear Mary Ellen say that.

[Speaker 1] (3:13:22 - 3:13:27)
But beyond that,

[Speaker 1] (3:13:28 - 3:13:33)
I don't really understand. Maybe I missed a meeting or something,

[Speaker 1] (3:13:33 - 3:13:39)
but I don't see how we can not put money towards it in this environment.

[Speaker 5] (3:13:40 - 3:13:41)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (3:13:41 - 3:13:42)
I'm good with that.

[Speaker 5] (3:13:42 - 3:13:45)
I'd like to have I'd like fincom to opine prior

[Speaker 3] (3:13:45 - 3:13:46)
There you go.

[Speaker 4] (3:13:46 - 3:13:46)
Yeah.

[Speaker 4] (3:13:47 - 3:13:47)
And

[Speaker 5] (3:13:47 - 3:13:47)
to you

[Speaker 4] (3:13:47 - 3:13:48)
I'm really good with that.

[Speaker 5] (3:13:49 - 3:13:50)
okay

[Speaker 2] (3:13:50 - 3:13:53)
Okay. So they're meeting tomorrow Patrick

[Speaker 3] (3:13:53 - 3:13:53)
Great.

[Speaker 2] (3:13:53 - 3:14:02)
and I are both there in addition to that are there items or pieces of information that you would like us to try to prepare for you in addition to whatever their opinion is

[Speaker 2] (3:14:03 - 3:14:05)
To bring to you on December 1st.

[Speaker 4] (3:14:05 - 3:14:12)
I think it's got to be, what is it going to look like. We have to have a scale of, you know, if we put six hundred thousand towards it, eight hundred thousand towards it,

[Speaker 2] (3:14:12 - 3:14:12)
Okay.

[Speaker 5] (3:14:12 - 3:14:12)
Yep.

[Speaker 4] (3:14:12 - 3:14:20)
a million towards it, what does it what does it actually look like, what's the impact going to be on free cash. I think you should also draw out what free cash is going to possibly look like

[Speaker 5] (3:14:21 - 3:14:21)
Okay.

[Speaker 6] (3:14:21 - 3:14:21)
Like

[Speaker 4] (3:14:21 - 3:14:22)
over the next

[Speaker 6] (3:14:22 - 3:14:22)
an actual

[Speaker 4] (3:14:22 - 3:14:24)
three years, what your projections are looking like.

[Speaker 6] (3:14:25 - 3:14:28)
That gets a little tricky, but I will see what I can do.

[Speaker 2] (3:14:28 - 3:14:30)
That, I will caution is

[Speaker 2] (3:14:31 - 3:14:32)
Way more art than science.

[Speaker 5] (3:14:32 - 3:14:34)
Can we can we do can we one year yes,

[Speaker 3] (3:14:34 - 3:14:36)
Well, at least we have $400,000 coming to us, right?

[Speaker 5] (3:14:37 - 3:14:39)
yes

[Speaker 3] (3:14:39 - 3:14:40)
Let's start with a joke, Patrick.

[Speaker 4] (3:14:40 - 3:14:41)
Right.

[Speaker 1] (3:14:42 - 3:14:55)
Well, I think the other piece is, you know, I know some of this is sensitive, but like what is the pretty well-known other needs for free cash?

[Speaker 3] (3:14:59 - 3:14:59)
This year?

[Speaker 1] (3:15:01 - 3:15:07)
Yeah, in the near term, with the million that we now see,

[Speaker 1] (3:15:07 - 3:15:08)
million four,

[Speaker 1] (3:15:08 - 3:15:09)
if you count the 400,000,

[Speaker 1] (3:15:09 - 3:15:10)
what are the...

[Speaker 3] (3:15:14 - 3:15:17)
I think Patrick said you can't count it until fiscal year 2015.

[Speaker 2] (3:15:17 - 3:15:18)
We don't have access to

[Speaker 3] (3:15:18 - 3:15:18)
We

[Speaker 2] (3:15:18 - 3:15:18)
it

[Speaker 3] (3:15:18 - 3:15:18)
don't

[Speaker 2] (3:15:18 - 3:15:18)
until

[Speaker 3] (3:15:18 - 3:15:18)
have access

[Speaker 2] (3:15:18 - 3:15:18)
next

[Speaker 3] (3:15:18 - 3:15:18)
to

[Speaker 2] (3:15:18 - 3:15:18)
year.

[Speaker 3] (3:15:18 - 3:15:20)
it, so we No. can't spend it.

[Speaker 4] (3:15:20 - 3:15:20)
No.

[Speaker 6] (3:15:20 - 3:15:31)
Right, I think if we were gonna itemize a list of things we need this year, that would be, you know, the things on this warrant alone, articles four and five, if they pass, that's 121 thousand dollars from free cash.

[Speaker 6] (3:15:32 - 3:15:37)
And collective bargaining is a big question mark, nothing is settled right

[Speaker 3] (3:15:37 - 3:15:38)
Yep.

[Speaker 6] (3:15:38 - 3:15:38)
now. We could

[Speaker 6] (3:15:39 - 3:15:53)
you know, prognosticate Mm. on that, um maybe come back with something and yeah, it's really hard to predict, you know, what what needs would pop up, but the I guess those are our knowns right now.

[Speaker 2] (3:15:53 - 3:16:01)
And Doug, may may be useful for us to just look back at the things that were truly unanticipated so that we can give you some sense of that.

[Speaker 2] (3:16:03 - 3:16:07)
Um you know just a quick historic look back.

[Speaker 3] (3:16:08 - 3:16:08)
Okay.

[Speaker 3] (3:16:10 - 3:16:12)
Alright, so I think we are moving on.

[Speaker 2] (3:16:12 - 3:16:13)
Set that aside and we'll

[Speaker 3] (3:16:13 - 3:16:13)
Please.

[Speaker 2] (3:16:13 - 3:16:24)
come back. Okay, that was seven. Eight is um the project at uh the library for the side entrance.

[Speaker 2] (3:16:25 - 3:16:30)
Uh Jonathan heard today that we will not have an answer until December fifth.

[Speaker 3] (3:16:30 - 3:16:31)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (3:16:31 - 3:16:31)
Oh.

[Speaker 2] (3:16:31 - 3:16:38)
He is well aware and it has been communicated that this is a project that will only move forward if that grant is awarded,

[Speaker 3] (3:16:38 - 3:16:38)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 2] (3:16:38 - 3:16:42)
otherwise it will stay in the pile along with all the other capital requests that we have.

[Speaker 3] (3:16:42 - 3:16:42)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (3:16:43 - 3:16:58)
And just again by way of background so everyone's on the same page, the only reason we're coming with this is because that the opportunity for that money plus it would be a a single mobilisation, um very likely when come springtime when construction starts back up on the front entrance.

[Speaker 2] (3:16:58 - 3:17:00)
To be able to do it all together at a s

[Speaker 2] (3:17:01 - 3:17:03)
the most economical way possible, I'll say.

[Speaker 3] (3:17:03 - 3:17:03)
Yep.

[Speaker 2] (3:17:03 - 3:17:05)
I won't promise that it's cheaper, but the

[Speaker 5] (3:17:05 - 3:17:05)
most Yeah.

[Speaker 2] (3:17:05 - 3:17:06)
economical

[Speaker 5] (3:17:06 - 3:17:06)
No.

[Speaker 2] (3:17:06 - 3:17:06)
way that we can.

[Speaker 5] (3:17:06 - 3:17:10)
So with that caveat, I'd I'd I'd make a motion to support Article eight.

[Speaker 4] (3:17:11 - 3:17:11)
Second.

[Speaker 3] (3:17:13 - 3:17:14)
Um Doug?

[Speaker 2] (3:17:17 - 3:17:17)
You're muted.

[Speaker 3] (3:17:17 - 3:17:22)
You gave us a thumbs oh you have to say the word sorry. I don't wanna get in trouble. Um Marian.

[Speaker 4] (3:17:22 - 3:17:25)
I just have a quick question. Does this have to say

[Speaker 4] (3:17:26 - 3:17:29)
Does this say in here does the language have to say

[Speaker 4] (3:17:30 - 3:17:31)
Uh

[Speaker 3] (3:17:31 - 3:17:32)
It says in the comment,

[Speaker 3] (3:17:32 - 3:17:34)
the grant has not yet been uh sent.

[Speaker 4] (3:17:34 - 3:17:36)
But does the article itself have to say that

[Speaker 2] (3:17:38 - 3:17:42)
I can ask that tomorrow if you all would like to wait on this one as well, because we'll be with

[Speaker 4] (3:17:42 - 3:17:42)
Because

[Speaker 2] (3:17:42 - 3:17:43)
town council and

[Speaker 4] (3:17:43 - 3:17:43)
if

[Speaker 2] (3:17:43 - 3:17:44)
the moderator.

[Speaker 4] (3:17:44 - 3:17:49)
we pass this this this goes through it doesn't I mean doesn't it has to go through what the article says if

[Speaker 4] (3:17:52 - 3:17:53)
you could find that out

[Speaker 3] (3:17:53 - 3:17:53)
Thanks

[Speaker 4] (3:17:53 - 3:17:53)
I'd

[Speaker 2] (3:17:53 - 3:17:54)
for tomorrow.

[Speaker 3] (3:17:56 - 3:17:56)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (3:17:56 - 3:18:04)
Is the sense of the board that it, I'm just trying to plan for time on the first now. This is one that assuming we word it and everything's on board,

[Speaker 3] (3:18:04 - 3:18:04)
Straw poll,

[Speaker 2] (3:18:04 - 3:18:05)
we

[Speaker 3] (3:18:05 - 3:18:05)
yeah.

[Speaker 4] (3:18:05 - 3:18:05)
Is

[Speaker 2] (3:18:05 - 3:18:05)
can

[Speaker 4] (3:18:05 - 3:18:05)
anyone

[Speaker 2] (3:18:05 - 3:18:05)
move

[Speaker 4] (3:18:05 - 3:18:06)
here

[Speaker 2] (3:18:06 - 3:18:06)
very quickly,

[Speaker 4] (3:18:06 - 3:18:06)
support now?

[Speaker 2] (3:18:06 - 3:18:07)
whereas there might be some other discussion

[Speaker 4] (3:18:07 - 3:18:08)
Yeah.

[Speaker 2] (3:18:08 - 3:18:09)
on other topics. I just want to get

[Speaker 3] (3:18:09 - 3:18:09)
Yeah,

[Speaker 2] (3:18:09 - 3:18:09)
this thing

[Speaker 3] (3:18:09 - 3:18:09)
I

[Speaker 2] (3:18:09 - 3:18:10)
all think set enough time.

[Speaker 3] (3:18:10 - 3:18:11)
is that fair to say, Doug?

[Speaker 4] (3:18:11 - 3:18:12)
Yep.

[Speaker 3] (3:18:12 - 3:18:16)
It's generally supportive if so long as it reflects what we just discussed.

[Speaker 1] (3:18:18 - 3:18:20)
I'm sorry, but I didn't catch the last part of what you said.

[Speaker 3] (3:18:20 - 3:18:24)
I said we're just taking a straw poll to let Nick know we're generally supportive.

[Speaker 2] (3:18:26 - 3:18:28)
bearing in mind that there may be a amendment,

[Speaker 3] (3:18:28 - 3:18:28)
Finalize

[Speaker 2] (3:18:28 - 3:18:28)
finalizing

[Speaker 3] (3:18:28 - 3:18:29)
the language.

[Speaker 2] (3:18:29 - 3:18:38)
the language to make sure that it states exactly that it is only going forward if the grant opportunity is awarded.

[Speaker 1] (3:18:39 - 3:18:43)
okay, because we won't know before our term meeting so okay,

[Speaker 2] (3:18:43 - 3:18:44)
Correct.

[Speaker 1] (3:18:44 - 3:18:44)
yep,

[Speaker 2] (3:18:44 - 3:18:44)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (3:18:44 - 3:18:45)
thank you

[Speaker 2] (3:18:45 - 3:18:47)
All right, the park grant for Abbott Park.

[Speaker 4] (3:18:48 - 3:18:52)
Our grant, it's a, we already received this grant. This is the town match.

[Speaker 4] (3:18:52 - 3:18:56)
This is a project that I believe is in its final phase of

[Speaker 2] (3:18:56 - 3:18:56)
Right?

[Speaker 4] (3:18:56 - 3:18:58)
a multi-phase effort.

[Speaker 2] (3:18:59 - 3:19:01)
Motion to approve Article 9.

[Speaker 4] (3:19:01 - 3:19:02)
Second.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:02 - 3:19:03)
Favorable action.

[Speaker 5] (3:19:04 - 3:19:04)
Bye.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:04 - 3:19:05)
It's fine.

[Speaker 5] (3:19:05 - 3:19:05)
Bye.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:05 - 3:19:07)
Mary Ellen's an aye. Doug?

[Speaker 1] (3:19:08 - 3:19:08)
Aye.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:08 - 3:19:09)
Daniels?

[Speaker 2] (3:19:10 - 3:19:11)
Aye, nay.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:11 - 3:19:12)
Yep.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:12 - 3:19:12)
David?

[Speaker 5] (3:19:12 - 3:19:13)
Aye.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:13 - 3:19:14)
Aye, I'm an aye. Okay,

[Speaker 2] (3:19:14 - 3:19:14)
five-o.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:15 - 3:19:18)
Okay, great. Moving on to ten then, the last one.

[Speaker 4] (3:19:18 - 3:19:22)
Article ten, as drafted, just for everyone's understanding,

[Speaker 4] (3:19:23 - 3:19:34)
was with the idea that there may be personal property that we were trying to come to some agreement uh with the tenant that's vacating that they have completed their auction, so that is not an no longer an issue.

[Speaker 4] (3:19:35 - 3:19:42)
Um so, you know, it it is slightly more expansive than it had been in the past, and I know that's something that

[Speaker 2] (3:19:43 - 3:19:43)
Yeah,

[Speaker 4] (3:19:43 - 3:19:43)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:43 - 3:19:51)
I have, I mean, we all got an email this morning from prior Select Board member Neil Duffy who had questioned, you know, why the language was what it was.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:52 - 3:19:58)
The reasoning being obviously we were making space for that personal property sort of question mark, but now we have an answer.

[Speaker 2] (3:19:58 - 3:20:01)
So maybe we can alter the language back to the original authorization.

[Speaker 4] (3:20:01 - 3:20:02)
Right.

[Speaker 4] (3:20:02 - 3:20:06)
So this is one I've already talked to Tom McEnany about to finalize again tomorrow.

[Speaker 2] (3:20:06 - 3:20:06)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (3:20:06 - 3:20:09)
I also, I called Neil to ask to make sure that what.

[Speaker 4] (3:20:09 - 3:20:21)
I was anticipating working through tomorrow matches. I think the there were two concerns. One, uh it was sort of more expensive um but also the language here, cert I think it says any use.

[Speaker 4] (3:20:21 - 3:20:27)
And any use was intended to give us the latitude to be able to do the personal property.

[Speaker 2] (3:20:27 - 3:20:27)
Personal property,

[Speaker 2] (3:20:27 - 3:20:27)
yeah.

[Speaker 4] (3:20:27 - 3:20:33)
So one of the things that was suggested in the course of that conversation was to go back to the language before,

[Speaker 4] (3:20:33 - 3:20:34)
which was, I believe,

[Speaker 4] (3:20:34 - 3:20:35)
restaurant hospitality or restaurant.

[Speaker 4] (3:20:36 - 3:20:44)
It's basically matching the restaurant language that was used previously in authorizations was the thrust of what that email was.

[Speaker 6] (3:20:44 - 3:21:10)
So so can I mean can we also talk about the like the the duration like the the period shall not extend beyond December 31 of 28, you know, the original intent when we purchased the Hawthorne was to really keep you know a tight leash on the select board uh the town from you know from really from really going you know and doing things you know

[Speaker 6] (3:21:13 - 3:21:35)
in a manner that that was just more long term than what was than what would be what the original intent was so I mean I kind of like how we had done this in 22 where we said all right we'll do this through the end of 23 and then we extended throughout always seeking town meeting approval I'm just I just have concerns

[Speaker 6] (3:21:36 - 3:21:40)
And, you know, Brian Watson, you know, spoke to those earlier,

[Speaker 6] (3:21:40 - 3:21:44)
so I don't need to really go into those in great detail. But, you know,

[Speaker 6] (3:21:44 - 3:21:52)
I really think that the lease should be much, much shorter on this. Just me.

[Speaker 6] (3:21:53 - 3:21:53)
This

[Speaker 1] (3:21:53 - 3:21:53)
Yeah,

[Speaker 6] (3:21:53 - 3:21:53)
is good.

[Speaker 1] (3:21:53 - 3:21:54)
David,

[Speaker 1] (3:21:54 - 3:22:02)
I'm not sure if you were part of the conversation that we had about this that might have been the meeting they weren't here recently,

[Speaker 1] (3:22:02 - 3:22:06)
but we had an extended conversation about this and it was.

[Speaker 1] (3:22:07 - 3:22:08)
You know, there's a lot of uncertainty,

[Speaker 1] (3:22:09 - 3:22:09)
right?

[Speaker 1] (3:22:09 - 3:22:11)
And we want to make sure that if someone's going to come in temporarily,

[Speaker 1] (3:22:12 - 3:22:14)
that they feel like they have enough time.

[Speaker 1] (3:22:14 - 3:22:20)
You know, I think the conversation started at 18 months and then it went to two years and it went to three years and it was always up to,

[Speaker 1] (3:22:20 - 3:22:31)
you know, this is the warrant language to give us the flexibility doesn't mean we necessarily will enter into a lease that's three years.

[Speaker 1] (3:22:31 - 3:22:41)
But at least we have the authorization to do it that may still not satisfy what you're concerned about But that was that was the thinking if someone's going to come in and do something quote temporarily

[Speaker 1] (3:22:42 - 3:22:45)
How much time do they need to make it worth it?

[Speaker 6] (3:22:45 - 3:22:50)
Yeah, I mean, and just from a financial and a feasibility perspective and from a banking perspective,

[Speaker 6] (3:22:50 - 3:22:52)
three years isn't feasible.

[Speaker 6] (3:22:52 - 3:22:54)
Five years likely isn't feasible.

[Speaker 6] (3:22:55 - 3:23:11)
You know, if you're talking a building of this size with the deferred maintenance and capital requirements that would be necessary to bring in, you know, a restaurateur of a certain level,

[Speaker 6] (3:23:12 - 3:23:22)
you're talking a 10-year term at a minimum. And what this does is this opens the door.

[Speaker 6] (3:23:24 - 3:23:29)
And the power of inertia is certainly is pretty powerful.

[Speaker 6] (3:23:29 - 3:23:33)
You know, had Hawthorne said we're, you know, we want another year,

[Speaker 6] (3:23:33 - 3:23:35)
I think this is a different conversation.

[Speaker 6] (3:23:35 - 3:23:44)
But I think this is going to be resoundingly defeated at town meeting if it's presented as such.

[Speaker 6] (3:23:46 - 3:23:55)
So I don't want to have a I don't want to have a vacant building But I don't also don't want to have something that is that is you know That is that has a three-year as a three-year lease.

[Speaker 6] (3:23:55 - 3:23:55)
I just

[Speaker 6] (3:23:56 - 3:24:09)
I I think we need to think um outside of the box as to how we can uh how we can accomplish this. So Mr Patsios's idea for an R_F_I_ may be you know may be something that is that is that is interesting.

[Speaker 2] (3:24:09 - 3:24:09)
Yeah.

[Speaker 6] (3:24:09 - 3:24:22)
Um so we can solicit some m some opportunities, but uh I would I would really make sure that we're that we're informing and taking this into uh into town meeting, each step of the way is just my personal feeling.

[Speaker 2] (3:24:22 - 3:24:22)
Yeah.

[Speaker 2] (3:24:22 - 3:24:26)
I think even if you, so if you play out the timeline,

[Speaker 2] (3:24:27 - 3:24:37)
I also am intrigued by the idea of an RFI, but if an RFI turns into an RFP, you're talking about like six months before we're even getting a lease maybe going.

[Speaker 2] (3:24:37 - 3:24:39)
So now, you know,

[Speaker 2] (3:24:39 - 3:24:45)
you're talking about just over two years of lease hold until you're up to that backstop anyways,

[Speaker 2] (3:24:45 - 3:24:45)
right?

[Speaker 2] (3:24:45 - 3:24:48)
So I think that's why,

[Speaker 2] (3:24:48 - 3:24:51)
you know, we're trying to figure out what that sweet spot is that gets us.

[Speaker 2] (3:24:52 - 3:24:57)
Still moving forward with discussion and long-term strategy,

[Speaker 2] (3:24:57 - 3:25:03)
not cutting off our nose to spider face from a respondents right proposition,

[Speaker 2] (3:25:03 - 3:25:05)
but then also not.

[Speaker 2] (3:25:05 - 3:25:26)
Giving too long of a leash so that town meeting like it's almost near impossible to figure out what that sweet spot is so I hear what you're saying but I just think if we are going to RFI or RFQ and then turning into RFP like the timing of that is really more like six to nine months before that building is occupied again and so then you're looking at a basically a two-year lease.

[Speaker 6] (3:25:27 - 3:25:29)
No, I certainly hear you.

[Speaker 6] (3:25:29 - 3:25:33)
And, you know, just it's my concern that the town is going to continue,

[Speaker 6] (3:25:34 - 3:25:38)
you know, when this was contemplated for a special meeting,

[Speaker 6] (3:25:38 - 3:25:40)
special town meeting vote in June of 22,

[Speaker 6] (3:25:41 - 3:25:43)
you know, really it was, all right,

[Speaker 6] (3:25:43 - 3:25:47)
the restaurant's going to continue to operate until it doesn't operate,

[Speaker 6] (3:25:47 - 3:25:53)
at which point the town would then demolish the property because of the costs of.

[Speaker 6] (3:25:53 - 3:26:11)
ensuring uh the property and to to really make sure that there were no there were there were not going to be any uh any capital uh expenditures that the town was going to have to take on. You know if if we're going to R_F_P_ this out through the end of December thirty one of twenty eight, it's very likely

[Speaker 6] (3:26:12 - 3:26:18)
That the town is responsible for any of the systems that break in this in this building not to mention

[Speaker 7] (3:26:18 - 3:26:18)
No.

[Speaker 6] (3:26:19 - 3:26:20)
Not to mention insurance.

[Speaker 6] (3:26:20 - 3:26:21)
What do you mean no?

[Speaker 7] (3:26:21 - 3:26:25)
We can we can write an R_F_P_ and just say that we you know we

[Speaker 6] (3:26:25 - 3:26:25)
I mean I

[Speaker 7] (3:26:25 - 3:26:26)
won't

[Speaker 6] (3:26:26 - 3:26:26)
I can

[Speaker 7] (3:26:26 - 3:26:26)
take

[Speaker 6] (3:26:26 - 3:26:33)
I can write an R_F_P_ and wish for a million dollars too. But just the likelihood of that happening is just it's just not realistic

[Speaker 6] (3:26:34 - 3:26:39)
Mary Ellen. I mean we can we can want that to happen. So I I but I think we need to look at

[Speaker 6] (3:26:39 - 3:26:42)
you know, other uses that may not be restaurants,

[Speaker 6] (3:26:43 - 3:26:45)
that may be town uses,

[Speaker 6] (3:26:45 - 3:26:48)
but again, we're still going to have these,

[Speaker 6] (3:26:48 - 3:26:50)
we're still going to have the same issues with insurance,

[Speaker 6] (3:26:51 - 3:26:59)
we're still going to have the same issues with capital expenditures and things that are going to pop up on a building that has considerable deferred maintenance.

[Speaker 2] (3:27:00 - 3:27:00)
Well,

[Speaker 6] (3:27:00 - 3:27:00)
So

[Speaker 2] (3:27:00 - 3:27:00)
if we're

[Speaker 6] (3:27:00 - 3:27:00)
that's

[Speaker 2] (3:27:00 - 3:27:00)
thinking,

[Speaker 6] (3:27:00 - 3:27:01)
my concern.

[Speaker 2] (3:27:01 - 3:27:02)
go ahead,

[Speaker 2] (3:27:02 - 3:27:02)
Doug.

[Speaker 1] (3:27:03 - 3:27:09)
Well, I was just trying to kind of, you know, think about the kind of logic here.

[Speaker 1] (3:27:09 - 3:27:12)
Like, you know, David, you know,

[Speaker 1] (3:27:12 - 3:27:18)
I trust your sense of, you know, what the commercial real estate market is.

[Speaker 1] (3:27:18 - 3:27:24)
And if it's very unlikely that someone's going to, you know.

[Speaker 1] (3:27:25 - 3:27:31)
be involved in this I mean we already did have someone earlier tonight seemed really interested I don't know but so

[Speaker 6] (3:27:31 - 3:27:34)
He's not a commercial real estate guy.

[Speaker 1] (3:27:34 - 3:27:48)
okay okay all right I don't know I don't sound like he was a restaurateur I don't know but so I guess I guess we'll see in a way right I mean the idea is we don't want to extend this

[Speaker 1] (3:27:49 - 3:28:13)
forever obviously in terms of a temporary situation we need to come to a you know a final conclusion about exactly how we want to proceed with the Hawthorne property in general we have this kind of still in this interim state that none of us are excited about but I think we're getting there towards the final conclusion if we have this authority

[Speaker 1] (3:28:14 - 3:28:19)
Again, we can test the market, see whether or not for whatever reason and what terms

[Speaker 1] (3:28:23 - 3:28:32)
If that doesn't work out, then we can, you know, the fallback will be to think about, you know, more recreation space or, you know, whatever it's going to be in the short run.

[Speaker 1] (3:28:35 - 3:28:36)
And,

[Speaker 1] (3:28:36 - 3:28:38)
you know, moving on, maybe simultaneously,

[Speaker 1] (3:28:38 - 3:28:42)
you know, we do need to take into consideration, I do think, you know, what Charlie said is interesting,

[Speaker 1] (3:28:43 - 3:28:48)
you know, how we play that out in terms of different options.

[Speaker 1] (3:28:49 - 3:28:54)
But I do see this as kind of just increasing our optionality at the moment.

[Speaker 1] (3:28:55 - 3:28:56)
Not going way too long,

[Speaker 1] (3:28:56 - 3:29:03)
but at least giving it some chance of someone being interested and investing enough to make it worthwhile for,

[Speaker 1] (3:29:03 - 3:29:05)
you know, a year or two.

[Speaker 2] (3:29:07 - 3:29:07)
And

[Speaker 1] (3:29:07 - 3:29:08)
Yeah, we'll see.

[Speaker 1] (3:29:08 - 3:29:09)
We'll see if anyone answers.

[Speaker 2] (3:29:10 - 3:29:16)
Nick, when in the capital budget was the demolition slated?

[Speaker 1] (3:29:17 - 3:29:17)
Twenty seven

[Speaker 3] (3:29:17 - 3:29:17)
Or

[Speaker 1] (3:29:17 - 3:29:18)
or twenty eight?

[Speaker 3] (3:29:18 - 3:29:19)
twenty eight.

[Speaker 2] (3:29:19 - 3:29:20)
Twenty eight.

[Speaker 1] (3:29:20 - 3:29:20)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (3:29:20 - 3:29:21)
Okay, so then

[Speaker 1] (3:29:21 - 3:29:22)
Sorry.

[Speaker 2] (3:29:22 - 3:29:24)
in theory, if we're taking what David said,

[Speaker 2] (3:29:24 - 3:29:24)
right,

[Speaker 2] (3:29:24 - 3:29:30)
and like the assumption is sort of like we thought the Hawthorne maybe might stay till 27,

[Speaker 2] (3:29:30 - 3:29:32)
maybe early 28,

[Speaker 2] (3:29:32 - 3:29:34)
and we would demolish in 28.

[Speaker 2] (3:29:34 - 3:29:34)
That's why,

[Speaker 2] (3:29:34 - 3:29:37)
I mean, I know it was like a hope or a guesstimate,

[Speaker 2] (3:29:37 - 3:29:42)
but it seems like we're not that far off by extending.

[Speaker 2] (3:29:42 - 3:29:43)
If the Hawthorne had stayed,

[Speaker 2] (3:29:43 - 3:29:47)
yes, we would have been in a different situation. We probably would be going year to year.

[Speaker 2] (3:29:48 - 3:29:49)
It's a different...

[Speaker 4] (3:29:49 - 3:29:50)
We're continuing the same,

[Speaker 4] (3:29:50 - 3:29:54)
what we had anticipated with potentially just a different vendor.

[Speaker 4] (3:29:54 - 3:29:55)
Right,

[Speaker 5] (3:29:55 - 3:29:55)
Right.

[Speaker 4] (3:29:55 - 3:29:58)
with a different leasee, so to speak.

[Speaker 4] (3:29:58 - 3:30:01)
Because if we thought Hawthorne was just going to stick around,

[Speaker 4] (3:30:01 - 3:30:04)
to your point, for another year and a half,

[Speaker 4] (3:30:04 - 3:30:06)
then we wouldn't even be having this conversation,

[Speaker 4] (3:30:06 - 3:30:08)
right? But because they decided to leave early,

[Speaker 4] (3:30:08 - 3:30:13)
it doesn't behoove us to sit there and look at an empty building for a year and a half,

[Speaker 4] (3:30:13 - 3:30:13)
right?

[Speaker 4] (3:30:13 - 3:30:18)
Why wouldn't we even give it a shot and see who is interested?

[Speaker 4] (3:30:18 - 3:30:19)
Maybe nobody is,

[Speaker 4] (3:30:19 - 3:30:20)
but we're not going to know that until we try.

[Speaker 4] (3:30:20 - 3:30:21)
cry.

[Speaker 2] (3:30:21 - 3:30:21)
Right.

[Speaker 4] (3:30:21 - 3:30:25)
We can't just assume that no decent respondents will happen.

[Speaker 4] (3:30:25 - 3:30:29)
Like, you know, that to me is just doing a disservice, right?

[Speaker 4] (3:30:29 - 3:30:31)
We're, we're saying absolutely not.

[Speaker 4] (3:30:31 - 3:30:35)
Nobody's out there, even though, you know, Mike Kelleher came up and said whatever,

[Speaker 4] (3:30:35 - 3:30:38)
and God knows how many people have contacted each one of us saying,

[Speaker 4] (3:30:38 - 3:30:40)
oh, I've got an idea for it, I've got an idea for it.

[Speaker 4] (3:30:41 - 3:30:42)
You know, so do we not?

[Speaker 4] (3:30:43 - 3:30:47)
Do we not give that it's due? Do we not give it a chance?

[Speaker 6] (3:30:47 - 3:30:57)
Go under understood and everyone that I have talked to in fairness everyone has has said this is an incredible space Mm. I would you know I would give my left arm

[Speaker 2] (3:30:57 - 3:30:57)
Right.

[Speaker 6] (3:30:57 - 3:31:10)
to uh to do something in this space but you know when the emotional part of your brain turns off and the logical part of your brain kicks up all of a sudden um you know you it does come down to finances and

[Speaker 4] (3:31:10 - 3:31:10)
Sure.

[Speaker 1] (3:31:10 - 3:31:10)
Uh-huh.

[Speaker 6] (3:31:10 - 3:31:30)
You know, so again, that's that's the that's the caveat with which I with with which I leave. Uh I I just want to have that that discussion because if if that if that was unsaid um and I did not have the chance to participate in that conversation last meeting, um I do want to convey that um at at this meeting.

[Speaker 6] (3:31:31 - 3:31:32)
So that's

[Speaker 6] (3:31:33 - 3:31:33)
That's it.

[Speaker 2] (3:31:33 - 3:31:33)
Yeah.

[Speaker 7] (3:31:33 - 3:31:37)
So would you feel better if the wording was two years instead

[Speaker 6] (3:31:37 - 3:31:38)
I'd feel,

[Speaker 7] (3:31:38 - 3:31:38)
of

[Speaker 6] (3:31:38 - 3:31:38)
I'd

[Speaker 7] (3:31:38 - 3:31:38)
the two years?

[Speaker 6] (3:31:38 - 3:31:40)
feel better, I'd feel better with a shorter duration,

[Speaker 6] (3:31:40 - 3:31:41)
Marianne, yes.

[Speaker 7] (3:31:41 - 3:31:41)
Right.

[Speaker 2] (3:31:42 - 3:31:42)
Right.

[Speaker 7] (3:31:42 - 3:31:45)
So my only worry is going,

[Speaker 7] (3:31:45 - 3:31:54)
I'm, you know, I could, my only worry would be going less than two years only because if I were a vendor coming in, I

[Speaker 2] (3:31:54 - 3:31:55)
Yeah,

[Speaker 7] (3:31:55 - 3:31:55)
would, I

[Speaker 2] (3:31:55 - 3:31:56)
I mean this.

[Speaker 7] (3:31:56 - 3:31:58)
would want to have, you know, a little bit more than a year.

[Speaker 7] (3:31:59 - 3:32:15)
Just to get my get myself a little bit more grounded and then that gives the select board time to vet out all the possibilities, look at all the scenarios, finish negotiating with the diocese.

[Speaker 4] (3:32:16 - 3:32:16)
And have

[Speaker 2] (3:32:16 - 3:32:16)
But

[Speaker 4] (3:32:16 - 3:32:17)
a better plan.

[Speaker 7] (3:32:17 - 3:32:18)
too, I mean, that's a whole nother component

[Speaker 2] (3:32:18 - 3:32:18)
Well,

[Speaker 7] (3:32:18 - 3:32:18)
to

[Speaker 2] (3:32:18 - 3:32:18)
that, yeah,

[Speaker 4] (3:32:18 - 3:32:20)
it. It's a major key to all of this.

[Speaker 7] (3:32:20 - 3:32:20)
Of course.

[Speaker 2] (3:32:20 - 3:32:25)
The piece of it, because that determines the space that you are really trying to plan for, whether

[Speaker 7] (3:32:25 - 3:32:26)
Right.

[Speaker 2] (3:32:26 - 3:32:26)
it's.

[Speaker 7] (3:32:26 - 3:32:27)
Right.

[Speaker 7] (3:32:27 - 3:32:29)
And it's like, you know, just because we put out something.

[Speaker 4] (3:32:30 - 3:32:59)
Depending on what kind of response we get doesn't necessarily mean we have if they're horrible proposals and whatnot it doesn't mean we have to do it but at least we're figuring we're putting it out there to see what we're going to get you know I mean it's the only way you're going to know other than that you're going to sit there and look at an empty building and people in this town are already banging at the door of what are we doing with this property it has been sitting there and we have done nothing right and we have given no clue as to what we're going to do and I think there's a real

[Speaker 7] (3:33:00 - 3:33:04)
you know, appetite of people are sick and tired of it and figure it out,

[Speaker 7] (3:33:04 - 3:33:04)
right?

[Speaker 2] (3:33:04 - 3:33:05)
Yeah, I think

[Speaker 2] (3:33:07 - 3:33:10)
To be a little bit fair to Brian and his team, there's definitely been stuff done.

[Speaker 6] (3:33:10 - 3:33:10)
Yeah.

[Speaker 6] (3:33:10 - 3:33:11)
Yeah,

[Speaker 2] (3:33:11 - 3:33:11)
I

[Speaker 6] (3:33:11 - 3:33:11)
there has.

[Speaker 2] (3:33:11 - 3:33:12)
know you,

[Speaker 6] (3:33:12 - 3:33:12)
A

[Speaker 2] (3:33:12 - 3:33:12)
that's

[Speaker 6] (3:33:12 - 3:33:12)
lot

[Speaker 2] (3:33:12 - 3:33:12)
not how of you meant

[Speaker 4] (3:33:12 - 3:33:12)
There's

[Speaker 2] (3:33:12 - 3:33:12)
it,

[Speaker 6] (3:33:12 - 3:33:13)
a lot

[Speaker 2] (3:33:13 - 3:33:13)
but

[Speaker 6] (3:33:13 - 3:33:13)
of stuff.

[Speaker 2] (3:33:13 - 3:33:14)
well, we what have not

[Speaker 4] (3:33:14 - 3:33:14)
is

[Speaker 2] (3:33:14 - 3:33:14)
expanded

[Speaker 4] (3:33:14 - 3:33:14)
what has happened,

[Speaker 2] (3:33:14 - 3:33:15)
that much

[Speaker 4] (3:33:15 - 3:33:15)
though?

[Speaker 2] (3:33:15 - 3:33:18)
forward in the plan. We have been part of, in the planning stage and we need to move towards

[Speaker 4] (3:33:18 - 3:33:18)
Right.

[Speaker 2] (3:33:18 - 3:33:18)
the execution,

[Speaker 4] (3:33:18 - 3:33:19)
But metaphorically,

[Speaker 2] (3:33:19 - 3:33:20)
but that's, yeah.

[Speaker 4] (3:33:20 - 3:33:21)
you know, we've been planning, right,

[Speaker 4] (3:33:22 - 3:33:22)
planning,

[Speaker 4] (3:33:22 - 3:33:22)
but

[Speaker 2] (3:33:22 - 3:33:23)
Right.

[Speaker 4] (3:33:23 - 3:33:28)
nothing has happened for people to visibly see any different than what has existed in the past,

[Speaker 2] (3:33:28 - 3:33:28)
Yeah.

[Speaker 4] (3:33:28 - 3:33:28)
right?

[Speaker 4] (3:33:28 - 3:33:31)
From when you made that vote in 2022 to buy it,

[Speaker 4] (3:33:31 - 3:33:34)
right? Nothing has visibly changed other than

[Speaker 4] (3:33:35 - 3:33:42)
you know, philosophical thinking or or us planning or you know conceptualizing, that's that's the reality, right?

[Speaker 2] (3:33:42 - 3:33:50)
Yep. David, would you do would you like to amend to a two-year term? Would you be supportive voting in favor of a two-year term?

[Speaker 6] (3:33:50 - 3:33:51)
I d I would, yeah.

[Speaker 2] (3:33:52 - 3:34:02)
Okay. I think in the in the uh to to reach a five oh vote, I think that is more important to me to show that the board is

[Speaker 2] (3:34:02 - 3:34:21)
you know all together in support of contemporary use like we've already had um so whether it's two years or three years like while three years I think it's better for an RFP respondent if that is what gets us to the point of showing that we are in unification over this idea going forward I think that's most important so yes

[Speaker 8] (3:34:21 - 3:34:23)
Can I ask a question before you vote on anything?

[Speaker 2] (3:34:23 - 3:34:24)
please do

[Speaker 8] (3:34:24 - 3:34:28)
So, again, this is something we're going to talk about tomorrow to refine the language to

[Speaker 8] (3:34:29 - 3:34:31)
narrow the time,

[Speaker 2] (3:34:31 - 3:34:31)
Mm.

[Speaker 8] (3:34:31 - 3:34:38)
but also do we want to limit to a one of you had mentioned whether or not limiting it restaurant was

[Speaker 8] (3:34:39 - 3:34:45)
appropriate. And that that was the idea was we were gonna match the language that had been used in the original authorization.

[Speaker 2] (3:34:45 - 3:34:46)
I The original

[Speaker 8] (3:34:46 - 3:34:46)
just wanna make

[Speaker 2] (3:34:46 - 3:34:46)
authorisation

[Speaker 8] (3:34:46 - 3:34:47)
sure that we're all

[Speaker 2] (3:34:47 - 3:34:48)
was like hospitality restaurant.

[Speaker 6] (3:34:50 - 3:34:52)
I don't think we should limit it. I

[Speaker 7] (3:34:52 - 3:34:52)
Right.

[Speaker 6] (3:34:52 - 3:34:52)
I

[Speaker 2] (3:34:52 - 3:34:53)
You think we should leave it unlimited, but

[Speaker 6] (3:34:53 - 3:34:53)
I think

[Speaker 2] (3:34:53 - 3:34:54)
make it two years.

[Speaker 6] (3:34:54 - 3:34:55)
yes.

[Speaker 7] (3:34:55 - 3:34:55)
Well,

[Speaker 4] (3:34:55 - 3:34:55)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 7] (3:34:55 - 3:34:56)
my worry is

[Speaker 7] (3:34:57 - 3:35:01)
God, if I'm a town meeting member, I don't I don't want to see housing in there.

[Speaker 7] (3:35:01 - 3:35:02)
I don't want to see

[Speaker 6] (3:35:02 - 3:35:03)
E he's

[Speaker 9] (3:35:03 - 3:35:03)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (3:35:03 - 3:35:03)
Yeah.

[Speaker 6] (3:35:03 - 3:35:04)
you're not gonna you're not gonna be using

[Speaker 4] (3:35:04 - 3:35:04)
Revenue

[Speaker 6] (3:35:04 - 3:35:05)
that.

[Speaker 4] (3:35:05 - 3:35:09)
producing. Could you say something along those lines? Right? I mean

[Speaker 2] (3:35:09 - 3:35:10)
We were right, we're like legal redesigning

[Speaker 4] (3:35:10 - 3:35:11)
revenue producing,

[Speaker 6] (3:35:11 - 3:35:11)
Yeah.

[Speaker 2] (3:35:11 - 3:35:11)
and we

[Speaker 4] (3:35:11 - 3:35:12)
I mean, I don't know,

[Speaker 6] (3:35:12 - 3:35:12)
I

[Speaker 4] (3:35:12 - 3:35:12)
right?

[Speaker 6] (3:35:12 - 3:35:14)
mean, I don't I don't think realistically

[Speaker 4] (3:35:14 - 3:35:14)
Could you somehow

[Speaker 6] (3:35:14 - 3:35:17)
you can have temp you can have temporary house. I I just

[Speaker 4] (3:35:18 - 3:35:25)
Could you somehow modify it that it specifies industry, right, versus an industry?

[Speaker 7] (3:35:25 - 3:35:26)
I don't know.

[Speaker 7] (3:35:27 - 3:35:27)
But to

[Speaker 8] (3:35:27 - 3:35:28)
It may be something

[Speaker 7] (3:35:28 - 3:35:28)
your

[Speaker 8] (3:35:28 - 3:35:31)
that point you we you can leave to the floor time meeting for people. I

[Speaker 7] (3:35:31 - 3:35:31)
Oh

[Speaker 8] (3:35:31 - 3:35:31)
I

[Speaker 2] (3:35:31 - 3:35:31)
No,

[Speaker 7] (3:35:31 - 3:35:32)
no, no no not. no no.

[Speaker 2] (3:35:32 - 3:35:33)
I believe you.

[Speaker 8] (3:35:33 - 3:35:34)
Mm-mm. That I let

[Speaker 2] (3:35:34 - 3:35:35)
Let's

[Speaker 7] (3:35:35 - 3:35:35)
Mm

[Speaker 2] (3:35:35 - 3:35:35)
have direction

[Speaker 8] (3:35:35 - 3:35:35)
No,

[Speaker 2] (3:35:35 - 3:35:35)
from

[Speaker 8] (3:35:35 - 3:35:35)
no I

[Speaker 2] (3:35:35 - 3:35:36)
us at least.

[Speaker 6] (3:35:36 - 3:35:37)
Let's do that for three nights.

[Speaker 2] (3:35:37 - 3:35:37)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 8] (3:35:37 - 3:35:39)
You all agreed very quickly,

[Speaker 8] (3:35:39 - 3:35:40)
which is great.

[Speaker 8] (3:35:41 - 3:35:48)
But you know, going if we don't limit it, then it's is it retail?

[Speaker 6] (3:35:49 - 3:35:49)
You

[Speaker 8] (3:35:49 - 3:35:50)
I don't

[Speaker 6] (3:35:50 - 3:35:50)
know, let me

[Speaker 8] (3:35:50 - 3:35:50)
mean, if retail,

[Speaker 6] (3:35:50 - 3:35:51)
tell you.

[Speaker 8] (3:35:51 - 3:35:51)
what you,

[Speaker 8] (3:35:51 - 3:35:55)
I just think that's the type of follow-up question that you would get from the floor is.

[Speaker 8] (3:35:57 - 3:36:04)
W what i if it's not going to be limited to a restaurant and that's a use that everyone has been comfortable with and comfortable with the town as the quote-unquote landlord of it.

[Speaker 2] (3:36:04 - 3:36:05)
It's not limited

[Speaker 6] (3:36:05 - 3:36:05)
Oh

[Speaker 2] (3:36:05 - 3:36:06)
prior actually.

[Speaker 8] (3:36:06 - 3:36:06)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (3:36:06 - 3:36:09)
Here's Article 13 and it says for

[Speaker 8] (3:36:09 - 3:36:11)
It's the continued use by

[Speaker 2] (3:36:11 - 3:36:22)
such purpose as the Select Board shall determine and on such terms and conditions the Select Board shall deem appropriate and to authorize the Select Board to enter all agreements and to take any action that may be necessary or convenient to accomplish the foregoing purposes.

[Speaker 2] (3:36:22 - 3:36:25)
says or take any action related thereto so it was

[Speaker 1] (3:36:25 - 3:36:25)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (3:36:25 - 3:36:28)
broad prior so I suggest we leave it

[Speaker 6] (3:36:28 - 3:36:29)
It's fine.

[Speaker 7] (3:36:29 - 3:36:29)
Okay.

[Speaker 2] (3:36:29 - 3:36:30)
will we just limit it to

[Speaker 6] (3:36:30 - 3:36:30)
We're just

[Speaker 2] (3:36:30 - 3:36:30)
its time

[Speaker 6] (3:36:30 - 3:36:31)
limiting

[Speaker 2] (3:36:31 - 3:36:31)
frame yep

[Speaker 6] (3:36:31 - 3:36:31)
the December

[Speaker 8] (3:36:31 - 3:36:31)
24th,

[Speaker 6] (3:36:31 - 3:36:32)
27th

[Speaker 8] (3:36:32 - 3:36:32)
December

[Speaker 6] (3:36:32 - 3:36:32)
to December 31st

[Speaker 8] (3:36:32 - 3:36:33)
27.

[Speaker 6] (3:36:33 - 3:36:34)
to 28th instead of 28.

[Speaker 2] (3:36:34 - 3:36:35)
yeah

[Speaker 6] (3:36:35 - 3:36:35)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (3:36:35 - 3:36:37)
All right. I'll just say,

[Speaker 1] (3:36:37 - 3:36:39)
I think consistent with what Katie was saying,

[Speaker 1] (3:36:39 - 3:36:41)
I personally don't think two years is the right,

[Speaker 1] (3:36:42 - 3:36:43)
I don't think it's long enough.

[Speaker 1] (3:36:44 - 3:36:47)
I understand the concerns about that,

[Speaker 1] (3:36:47 - 3:36:48)
but

[Speaker 1] (3:36:50 - 3:37:12)
I would vote for it, that's what we're going to go towards to be unanimous, but I'd rather have the warrant article give us three years. We can decide differently what we want to do in terms of the RFP, but once we're locked in with two years and someone says,

[Speaker 1] (3:37:12 - 3:37:13)
oh, that's not enough,

[Speaker 1] (3:37:13 - 3:37:14)
now we're stuck.

[Speaker 4] (3:37:14 - 3:37:14)
Yep.

[Speaker 2] (3:37:14 - 3:37:14)
Yep.

[Speaker 1] (3:37:16 - 3:37:19)
So, I just want to be, I mean theoretically,

[Speaker 1] (3:37:19 - 3:37:28)
you know, if we were that stuck we could have another special town meeting to like extend it on specific terms, but that is the potential downside of that.

[Speaker 2] (3:37:29 - 3:37:34)
Well, the prior article was extending the use.

[Speaker 2] (3:37:34 - 3:37:36)
It really didn't give...

[Speaker 8] (3:37:37 - 3:37:39)
So the use, and speaking to KP,

[Speaker 8] (3:37:39 - 3:37:42)
the use was the restaurant and it was a withheld.

[Speaker 8] (3:37:43 - 3:37:49)
right of the Athanas family in the deal to

[Speaker 2] (3:37:49 - 3:37:49)
Okay.

[Speaker 8] (3:37:49 - 3:37:54)
continue the use of the restaurant, which was why it was slightly different than doing an R_F_P_ that goes through a normal

[Speaker 2] (3:37:54 - 3:37:55)
Yep.

[Speaker 8] (3:37:55 - 3:37:55)
thirty B_

[Speaker 2] (3:37:56 - 3:37:56)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 8] (3:37:57 - 3:38:10)
um procurement process. So that was what they were talking about the difference was the other the flip side the not the flip side the other alternative is a licence but it's replicable on both sides, which is not it's even harder from a

[Speaker 8] (3:38:11 - 3:38:14)
banking or commercial standpoint to say after

[Speaker 2] (3:38:18 - 3:38:18)
Mm

[Speaker 1] (3:38:18 - 3:38:18)
or

[Speaker 3] (3:38:18 - 3:38:19)
Yeah,

[Speaker 2] (3:38:19 - 3:38:19)
-hmm.

[Speaker 3] (3:38:19 - 3:38:19)
okay.

[Speaker 1] (3:38:19 - 3:38:21)
that they could do that to us so

[Speaker 1] (3:38:22 - 3:38:36)
the the use was as a restaurant i think that's where i may be not representing it as cleanly as fairly as possible to you all like it was a restaurant it continued as a restaurant so it wasn't going to be petco you know like um

[Speaker 1] (3:38:36 - 3:38:37)
It was that,

[Speaker 1] (3:38:37 - 3:38:40)
I think that's, when we talk about limiting the use,

[Speaker 1] (3:38:40 - 3:38:42)
that's more what I'm getting

[Speaker 4] (3:38:42 - 3:38:42)
We also don't have to,

[Speaker 1] (3:38:42 - 3:38:43)
to.

[Speaker 4] (3:38:43 - 3:38:51)
we also can just table this for this evening and take a and pick this up at our at our next meeting so we can have some more information we can all

[Speaker 1] (3:38:51 - 3:38:52)
think Yeah.

[Speaker 4] (3:38:52 - 3:38:53)
about this a little more too.

[Speaker 5] (3:38:53 - 3:38:54)
Yeah, the only thing I worry about,

[Speaker 6] (3:38:54 - 3:38:54)
You

[Speaker 5] (3:38:54 - 3:38:54)
I

[Speaker 6] (3:38:54 - 3:38:54)
know

[Speaker 5] (3:38:54 - 3:38:54)
don't

[Speaker 6] (3:38:54 - 3:38:55)
how long it

[Speaker 5] (3:38:55 - 3:39:02)
disagree with you, but the only thing I worry about is how much time we have at that next meeting. So just being thoughtful of that because we're going to set the tax rate,

[Speaker 5] (3:39:02 - 3:39:02)
we're going to.

[Speaker 4] (3:39:03 - 3:39:03)
Uh,

[Speaker 5] (3:39:03 - 3:39:03)
answer

[Speaker 4] (3:39:03 - 3:39:03)
we

[Speaker 5] (3:39:03 - 3:39:07)
all the articles we haven't answered tonight and we're going to have a lengthy discussion about.

[Speaker 5] (3:39:08 - 3:39:09)
this article potentially.

[Speaker 7] (3:39:09 - 3:39:23)
You know, our goal is not to have a extended short-term situation. Our goal is to get this wrapped up as quickly as possible, but also to be reasonable bringing somebody in, bringing somebody in there.

[Speaker 7] (3:39:23 - 3:39:23)
So

[Speaker 4] (3:39:24 - 3:39:26)
And avoiding an a an avoiding an empty building for

[Speaker 7] (3:39:26 - 3:39:27)
That's our

[Speaker 5] (3:39:27 - 3:39:27)
Yeah, that is

[Speaker 1] (3:39:27 - 3:39:28)
That's

[Speaker 7] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
that

[Speaker 5] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
that

[Speaker 1] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
number

[Speaker 7] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
is

[Speaker 5] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
is

[Speaker 1] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
one.

[Speaker 5] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
the

[Speaker 8] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
the jingle,

[Speaker 5] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
main goal.

[Speaker 7] (3:39:28 - 3:39:28)
Yeah.

[Speaker 8] (3:39:28 - 3:39:29)
basically.

[Speaker 5] (3:39:29 - 3:39:30)
That is the main goal.

[Speaker 7] (3:39:30 - 3:39:30)
Right.

[Speaker 5] (3:39:30 - 3:39:31)
That's the main goal.

[Speaker 7] (3:39:31 - 3:39:35)
No, we don't and we're looking to see if there's some revenue that we can generate, right?

[Speaker 8] (3:39:35 - 3:39:35)
Right.

[Speaker 7] (3:39:35 - 3:39:36)
Let's not lose sight of what

[Speaker 9] (3:39:36 - 3:39:37)
of what we have

[Speaker 7] (3:39:37 - 3:39:37)
It's

[Speaker 9] (3:39:37 - 3:39:38)
been

[Speaker 7] (3:39:38 - 3:39:38)
a major

[Speaker 9] (3:39:38 - 3:39:38)
we've listened

[Speaker 7] (3:39:38 - 3:39:38)
point,

[Speaker 9] (3:39:38 - 3:39:39)
to all

[Speaker 7] (3:39:39 - 3:39:39)
you know.

[Speaker 9] (3:39:39 - 3:39:39)
night, right?

[Speaker 7] (3:39:39 - 3:39:40)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 9] (3:39:40 - 3:39:42)
Two point three million dollar deficit, like

[Speaker 7] (3:39:42 - 3:39:42)
Mm-hmm.

[Speaker 9] (3:39:42 - 3:39:49)
yeah, we all have ideas of what we'd love this to be, but let's let's talk about the reality we're in, right?

[Speaker 7] (3:39:49 - 3:39:50)
Right.

[Speaker 9] (3:39:50 - 3:39:53)
That's the goal of what we're trying to accomplish, even in the short term.

[Speaker 7] (3:39:53 - 3:40:01)
We're about to have the largest tax hike, you know, very long time. We are looking at serious times and

[Speaker 7] (3:40:03 - 3:40:05)
You know, we're doing the best we can here.

[Speaker 5] (3:40:06 - 3:40:07)
Brian, can you make it in under thirty

[Speaker 7] (3:40:07 - 3:40:08)
Oh,

[Speaker 5] (3:40:08 - 3:40:08)
seconds?

[Speaker 7] (3:40:08 - 3:40:08)
no.

[Speaker 10] (3:40:11 - 3:40:11)
Can I speak?

[Speaker 5] (3:40:12 - 3:40:13)
G yes, very quickly please.

[Speaker 1] (3:40:13 - 3:40:13)
Yeah.

[Speaker 10] (3:40:14 - 3:40:15)
I mean this do I need the mic?

[Speaker 4] (3:40:16 - 3:40:16)
Yeah.

[Speaker 5] (3:40:16 - 3:40:16)
Yep.

[Speaker 10] (3:40:16 - 3:40:29)
This this is a this is a super tough problem and it's a super important question. So there's a lot of moving parts. So to so what what I think is helpful for for everybody is

[Speaker 10] (3:40:30 - 3:40:34)
If to take each moving part one at a time and then,

[Speaker 10] (3:40:34 - 3:40:39)
because I understand the sort of difficulty of where the select board is,

[Speaker 10] (3:40:39 - 3:40:43)
it's you've got to take them one at a time so you can have clarity on each part.

[Speaker 10] (3:40:43 - 3:40:44)
For example,

[Speaker 10] (3:40:44 - 3:40:55)
just forget the other parts for the moment and just say the concern is revenue. I just heard people, the select board say the concern is revenue. So.

[Speaker 10] (3:40:56 - 3:41:02)
Will it cost the town more to let the building just be empty for six months,

[Speaker 10] (3:41:02 - 3:41:03)
four months or six months?

[Speaker 10] (3:41:03 - 3:41:04)
One, just compare.

[Speaker 10] (3:41:04 - 3:41:06)
It's empty for four or six months.

[Speaker 10] (3:41:06 - 3:41:15)
Or how much money will the town need to actually extend to this temporary operator?

[Speaker 10] (3:41:16 - 3:41:20)
I mean, somebody who's coming in for two years or three years can't...

[Speaker 10] (3:41:21 - 3:41:26)
spend a whole lot of money upgrading the restaurant. I mean just strictly revenue here.

[Speaker 4] (3:41:27 - 3:41:27)
Thank you, Spencer.

[Speaker 10] (3:41:27 - 3:41:37)
That's the reality. So I mean think about it. What restaurant guy is going to come in and do all that's involved to put a 22,000 square foot building in shape?

[Speaker 10] (3:41:38 - 3:41:40)
The second floor is not accessible by elevator.

[Speaker 10] (3:41:42 - 3:41:47)
It feels not connected to the way restaurant people will work.

[Speaker 10] (3:41:48 - 3:41:51)
I mean, somebody can't come in and put $2 million into the building.

[Speaker 10] (3:41:52 - 3:41:53)
You're going to say, here's a two-year lease?

[Speaker 10] (3:41:54 - 3:41:55)
And you think anybody,

[Speaker 10] (3:41:56 - 3:41:58)
anybody is going to put two million in?

[Speaker 5] (3:41:58 - 3:41:59)
Nobody's, nobody

[Speaker 9] (3:41:59 - 3:41:59)
We

[Speaker 5] (3:41:59 - 3:41:59)
has suggested

[Speaker 9] (3:41:59 - 3:42:00)
we're we're picking

[Speaker 5] (3:42:00 - 3:42:00)
uh number

[Speaker 9] (3:42:00 - 3:42:00)
that

[Speaker 10] (3:42:00 - 3:42:00)
No, but okay,

[Speaker 9] (3:42:00 - 3:42:01)
out of nowhere.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:01 - 3:42:01)
but revenue.

[Speaker 5] (3:42:01 - 3:42:02)
number

[Speaker 10] (3:42:02 - 3:42:02)
Well,

[Speaker 5] (3:42:02 - 3:42:02)
right.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:02 - 3:42:02)
we'll,

[Speaker 7] (3:42:02 - 3:42:02)
Why

[Speaker 10] (3:42:02 - 3:42:02)
the

[Speaker 7] (3:42:02 - 3:42:03)
are we talking

[Speaker 10] (3:42:03 - 3:42:03)
town

[Speaker 7] (3:42:03 - 3:42:03)
about revenue?

[Speaker 10] (3:42:03 - 3:42:03)
will be,

[Speaker 5] (3:42:03 - 3:42:04)
Guy or gal.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:04 - 3:42:05)
okay, so let me make

[Speaker 7] (3:42:05 - 3:42:05)
You

[Speaker 10] (3:42:05 - 3:42:05)
it clear.

[Speaker 7] (3:42:05 - 3:42:06)
need to focus on The the problem.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:06 - 3:42:10)
town, would you let, let me just speak for a minute. What are you afraid of? It's going to come up at town meeting.

[Speaker 9] (3:42:10 - 3:42:11)
After it's after two

[Speaker 10] (3:42:11 - 3:42:11)
You

[Speaker 9] (3:42:11 - 3:42:12)
o'clock.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:12 - 3:42:13)
can hear it now or you can hear it at town meeting.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:13 - 3:42:14)
I mean,

[Speaker 5] (3:42:14 - 3:42:14)
You

[Speaker 10] (3:42:14 - 3:42:14)
I'm

[Speaker 5] (3:42:14 - 3:42:15)
don't you don't

[Speaker 10] (3:42:15 - 3:42:15)
serious.

[Speaker 5] (3:42:15 - 3:42:16)
have to raise voices. We can stay

[Speaker 10] (3:42:16 - 3:42:17)
Okay,

[Speaker 5] (3:42:17 - 3:42:17)
calm

[Speaker 10] (3:42:17 - 3:42:17)
I'm sorry.

[Speaker 5] (3:42:17 - 3:42:18)
and still participate.

[Speaker 5] (3:42:19 - 3:42:19)
Please.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:19 - 3:42:22)
It needs a calm discussion,

[Speaker 10] (3:42:23 - 3:42:23)
right?

[Speaker 10] (3:42:23 - 3:42:23)
So what

[Speaker 5] (3:42:23 - 3:42:24)
Well, that's what I said.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:24 - 3:42:31)
are the economics of having some temporary person come in and set up a restaurant?

[Speaker 10] (3:42:32 - 3:42:35)
Whether it's two years or three years, it doesn't even matter whether it's two years or three.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:36 - 3:42:40)
What sort of money can that person spend to get that restaurant in business?

[Speaker 10] (3:42:41 - 3:42:45)
That person will have to spend money for plates, I mean for everything.

[Speaker 10] (3:42:46 - 3:42:47)
I've been in the building,

[Speaker 10] (3:42:47 - 3:42:48)
there's a lot of rehab,

[Speaker 10] (3:42:48 - 3:42:53)
so that person has to spend X amount of dollars. So how much more can he give the town?

[Speaker 10] (3:42:53 - 3:42:58)
He can't pay property taxes, he can't pay a big rent.

[Speaker 9] (3:42:58 - 3:43:02)
But you don't know that, right? You don't know any of that because you don't even know who it would be.

[Speaker 9] (3:43:02 - 3:43:03)
You have no

[Speaker 10] (3:43:03 - 3:43:03)
No,

[Speaker 9] (3:43:03 - 3:43:03)
idea.

[Speaker 10] (3:43:03 - 3:43:03)
no, I do

[Speaker 9] (3:43:03 - 3:43:04)
You're making

[Speaker 10] (3:43:04 - 3:43:04)
not.

[Speaker 9] (3:43:04 - 3:43:07)
assumptions and we can't do that. We can't afford to do that.

[Speaker 10] (3:43:07 - 3:43:13)
What I know is talk to restaurant people and ask them if it's realistic,

[Speaker 10] (3:43:13 - 3:43:19)
is there any restaurant operator that will come into a 22,000 square foot building and start a restaurant?

[Speaker 7] (3:43:20 - 3:43:20)
Okay.

[Speaker 10] (3:43:20 - 3:43:22)
And knowing he's leaving in two years, just

[Speaker 7] (3:43:22 - 3:43:22)
But

[Speaker 10] (3:43:22 - 3:43:22)
ask

[Speaker 7] (3:43:22 - 3:43:23)
maybe

[Speaker 10] (3:43:23 - 3:43:23)
the restaurant people.

[Speaker 7] (3:43:23 - 3:43:23)
we should do

[Speaker 10] (3:43:23 - 3:43:24)
Don't take

[Speaker 7] (3:43:24 - 3:43:24)
that.

[Speaker 10] (3:43:24 - 3:43:24)
my word for it.

[Speaker 5] (3:43:24 - 3:43:26)
I think the RFP will ask the market,

[Speaker 7] (3:43:26 - 3:43:27)
Exactly.

[Speaker 5] (3:43:27 - 3:43:27)
right?

[Speaker 5] (3:43:28 - 3:43:29)
Like that is the purpose of

[Speaker 10] (3:43:29 - 3:43:29)
I

[Speaker 5] (3:43:29 - 3:43:29)
an RFP.

[Speaker 10] (3:43:29 - 3:43:29)
think

[Speaker 5] (3:43:29 - 3:43:29)
Whether

[Speaker 10] (3:43:29 - 3:43:29)
what's...

[Speaker 5] (3:43:29 - 3:43:31)
we go out, hold on one second,

[Speaker 10] (3:43:31 - 3:43:31)
Yeah, I'm sorry.

[Speaker 5] (3:43:31 - 3:43:31)
one second.

[Speaker 10] (3:43:31 - 3:43:31)
Yeah.

[Speaker 5] (3:43:31 - 3:43:40)
Whether you go out for RFP regarding K1 or G1 and ask that question or will you go out and ask our question,

[Speaker 5] (3:43:40 - 3:43:43)
you're still giving space to let the market give the answer,

[Speaker 5] (3:43:43 - 3:43:43)
right?

[Speaker 5] (3:43:43 - 3:43:45)
That is the purpose of an RFP.

[Speaker 5] (3:43:47 - 3:43:50)
Where we said going back,

[Speaker 5] (3:43:50 - 3:43:56)
not to go too far back, but to say your RFP suppositions requires residential to work realistically.

[Speaker 10] (3:43:56 - 3:43:57)
But put mine aside.

[Speaker 5] (3:43:57 - 3:43:58)
Okay,

[Speaker 10] (3:43:58 - 3:43:58)
Put the

[Speaker 5] (3:43:58 - 3:43:58)
but wait,

[Speaker 10] (3:43:58 - 3:43:58)
committee aside.

[Speaker 5] (3:43:58 - 3:43:59)
let me,

[Speaker 5] (3:43:59 - 3:44:00)
Brian, just let me finish, please.

[Speaker 5] (3:44:01 - 3:44:06)
You're saying ours is a fool errand because it requires a $2 million investment.

[Speaker 5] (3:44:07 - 3:44:07)
Let

[Speaker 10] (3:44:07 - 3:44:07)
By the

[Speaker 5] (3:44:07 - 3:44:08)
somebody.

[Speaker 10] (3:44:08 - 3:44:09)
town. By the town.

[Speaker 5] (3:44:10 - 3:44:10)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (3:44:12 - 3:44:14)
Yeah, let's let's not go down this path. I I

[Speaker 5] (3:44:14 - 3:44:14)
Okay,

[Speaker 1] (3:44:14 - 3:44:14)
think,

[Speaker 7] (3:44:14 - 3:44:14)
no.

[Speaker 5] (3:44:14 - 3:44:15)
fine.

[Speaker 1] (3:44:15 - 3:44:16)
you know, if I can

[Speaker 10] (3:44:16 - 3:44:16)
No,

[Speaker 1] (3:44:16 - 3:44:16)
suggest

[Speaker 10] (3:44:16 - 3:44:16)
it isn't. Please.

[Speaker 1] (3:44:16 - 3:44:17)
um

[Speaker 4] (3:44:17 - 3:44:17)
Focus on the article.

[Speaker 10] (3:44:17 - 3:44:20)
The other thing I want to say, Doug,

[Speaker 10] (3:44:20 - 3:44:23)
the other issue is the select board is paralyzed,

[Speaker 10] (3:44:23 - 3:44:33)
and it's evident to the town and will be evident to the town meeting that the select board is paralyzed from making a decision because it's pursuing the possible acquisition of another lot.

[Speaker 10] (3:44:34 - 3:44:36)
And until, and until

[Speaker 1] (3:44:36 - 3:44:36)
Yeah,

[Speaker 10] (3:44:36 - 3:44:36)
this,

[Speaker 1] (3:44:36 - 3:44:36)
it's not paralyzed.

[Speaker 9] (3:44:36 - 3:44:37)
no we're

[Speaker 5] (3:44:37 - 3:44:37)
Brian,

[Speaker 9] (3:44:37 - 3:44:37)
not we're not paralyzed

[Speaker 7] (3:44:37 - 3:44:37)
this is

[Speaker 9] (3:44:37 - 3:44:38)
right now

[Speaker 7] (3:44:38 - 3:44:38)
insane we're like

[Speaker 9] (3:44:38 - 3:44:38)
not paralyzed

[Speaker 7] (3:44:38 - 3:44:39)
let's just

[Speaker 9] (3:44:39 - 3:44:39)
at

[Speaker 5] (3:44:39 - 3:44:39)
just,

[Speaker 9] (3:44:39 - 3:44:39)
all

[Speaker 10] (3:44:39 - 3:44:39)
what,

[Speaker 5] (3:44:39 - 3:44:40)
Brian, okay,

[Speaker 5] (3:44:40 - 3:44:41)
okay, please,

[Speaker 5] (3:44:41 - 3:44:41)
Brian.

[Speaker 5] (3:44:41 - 3:44:44)
Let it, let's stick to commentary on Article 10.

[Speaker 9] (3:44:44 - 3:44:44)
I I'd like

[Speaker 5] (3:44:44 - 3:44:44)
We

[Speaker 9] (3:44:44 - 3:44:45)
to make

[Speaker 5] (3:44:45 - 3:44:45)
appreciate

[Speaker 9] (3:44:45 - 3:44:45)
a motion

[Speaker 5] (3:44:45 - 3:44:45)
your

[Speaker 9] (3:44:45 - 3:44:45)
to approve

[Speaker 5] (3:44:45 - 3:44:46)
comments.

[Speaker 9] (3:44:46 - 3:44:46)
article

[Speaker 10] (3:44:46 - 3:44:47)
No, this relates to Article 10.

[Speaker 9] (3:44:47 - 3:44:47)
second

[Speaker 10] (3:44:47 - 3:44:49)
You're trying to decide what to do.

[Speaker 5] (3:44:49 - 3:44:53)
There is a motion on the floor. The motion has been seconded.

[Speaker 5] (3:44:54 - 3:44:57)
So is it, is the article as it stands?

[Speaker 9] (3:44:57 - 3:44:58)
as it stands I

[Speaker 5] (3:44:58 - 3:44:58)
Okay.

[Speaker 9] (3:44:58 - 3:45:00)
make a motion to approve article 10 as

[Speaker 10] (3:45:00 - 3:45:00)
It's

[Speaker 9] (3:45:00 - 3:45:00)
it stands

[Speaker 10] (3:45:00 - 3:45:01)
already adhered.

[Speaker 5] (3:45:02 - 3:45:03)
It's your second?

[Speaker 7] (3:45:04 - 3:45:05)
It's my second.

[Speaker 5] (3:45:05 - 3:45:05)
Okay.

[Speaker 5] (3:45:06 - 3:45:06)
Doug?

[Speaker 1] (3:45:08 - 3:45:08)
Um

[Speaker 7] (3:45:08 - 3:45:13)
You know, hold on. We could also, we can discuss it. We can

[Speaker 5] (3:45:13 - 3:45:13)
Yeah, wait.

[Speaker 7] (3:45:13 - 3:45:18)
we could also wait and vote on the,

[Speaker 7] (3:45:18 - 3:45:20)
all we're talking about is two

[Speaker 5] (3:45:20 - 3:45:20)
The difference or between

[Speaker 7] (3:45:20 - 3:45:20)
three.

[Speaker 5] (3:45:20 - 3:45:20)
two and

[Speaker 7] (3:45:20 - 3:45:22)
That's all we're talking about. And

[Speaker 1] (3:45:22 - 3:45:22)
Right.

[Speaker 7] (3:45:22 - 3:45:25)
if we want to think about a little bit more, we could make this decision.

[Speaker 7] (3:45:26 - 3:45:27)
Um, on the first.

[Speaker 9] (3:45:27 - 3:45:29)
This is just giving us the flexibility

[Speaker 7] (3:45:29 - 3:45:29)
Right.

[Speaker 9] (3:45:29 - 3:45:29)
to

[Speaker 1] (3:45:29 - 3:45:30)
That's right.

[Speaker 9] (3:45:30 - 3:45:39)
exercise that, right? And that is the key. We're not, we're not, this motion I just made is not saying let's vote to have a three year lease of this piece, of this parcel.

[Speaker 7] (3:45:39 - 3:45:39)
Right.

[Speaker 9] (3:45:39 - 3:45:45)
This gives us the flexibility to extend up to three years, right? It could end up being two,

[Speaker 9] (3:45:45 - 3:45:48)
it could end up being two and a half, it could end up being nothing if we get

[Speaker 7] (3:45:48 - 3:45:48)
Right,

[Speaker 9] (3:45:48 - 3:45:48)
a

[Speaker 7] (3:45:48 - 3:45:49)
nobody

[Speaker 9] (3:45:49 - 3:45:49)
zero

[Speaker 7] (3:45:49 - 3:45:49)
here either.

[Speaker 9] (3:45:49 - 3:45:54)
response or zero response that would be valuable and revenue producing to this town.

[Speaker 9] (3:45:54 - 3:45:54)
Right?

[Speaker 9] (3:45:55 - 3:46:03)
But we are never going to know that until we take a step and to Brian's point, not be paralysed by this any longer. We need to act. It is on this board

[Speaker 7] (3:46:03 - 3:46:04)
So you have to

[Speaker 9] (3:46:04 - 3:46:04)
to

[Speaker 7] (3:46:04 - 3:46:04)
do that.

[Speaker 9] (3:46:04 - 3:46:10)
do that, right? We're in these seats for a reason. And the time has come for us to actually do something. That's my feeling.

[Speaker 5] (3:46:11 - 3:46:11)
Okay.

[Speaker 1] (3:46:12 - 3:46:17)
So the only equivalent I have at that, of course, is that I would much prefer to be 5-0 as well.

[Speaker 9] (3:46:17 - 3:46:17)
I agree

[Speaker 1] (3:46:17 - 3:46:17)
And

[Speaker 9] (3:46:17 - 3:46:18)
with you.

[Speaker 1] (3:46:18 - 3:46:18)
so could

[Speaker 9] (3:46:18 - 3:46:18)
I agree.

[Speaker 1] (3:46:18 - 3:46:23)
we haggle to two and a half, David?

[Speaker 9] (3:46:23 - 3:46:24)
Two and a half.

[Speaker 4] (3:46:25 - 3:46:28)
So we're haggling to go to June of 20,

[Speaker 4] (3:46:28 - 3:46:29)
June 30th, 28.

[Speaker 9] (3:46:32 - 3:46:33)
We could

[Speaker 10] (3:46:33 - 3:46:33)
You

[Speaker 9] (3:46:33 - 3:46:38)
even do two years from the date of the acceptance of the R_F_P_ right or the awardo of the awarding

[Speaker 1] (3:46:38 - 3:46:39)
You have to be more

[Speaker 9] (3:46:39 - 3:46:39)
of the

[Speaker 1] (3:46:39 - 3:46:40)
comfortable with knowing what

[Speaker 4] (3:46:40 - 3:46:40)
With

[Speaker 1] (3:46:40 - 3:46:40)
that

[Speaker 4] (3:46:40 - 3:46:40)
a

[Speaker 1] (3:46:40 - 3:46:40)
data

[Speaker 4] (3:46:40 - 3:46:41)
with a date with a date

[Speaker 10] (3:46:41 - 3:46:41)
Okay.

[Speaker 4] (3:46:41 - 3:46:42)
definitive.

[Speaker 5] (3:46:42 - 3:46:42)
w yeah, I

[Speaker 9] (3:46:42 - 3:46:42)
you

[Speaker 5] (3:46:42 - 3:46:42)
think

[Speaker 9] (3:46:42 - 3:46:42)
know

[Speaker 5] (3:46:42 - 3:46:43)
so.

[Speaker 9] (3:46:43 - 3:46:44)
if that makes

[Speaker 5] (3:46:44 - 3:46:45)
I I thought about that

[Speaker 4] (3:46:45 - 3:46:45)
I

[Speaker 5] (3:46:45 - 3:46:45)
also

[Speaker 4] (3:46:45 - 3:46:45)
understand that,

[Speaker 5] (3:46:45 - 3:46:45)
because

[Speaker 4] (3:46:45 - 3:46:45)
but uh

[Speaker 5] (3:46:45 - 3:46:48)
I was like well the lease could be for two years from the

[Speaker 9] (3:46:48 - 3:46:48)
date right

[Speaker 5] (3:46:48 - 3:46:52)
of the acceptance, but it is more clear to town meeting to work in definites.

[Speaker 4] (3:46:52 - 3:46:58)
And if we're trying to do and if we're trying to make sure a building is heated, it makes it makes sense for the term to end in the summer.

[Speaker 4] (3:46:58 - 3:46:59)
works rather than

[Speaker 9] (3:46:59 - 3:46:59)
Right,

[Speaker 4] (3:46:59 - 3:46:59)
a

[Speaker 7] (3:46:59 - 3:46:59)
Right.

[Speaker 9] (3:46:59 - 3:47:00)
before the beginning

[Speaker 4] (3:47:00 - 3:47:00)
seven

[Speaker 9] (3:47:00 - 3:47:01)
of the fiscal year,

[Speaker 4] (3:47:01 - 3:47:01)
-month

[Speaker 5] (3:47:01 - 3:47:01)
Execute

[Speaker 9] (3:47:01 - 3:47:01)
right?

[Speaker 9] (3:47:01 - 3:47:01)
So in June,

[Speaker 5] (3:47:01 - 3:47:02)
at the end of the fiscal year.

[Speaker 9] (3:47:02 - 3:47:03)
yeah.

[Speaker 4] (3:47:03 - 3:47:03)
That's

[Speaker 9] (3:47:03 - 3:47:03)
And

[Speaker 1] (3:47:03 - 3:47:03)
Brilliant,

[Speaker 4] (3:47:03 - 3:47:03)
perfect.

[Speaker 9] (3:47:03 - 3:47:04)
keeping

[Speaker 1] (3:47:04 - 3:47:04)
brilliant,

[Speaker 9] (3:47:04 - 3:47:04)
the pressure

[Speaker 1] (3:47:04 - 3:47:05)
June 28.

[Speaker 9] (3:47:05 - 3:47:07)
on us to get this

[Speaker 5] (3:47:07 - 3:47:07)
June

[Speaker 9] (3:47:07 - 3:47:07)
done, right?

[Speaker 5] (3:47:07 - 3:47:12)
30th of 28th. Okay, so that is the friendly amendment.

[Speaker 9] (3:47:13 - 3:47:13)
Yes.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:14 - 3:47:14)
Okay,

[Speaker 9] (3:47:14 - 3:47:20)
I will adjust or I will second that friendly amendment by Doug, whichever you prefer.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:20 - 3:47:21)
so Doug made a friendly amendment.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:22 - 3:47:22)
We'll...

[Speaker 9] (3:47:22 - 3:47:22)
Second.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:22 - 3:47:23)
Okay,

[Speaker 5] (3:47:23 - 3:47:27)
so now we are voting on the article with a June 30th 2028 date.

[Speaker 9] (3:47:28 - 3:47:29)
Aye.

[Speaker 1] (3:47:29 - 3:47:29)
Aye.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:30 - 3:47:30)
Danielle.

[Speaker 9] (3:47:30 - 3:47:31)
Aye.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:32 - 3:47:32)
David.

[Speaker 4] (3:47:32 - 3:47:35)
I'm still not 100% comfortable.

[Speaker 4] (3:47:35 - 3:47:37)
I will asterisk my vote.

[Speaker 4] (3:47:38 - 3:47:41)
It's better than December 31 of 28,

[Speaker 4] (3:47:41 - 3:47:45)
but I think it's important that we're united.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:45 - 3:47:46)
You're an eye with an asterisk?

[Speaker 4] (3:47:46 - 3:47:47)
I'm an eye with an asterisk.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:47 - 3:47:47)
Okay.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:48 - 3:47:48)
I'm an eye.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:50 - 3:47:52)
Well, the asterisk will not appear in the warrant,

[Speaker 5] (3:47:52 - 3:47:52)
David.

[Speaker 9] (3:47:53 - 3:47:54)
Duly noted.

[Speaker 4] (3:47:54 - 3:47:54)
It can

[Speaker 9] (3:47:54 - 3:47:54)
Duly

[Speaker 4] (3:47:54 - 3:47:55)
appear on

[Speaker 9] (3:47:55 - 3:47:55)
noted.

[Speaker 4] (3:47:55 - 3:47:55)
the PowerPoint.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:55 - 3:47:56)
Sure,

[Speaker 9] (3:47:56 - 3:47:56)
Duly

[Speaker 5] (3:47:56 - 3:47:56)
okay.

[Speaker 9] (3:47:56 - 3:47:56)
noted.

[Speaker 5] (3:47:57 - 3:47:59)
Um alright. So

[Speaker 5] (3:48:01 - 3:48:08)
that ends that. Let's move on to the consent agenda.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:12 - 3:48:24)
the consent agenda is a one-day liquor license for the senior center here come the holidays wine tasting and meeting minutes from 11 5 to 11 and 11 10.

[Speaker 2] (3:48:24 - 3:48:25)
Motion to approve consent agenda.

[Speaker 3] (3:48:25 - 3:48:26)
Second.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:27 - 3:48:28)
Doug

[Speaker 4] (3:48:28 - 3:48:29)
Hi.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:29 - 3:48:29)
Mary Ellen.

[Speaker 2] (3:48:30 - 3:48:30)
Aye.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:30 - 3:48:30)
Danielle.

[Speaker 2] (3:48:30 - 3:48:31)
Aye.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:31 - 3:48:31)
David.

[Speaker 4] (3:48:32 - 3:48:32)
Aye.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:32 - 3:48:35)
And I am an aye. Okay, moving on to select board time.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:35 - 3:48:36)
Anybody?

[Speaker 1] (3:48:37 - 3:48:38)
Or then we like

[Speaker 5] (3:48:38 - 3:48:39)
I just have one thing.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:39 - 3:48:39)
You may, Nick.

[Speaker 5] (3:48:39 - 3:48:46)
The folks that put together the Veterans Day event that I failed to mention when I mentioned the breakfast and not the event that happened after,

[Speaker 1] (3:48:46 - 3:48:46)
Yep.

[Speaker 5] (3:48:46 - 3:48:48)
it was a fantastic event,

[Speaker 1] (3:48:48 - 3:48:48)
Like

[Speaker 5] (3:48:48 - 3:48:48)
I think,

[Speaker 1] (3:48:48 - 3:48:48)
the popes.

[Speaker 5] (3:48:48 - 3:48:51)
and it was yeah, at at time and

[Speaker 6] (3:48:51 - 3:48:51)
At

[Speaker 1] (3:48:51 - 3:48:51)
Oh, at Town

[Speaker 5] (3:48:51 - 3:48:51)
monument

[Speaker 1] (3:48:51 - 3:48:52)
Hall.

[Speaker 5] (3:48:52 - 3:48:52)
at

[Speaker 1] (3:48:52 - 3:48:52)
I'm

[Speaker 5] (3:48:52 - 3:48:52)
monument

[Speaker 1] (3:48:52 - 3:48:52)
sorry.

[Speaker 5] (3:48:52 - 3:48:52)
up.

[Speaker 1] (3:48:52 - 3:48:53)
I'm on the monument.

[Speaker 5] (3:48:53 - 3:49:03)
At monument up, like I forgot it, Mike, the team, our our guests, it was a fantastic event. I don't know why I stopped at breakfast and I just wanted to make sure that I thank them for the

[Speaker 5] (3:49:03 - 3:49:08)
uh the event that followed as well as as well as the collation afterwards, yes. Sorry to interrupt.

[Speaker 1] (3:49:08 - 3:49:12)
That's okay. Here, you're not interrupting. Alright, does anybody have any additional comments?

[Speaker 2] (3:49:13 - 3:49:26)
I do. I just uh once again I wanna thank Nate Beishline and Nathan Kent for bringing us uh our meeting tonight. I also wanna thank the DPW for hanging up the banners in the rain.

[Speaker 2] (3:49:26 - 3:49:38)
The day before, um I wanna bring everybody up to date, Solid Waste Committee uh is working hard at um making sure we had a successful pumpkin toss.

[Speaker 7] (3:49:38 - 3:49:38)
Mm.

[Speaker 2] (3:49:38 - 3:49:53)
Because a lot of pumpkins were taken out of our waste stream. Um and uh Stephanie Newman actually was able to get a farm to take it for free, saving us over five hundred dollars from the year before. So

[Speaker 2] (3:49:53 - 3:50:16)
What's one thing that's really important from solid waste is the um the urgency of working together with the R_F_P_ and getting an R_F_P_ ready for, you know, one of the largest expenses we have in in our account. The council on not the council but um the swampscott for all ages is finishing up their A_A_R_P_ um

[Speaker 2] (3:50:16 - 3:50:29)
audit that they had to do they were almost finished with that they also at their last meeting they they talked about some issues that they have with not having benches at bus stops bus stops are not regulated by the town they're regulated by mass

[Speaker 2] (3:50:30 - 3:50:36)
transportation. So we've got to reach out to Jenny Ormini to try to help get some something in there.

[Speaker 2] (3:50:36 - 3:50:43)
We still have an issue with the retirement on the issue on the coding, but you already have that information.

[Speaker 2] (3:50:44 - 3:50:48)
I just want also recognize that we have a bill

[Speaker 2] (3:50:49 - 3:50:56)
D'Andrea was recognized by the he was honored by the Lynn Veterans Council.

[Speaker 2] (3:50:56 - 3:50:57)
Mr.

[Speaker 2] (3:50:57 - 3:51:06)
D'Andrea is a gentleman who does enormous amount of work for veterans and he is he he does not release press releases.

[Speaker 2] (3:51:06 - 3:51:13)
He does the work and he's he's an amazing man and he was on the cover of the Lynn item yesterday which

[Speaker 8] (3:51:13 - 3:51:14)
I saw that.

[Speaker 2] (3:51:14 - 3:51:14)
is what

[Speaker 2] (3:51:14 - 3:51:41)
was pretty exciting. So um and then in closing I would like to have to this added to this agenda the sub the um water and sewer commission. I feel very strongly that Andrea Moore and um Mister there is another gentleman I can't read my handwriting here that was put up for a nomination. I would like to get some something going on this. This is I I

[Speaker 2] (3:51:41 - 3:51:50)
I'm uncomfortable with what's happening, that people aren't being put on this committee and I I'd like it on our next agenda. Not the agenda prior to

[Speaker 1] (3:51:50 - 3:51:51)
Not

[Speaker 2] (3:51:51 - 3:51:51)
the town

[Speaker 1] (3:51:51 - 3:51:51)
the first

[Speaker 2] (3:51:51 - 3:51:51)
meeting,

[Speaker 1] (3:51:51 - 3:51:51)
or third.

[Speaker 2] (3:51:51 - 3:51:53)
but the third.

[Speaker 2] (3:51:55 - 3:51:57)
And that's all I have for tonight.

[Speaker 1] (3:51:57 - 3:51:58)
Doug, you had something?

[Speaker 5] (3:52:01 - 3:52:01)
I do.

[Speaker 5] (3:52:02 - 3:52:02)
A couple of things.

[Speaker 5] (3:52:03 - 3:52:05)
One, just a little CPA update.

[Speaker 5] (3:52:05 - 3:52:20)
CPA committee is being seated December 12th, December 10th. Again, thanks hugely to Diane and the coalition will be supporting it, the statewide coalition, etc.

[Speaker 5] (3:52:21 - 3:52:26)
And the other thing is I'm not sure if it was distributed to everyone,

[Speaker 5] (3:52:26 - 3:52:26)
but...

[Speaker 9] (3:52:27 - 3:52:48)
Kleinfelders work on the coastline is moving along and I think they're probably you know like close to final draft some very very interesting thought-provoking etc ideas and so I don't know if Marcy's in the room but

[Speaker 1] (3:52:48 - 3:52:49)
Just on vacation.

[Speaker 1] (3:52:50 - 3:52:50)
She's on vacation.

[Speaker 10] (3:52:50 - 3:52:51)
She's on vacation,

[Speaker 10] (3:52:51 - 3:52:51)
Doug.

[Speaker 9] (3:52:52 - 3:53:04)
Yeah, so we should, Nick, if you can make sure that we've got that raised up for presentation here as soon as appropriate.

[Speaker 5] (3:53:06 - 3:53:06)
Will do.

[Speaker 1] (3:53:08 - 3:53:08)
Really.

[Speaker 5] (3:53:08 - 3:53:09)
Will do.

[Speaker 1] (3:53:09 - 3:53:10)
That is very loud.

[Speaker 2] (3:53:11 - 3:53:12)
That's terrible.

[Speaker 1] (3:53:13 - 3:53:14)
Danielle David.

[Speaker 2] (3:53:15 - 3:53:18)
No, I just want to thank Wayne Spritz for the pumpkin toss.

[Speaker 2] (3:53:18 - 3:53:24)
I tossed a lot of pumpkins myself that day and it was great. There were a lot of people there. It was really well done.

[Speaker 11] (3:53:24 - 3:53:26)
Did you break that that

[Speaker 2] (3:53:26 - 3:53:27)
You mean when they broke the pipe?

[Speaker 11] (3:53:27 - 3:53:29)
I didn't break it, no,

[Speaker 11] (3:53:29 - 3:53:31)
but, you know, I'm not very good with my aim.

[Speaker 11] (3:53:31 - 3:53:32)
I'm not an athlete,

[Speaker 11] (3:53:32 - 3:53:33)
but I did.

[Speaker 11] (3:53:34 - 3:53:34)
I'll train

[Speaker 1] (3:53:34 - 3:53:35)
You know, I bet

[Speaker 11] (3:53:35 - 3:53:37)
for next year to see if I can do better.

[Speaker 11] (3:53:37 - 3:53:43)
But thank you to Wayne because he really did make it fun for the kids and really put a lot of time in. It was a big accomplishment.

[Speaker 11] (3:53:43 - 3:53:50)
And I just, I'm really proud of this board tonight for coming together and making the right call on this Hawthorne thing.

[Speaker 11] (3:53:50 - 3:53:53)
It is a big issue in town. It's important to a lot of people.

[Speaker 11] (3:53:53 - 3:54:10)
And I mean, I have noticed that past two weeks that parking lot was full, that restaurant was full and it means a lot to a lot of people. I don't think it's quite that easy for us to just say tear it down and start anew. So I think that we're being thoughtful and that's what we're here to do. So proud of us all for that.

[Speaker 11] (3:54:12 - 3:54:12)
That's it.

[Speaker 1] (3:54:13 - 3:54:13)
David?

[Speaker 12] (3:54:14 - 3:54:15)
No, I just

[Speaker 1] (3:54:15 - 3:54:15)
Some

[Speaker 12] (3:54:15 - 3:54:15)
Nick

[Speaker 1] (3:54:15 - 3:54:16)
vacation pictures?

[Speaker 12] (3:54:16 - 3:54:17)
Nick what's that?

[Speaker 1] (3:54:17 - 3:54:18)
Have vacation pictures?

[Speaker 12] (3:54:18 - 3:54:21)
No, not today. Not today. I'll share those uh at another time.

[Speaker 12] (3:54:23 - 3:54:23)
So, thanks.

[Speaker 1] (3:54:24 - 3:54:33)
Um two things really quick if you didn't toss your pumpkins because you keep them through Thanksgiving you can recycle them through the black

[Speaker 1] (3:54:34 - 3:54:35)
What is it? Black Earth composting

[Speaker 11] (3:54:35 - 3:54:36)
They are probably there

[Speaker 1] (3:54:36 - 3:54:36)
at the,

[Speaker 11] (3:54:36 - 3:54:37)
by

[Speaker 1] (3:54:37 - 3:54:37)
behind

[Speaker 11] (3:54:37 - 3:54:37)
now.

[Speaker 1] (3:54:37 - 3:54:40)
the cemetery or at the police station.

[Speaker 1] (3:54:40 - 3:54:43)
So don't put them in your trash, please.

[Speaker 11] (3:54:45 - 3:54:45)
Stinky.

[Speaker 1] (3:54:45 - 3:54:51)
And then I was informed today that the governor signed S23,

[Speaker 1] (3:54:51 - 3:54:55)
which is an act authorizing the appointment of our alternate members to the Conservation Commission,

[Speaker 1] (3:54:55 - 3:54:57)
which was something that we were waiting,

[Speaker 1] (3:54:57 - 3:55:02)
we've passed through town meeting and we were waiting for confirmation from the governor. So.

[Speaker 1] (3:55:02 - 3:55:08)
So they'll mobilize to make sure that we now have alternates and they have been informed.

[Speaker 1] (3:55:08 - 3:55:12)
So thank you Jenny, Mark Armini's team for keeping us in the loop.

[Speaker 1] (3:55:13 - 3:55:14)
And that's all I have.

[Speaker 11] (3:55:14 - 3:55:15)
Motion to adjourn.

[Speaker 12] (3:55:16 - 3:55:16)
Second.

[Speaker 1] (3:55:17 - 3:55:17)
Done.

[Speaker 11] (3:55:17 - 3:55:17)
Aye.

[Speaker 11] (3:55:17 - 3:55:18)
Aye.

[Speaker 12] (3:55:19 - 3:55:19)
So moved.

[Speaker 9] (3:55:19 - 3:55:20)
Hi.

[Speaker 1] (3:55:20 - 3:55:23)
David. I'm also an eye. Thank you everyone.